Police: Gun accidentlly fired

[Mr.510]

Exactly. We don't know if the first round is the one that hit his wife though. Dumb luck could be that setting it down in violation of Rule #2 prevented someone else from being fatally shot. While this is an incredibly rare malfunction this story still scares the crap out of me!

 

[azyogi]

Is this a flaw in the inertial firing pin design?

 

[triggerman770]

"Sounds like the sear failed, was worn out, or was just plain defective. Maybe the "thump" of setting the gun down dropped the hammer the first time and then it went full auto? I can visualize the gun spinning around like a pinwheel spewing rounds as it dumped the magazine" if I recall the jennings line are strikerfired and would mostlikely go backwards from the recoil sounds like a bunch of cya

 

[iiibdsiil]

Anyone else halfway impressed that the article isn't completely anti-gun?

 

[CapnMac]

For 2¢ I would not be surprised if this had been set donw after "it won't go off" or words to similar effect, then a hand reached in in both directions getting a tug-o-war going that got a thumb or other stray booger-hook on the bang switch.

Seen dumber at public ranges

 

[notbubba]

I don't know what happend, but I looked at the range on MSN maps bird's eye view.
Looks like a dang nice range.

 

[Davek1977]

Anyone else halfway impressed that the article isn't completely anti-gun?

Well, that depends on your outlook. While there wasn't an obvious anti-gun bias in the article, there really didn't NEED to be one. I'm sure plenty of non-shooters/antis heard all they needed to hear to know they were "right" about guns when they read a report about one randomly shooting 3 people, appearently of its own accord. The author doesn't NEED to say guns are evil, unsafe, etc when the article seems to say all that just fine relaying the story as it supoosedly happened.

For 2¢ I would not be surprised if this had been set donw after "it won't go off" or words to similar effect, then a hand reached in in both directions getting a tug-o-war going that got a thumb or other stray booger-hook on the bang switch.

No offense, but I've yet to read anything indicating that or anything else happened other than what was reported. Anything "could" have happened, so why speculate as to the possibilites? If youn weren't there, chances are you'll NEVER know what happened.

 

[lobo9er]

didn't this happen with an ar couple years ago too?

 

[R&JBene]

Ok all you presumptive mooks who arbitrarily assume that it was operator stupidity,listen up.You are wrong. I know both of these people very well and I was told exactly what happened. The mag was loaded and inserted, the slide was released. when the pistol was placed one the table POINTED DOWNRANGE, without the trigger being touched it went off repeatedly spinning around firing one round after another. Do not assume that someone was a dumbass and wasn’t following proper safety procedures if you don’t know the whole story. Have you ever been hurt by anything? Would it be correct to assume that you got hurt because you probably not doing what you were supposed to be doing? There are other reports of the Jennings nine having this type of malfunction.
http://www.firearmsid.com/Recalls/FA_Recalls 2.htm
The Ledger either has bad info from the cops,or are just making **** up.
I expected better from members of a forum called the "highroad".
I await your apologies.

 

[ilbob]

at the range I do most of my shooting at there is a chunk of steel plate between each shooting stall.

always preferred it that way.

 

[Teufelhunden]

Bryco/Jennings went T/U as the result of a lawsuit filed on behalf of a kid who was paralyzed when he was accidentally shot by his 12 year old babysitter, who was attempting to unload a Bryco .380.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bryco_Arms/Jennings_Firearms/Jimenez_Arms

Not sure how any of that, while tragic, is Bryco's fault. Kid pulls the trigger on a gun and it goes bang...that's CA for you I suppose.

As regards this incident, I have full faith that a Jennings could malfunction in exactly the described way. About the only thing I can question is why they were setting a loaded gun down instead of leaving it empty while taking a break from shooting.

 

[blutarsky]

About the only thing I can question is why they were setting a loaded gun down instead of leaving it empty while taking a break from shooting.

could be that someone loaded the gun and set it down on the bench for the other to pick up and shoot. i don't like handing someone a loaded gun. having multiple people handling a gun at the same time that's ready to shoot is opening possibility for too many potential mistakes.

typically i might load someone's magazines for them, and let them complete loading the gun and making ready to fire -- however, if someone doesn't have strength, for example, to pull the slide back then they might need help. i think i'd be more comfortable doing that and setting it down on the bench (pointing down range) and have them pick it up and proceed, rather than passing from hand to hand.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

Ok all you presumptive mooks who arbitrarily assume that it was operator stupidity,listen up.You are wrong. I know both of these people very well and I was told exactly what happened.

Of course they told you that.

The mag was loaded and inserted, the slide was released. when the pistol was placed one the table POINTED DOWNRANGE, without the trigger being touched it went off repeatedly spinning around firing one round after another.

And this is where the story is really weird as it is a type of very rare combination of malfunctions.

Do not assume that someone was a dumbass and wasn’t following proper safety procedures if you don’t know the whole story.

Now would we know we don't have the whole story? It was reported that the gun was handled unsafely.

There are other reports of the Jennings nine having this type of malfunction.
http://www.firearmsid.com/Recalls/FA_Recalls 2.htm

So your friends experienced this event (from the link you provided)?

During the testing of a Bryco Arms, Jennings Nine pistol by a forensic firearms examiner it was noted that it would fire upon release of the thumb safety and spontaneously fire in a FULL AUTO MODE on an inconsistent bases. When loaded with the manual thumb safety in the “safe” position, if the trigger of the submitted firearm has been pulled stiffly a few times, the firearm will discharge when the thumb safety is moved to the “fire” position.

So why were your friends playing with the controls while the gun was laying on the table? That does seem rather inappropriate.

The Ledger either has bad info from the cops,or are just making **** up.
I expected better from members of a forum called the "highroad".
I await your apologies.

Generally, folks don't apologize when they are called derogatory names, nor should they.

Just curious, given the problems with the Jennings, why would your safety-conscious friends even have one?

 

[JohnKSa]

Ok all you presumptive mooks who arbitrarily assume that it was operator stupidity,listen up.

I believe a gun could go off from being set down although it is unlikely. The type/quality of pistol in this incident makes it a bit more likely in my opinion.

The idea that the gun could spin in circles while shooting without any outside input is much harder to believe. Autopistols typically don't operate without some sort of outside resistance to recoil being provided by the shooter's hands. In fact, many very good quality autopistols will fail to operate properly if the shooter doesn't maintain a firm grip.

The story, as told, would have us believe that a notoriously unreliable, low-quality firearm functioned 100% without anyone holding onto it at all while it was spinning around on a table. I'm not willing to say that's completely impossible, but I can tell you that I would operate under the assumption that a person telling me a story like that was lying until they could produce some hard evidence to the contrary. Hard evidence like unedited video or eyewitness accounts from several uninvolved parties who all clearly saw the pistol spinning and discharging.

 

[runner6m]

Sear sheared off? Firing pun stuck forward?

I had a Bryco Jennings 9mm back in the day when I was largely gun ignorant. The first time I fired it, it fell apart on the 8th or 9th round. The magazine fell out followed by an assortment of other parts. The firing pin was stuck forward, the trigger stuck back, and the slide wouldn't rack.

I only waited three weeks before shooting it, and by then the pawn shop I purchased it at (new in box) had closed down, and Jennings wouldn't answer the phone and went bankrupt not too long later. :banghead:

Tough lesson learned.

 

[Dannix]

didn't this happen with an ar couple years ago too?

iirc yes, and he got slammed with an unlicensed FA charge I heard.

 

[unloved]

I can visualize the gun spinning around like a pinwheel spewing rounds as it dumped the magazine.

I can't. I don't have any problem believing that a Jennings could do a runaway mag dump, but I've seen people have problems (FTF and FTE) with quality pistols due to limpwristing. I just can't see a Jennings cycling flawlessly "at least three times" without being securely held somehow. I don't think the slide would even travel far enough to extract the empty after one round.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

The gun can go full auto as noted in the quote I provided in post #38 from http://www.firearmsid.com/Recalls/FA_Recalls 2.htm

However, that requires the controls to be operated and the gun being held to work.

 

[Mr.510]

I've never fired a Jennings. In fact I don't think I've ever seen one. I do have experience with a handgun that apparently cannot be limp wristed: My XD45C. I can hold it loosely with just my thumb and middle finger and it functions flawlessly. I've loaded it with a single round and held it so loosely I nearly dropped it in recoil and the slide still locked back on the empty mag. I'm confident that if it's sear sheared it would do exactly what this Jennings is said to have done. Stranger things have happened.....

R&JBene: We hope your friends are doing well and that everybody heals up quickly. They are in our thoughts and prayers.
Mr. & Mrs. 510

 

[DHJenkins]

Jennings are sub $100 throw-away guns. In fact, in order for them to feed "reliably", they often have to be held sideways or even closer to upside down due to the weak mag springs (ever wonder why early gang-bangers held their guns the way they did?).

I bought one once for $40 about 15 years ago. It felt more like a toy than an actual toy gun, so tossed it.

 

[doorman]

One of the indoor ranges I go to has concrete partitions between stations which gives me some comfort. I still see lack of muzzle/trigger discipline. Which indicates lack of experience and/or training.

 

[Warhawk83]

The range I go to is a stickler for the rules, they'll flat out tell a moron to leave. Now,if you're new they'll teach you ,but if you have a blatant disregard you can hit the road. It's an outdoor range run by the sheriff's department, very little partition between stalls.They also have a habit of sticking you right next to someone, no fun being repeatedly hit upside the head with .45 acp casings while you're trying to aim.

 

[B yond]

Jennings, Davis, Cobra, Lorcin, Jimenez, Wilkinson, Raven, Hi-Point, Stallard, RG, etc., etc.

What can I say, except that a fool and his money are soon parted.

Hey, my Hi-Point has never gone full auto....or jammed....or failed to feed....or had a light strike....or any other problems for that matter....

I must've gotten a defective one.

 

[Guns and more]

Flynn was visiting from Ireland

He'll have a good story to tell. Survived the IRA and shot in America.

Jennings 9 mm handgun the Thourots were using

Why would anyone take a Jennings to a range? To wear it out?
I thought it was just Gang Banger material. Hmmm......No, the owner was 47 yrs old.

 

[KBintheSLC]

The article makes it sound like the gun just fired itself. Forgive me if I am mistaken, but in my 25 years of shooting, I have never seen a gun fire itself... even a junk gun like a Jennings or a Lorcin. Generally, firing a gun requires input from an outside force.

Hey, my Hi-Point has never gone full auto....or jammed....or failed to feed....or had a light strike....or any other problems for that matter....

I must've gotten a defective one.

Hi-Point is a much higher class of junk guns.