Posting questions on THR-H&R.

[snuffy]

There should be some guidelines for asking loading questions here on THR, handloading and reloading. Many times, I see questions asked about problems loading something, without any specifics. There should be as much information included that the person asking has at his/her disposal.

Make and model of the firearm in question.

Caliber, gauge, whether it's a rifle, handgun, or shotgun.

Be specific about the problem. Cartridge won't chamber is fine, but what are you doing wrong? An exact description of your loading process should be included. That gives the more experienced loaders here something to go on to begin to answer your question.

A lot of bandwidth is wasted trying to draw info out of a beginning reloader so we can start to get to the bottom of a problem.

Don't use acronyms, spell it out. If you're asking a question, take the time to use whole words. FTE could be Failure To Extract, or it could be Failure To Eject. FTF could be Failure To Feed Or it could be Failure To Fire.

Correct terminology is essential. A bullet means one thing, the projectile. It's not a bullet tip or a point. A Slug is a bug, not a bullet. Unless you're talking about a shotgun, see how confusing it can get?

 

[GaryL]

Along those lines, how nice would it be to have a sticky with references to commonly asked questions and answers? We have something like that with the Lee FCD sticky, but rather than a full thread on 1 subject, it would be more like a number of topics where one person takes a topic, like "how to deal with brand XYZ hangup" or "what loads for the M1 Garand", etc, and list a bunch of good links dealing with that topic. That way the user could add more links to their post as they come along or are suggested. I realize there is a search function, but it can take some effort to dig through all the hits to find the real gems.

A thought, for what it's worth....

 

[dc.fireman]

I've found the "Search this forum" feature quite handy in the past for finding things. I know sometimes it doesn't cover everything - but it certainly covers quite a bit...

-tc

 

[Randy1911]

Like the dc fireman said, "the search is your friend". Use it, you will be suprised what you get. I have used to look for a question and found a lot more then I needed.

 

[Walkalong]

We do get some difficult to understand questions with minimal clues from time to time.

The more things we know, the easier it is to give an intelligent answer.

Like in Algebra, the more "givens" they give you, the easier it is to solve an equation.

 

[Mal H]

snuffy - that would be a Panglossian world if only ...

When someone does post a question with far less detail than necessary, I usually ask pertinent questions before giving an answer, and the same is true of many of the more seasoned members here. However, what really gets my goat is the member who answers the question without knowing the details (oftentimes they don't even know the caliber in question), and that happens far too often. They mean well, but that well-meaning answer could be a formula for disaster.

I'm not sure which is worse - asking a question with many of the important details missing or answering that type of question.

The bottom line - don't answer an incomplete question here in H&R.

 

[dmazur]

I'm not sure newcomers to reloading would use guidelines for questions. (It appears they can't read the "Stickies", so why would they comply with a request for a question format?)

I like the idea of showing them where the information came from, and encouraging them to learn to use it themselves. While the forums are definitely a resource, I'm not sure I'm comfortable with them being used as a "crutch".

I'd suggest trying to stay within your area of experience, and, as was said, don't answer an incomplete question by filling in the missing data with assumptions.

+1 to the idea of a "FAQ" Sticky, perhaps consisting of valid links to good answers. This would be far less lengthy at the start of the subforum than a Sticky for each question and also quicker for a user to scan, as the questions wouldn't be separated by 10 pages of answers.

 

[Tallinar]

I'm not sure which is worse - asking a question with many of the important details missing or answering that type of question.

I agree with Mal totally.

I also think it's important to keep in mind that part of what makes newbie handloaders newbie handloaders is that they may not know everything that needs to be included in their inquiries. Responding to these folks with some probing questions is part of the teaching process.

You're going to get people of varying degrees of experience here. Often times, a person will not include the pertinent info because they simply don't know what's pertinent. That may be the entire reason for them asking the question to begin with.

I would encourage the more seasoned handloaders to try not to get condescending in their thinking as they read the newbies poorly-detailed inquiries. Either ask probing questions to try to help the OP along, or simply leave the thread alone.

Handloading can be a little intimidating to some people at first. Some people start without a single shred of mechanical aptitude (probably describes me) and kind of need a few key concepts "unlocked" in their heads before they can really get the hang of it. Be patient and try to help 'em along.

 

[snuffy]

I've found the "Search this forum" feature quite handy in the past for finding things. I know sometimes it doesn't cover everything - but it certainly covers quite a bit...

I didn't make the original post for a how-to on finding info. Certainly the search feature is valuable IF you know how to ask the right question.

Like Mal H said, there will be 5-10 answers to a question before we find out all the particulars to the problem. Some fly off the handle and ASSUME they know what he/she is asking, their answers are way off base.

Then there's the new reloader that doesn't know to give every detail of his loading operation. He's unsure of himself and maybe a bit shy. He gets a bunch of answers that have nothing to do with his problem, then somebody finally asks the poster to explain everything. Some times they don't respond at all.

 

[flashhole]

I am willing to help but it is pretty obvious from a lot of noobie posts that they haven't made much of an effort to help themselves prior to asking questions. The consequence of that is I simply don't respond to their post. I think Snuffy makes a good point. There should be some guidelines, everyone would benefit. How often do you read posts and think - I sure hope I don't end up beside that guy at the range?

 

[JimKirk]

I would have to agree with snuffy with the intent of including as much info as possible, but I also understand the lack knowledge that some of the new reloaders have too.

I really enjoy trying to help those who truly come seeking help, but I also detest those who ask for help then turn upon those who try to help.

Nothing ticks me off worse than when you're trying to help, someone comes along and nit picks your comments and turns that thread into a BS thread. That happen to me recently, it just kills a thread and I would think leaves a doubt about how High Road some of the posters are.

TO you new reloaders, Please include all the info possible, it will help us to help you!

Jimmy K

 

[MMCSRET]

A perceived shortage of information is what this forum is all about. Questions posed lead to more questions, lead to partial answers, lead to pointed questions to fill in the missing info in the partial questions and answers. Thats why we are here, to converse with people of like mind but with widely varied knowledge. That's fun!!!!!!!!!! and you can't cover "IT" with a sticky.

 

[Jim Watson]

Of course everybody doing or even plannng handloading should have a manual with load data and basic procedures, the manufacturer's instruction for his equipment, and the free data from powder companies. There are a lot of Internet Inquiries that amount to: "Write me a book."

 

[GaryL]

Perhaps. But there is a lot of information here that will never be found in any reloading manual. It is not possible or practical to cover every variety of powder/bullet combination. Not a one of them gets into one powder being cleaner than another, for example. Another example, they may talk about powder density, and show a compressed load, but this is where I find out some information on which one is likely to fill a case before I go out and buy it. I could go on.

 

[snuffy]

If nothing else comes from this thread, it has generated some thoughts from the "more seasoned" members here on THR.

Will a sticky with guidelines for newbies help? Maybe to some degree, but as pointed out, new posters seldom look at the stickies before jumping in with both feet. Usually with very little info about their question.

This is what I propose. Lets all get busy with suggestions for some real guidelines that COULD perhaps be put into a sticky. I'm a poor writer, so maybe Mal or Johnny could make it understandable, or in proper English.

Then when somebody new to this board and probably new to reloading comes on with minimal info, we could point them to the sticky. Then they could re-post with the info we need to help them out quicker.

I'll start out with my list;

1. Type of firearm, rifle, handgun, shotgun; Because THR has a shotgun forum, maybe that wouldn't be needed here?? As for the rifle listing, is it a bolt action repeater, a semi-auto, or a single shot. As for the handgun listing, is it a revolver, semi-auto, or a single shot.

2. Caliber; IE, bullet diameter. What caliber is the firearm in question supposed to use.

3. Bullet type; Is it jacketed, plated, lead, and if lead is it cast by the poster, or bought from one of the many companies supplying cast bullets? Or is it a swaged lead made by Hornady or one of the others? Another category could be monolithic bullets, meaning "solids, like the Barnes, Nosler, or Hornady's GMX.

4. Powder you intend to use; Pretty simple, what do you have on hand or intend to buy?

5. Primers; A can of worms indeed because of the shortage and the many different types available.

6. Loading tools; What type of press are you using? pretty simple, but yet complicated because of the many types made now and in the past.

That's a start, maybe Mal or Johnny can chime in with "there won't be a sticky", so we'll have to bring this TTT,(To The Top), when a newbie post an open ended question.

Please add in what you think might be some good things to refine questions here on THR.

 

[ReloaderFred]

Sometimes those of us who have been reloading for over 40+ years have problems understanding the newer generation's quest for instant information, since we all had to learn it the hard way, by reading real books, experimenting on our own and trial and error.

There seems to me to be a certain amount of laziness with those who have grown up with computers, cell phones, etc. It used to be considered standard procedure to read instruction manuals and all available information on a subject before delving into the use of new equipment, but nowadays it appears that a lot of people throw away the manuals and just hop on the computer and ask a bunch of total strangers to explain to them what they should be doing and how they should be doing it.

When I see a question from someone who appears to be in this catagory, I normally don't post a reply, since it contributes to the laziness, or whatever one chooses to call it. On the other hand, if someone has displayed that they've really tried to understand a problem and work it out themselves and come to a dead end, then I'm more than willing to offer some advice, based on real experience with the same problem, or a similar one.

What frosts my hide is posters who don't have any actual experience with the problem the original poster asked about, but chimes in with all kinds of "solutions" and links to other posts that don't have anything to do with the question at hand. Sometimes it's just better to post nothing at all, rather than offer superfluous information that is of no use at all, or even worse, sends the person off in the wrong direction.

Those are just some of my thoughts on this subject.

Fred

 

[kelbro]

Starting to sound like some of those 'form' forums.

Fill out this form completely or you won't get an answer.

While I can empathize with the folks that want/need more info, there has to be a better way.

Even worse are forums where 3/4 of the front page are stickies that you have to scroll through on every visit.

Sorry, I know that I am not offering a solution but I like this forum the way that it is.

 

[flashhole]

Fred wrote - "When I see a question from someone who appears to be in this catagory, I normally don't post a reply, since it contributes to the laziness, or whatever one chooses to call it. On the other hand, if someone has displayed that they've really tried to understand a problem and work it out themselves and come to a dead end, then I'm more than willing to offer some advice, based on real experience with the same problem, or a similar one."

My sentiments exactly and I find myself ignoring a lot more posts than I respond to.

 

[Walkalong]

Yep, it is nice to read some effort in the post.

Complete well thought out sentences with proper punctuation are a nice bonus as well. No, I am not the speech police, it just makes it easier to understand and give an intelligent reply.

 

[nitetrane98]

Just as good an idea might be to close the H&R section and make it an archive. As suggested, everything has already been covered and people would not be forced to have to read ill conceived questions that are poorly written. Perhaps a select, annointed few could be given, edit power and all of the wrong opinions could be deleted from the archived answers.

I think the best idea would be to make an "Expert H&R" section where only those who know everything about reloading, punctuate and spell perfectly, and don't wish to be bothered by those that don't can congregate.

IMO some folks take this whole forum stuff WAY to seriously.

 

[flashhole]

98 - I can see your point for activities like baking cookies or knitting but when making potential face grenades I believe a bit of thoughtfulness is in order.

 

[snuffy]

Instructions, "I don't need no damn instructions". My friend billy joe did this once, I know how it works,,,---wait just a dern minute, where does this fit??? I know, I'll ask a one sentence question on the internet!

Instant gratification. I'm one of those that yearns for a faster connection to the internet. Well at least I'd never go back to a dial-up connection.

I'm giving a lot more answers than I am asking questions. But Like Fred said, if the poster asks a complete question, I'll take the time to answer. What frosts my cookie is those that have their mind made up before they ask. They're asking for conformation of their idea, then lash back when you disagree with them.

Another pet peeve, is those that copy and paste their favorite bits from the internet, then give almost no information of their own.

A form forum? Good idea! Maybe that's what I had in mind. Try going to an automotive parts store, saying " I have this chevy that needs a new thermostat. You'll get a blank look from the salesperson. He/she needs to know make, model, engine, whether it has an air conditioner,, ETC. Reloading/handloading is no different. The more information you give, the easier it is to get to a resolution.

 

[jfh]

Speaking as one of those older posters who is willing to help others: one thing I have learned is to NOT respond when other responses may well have the solution at hand, or on its way.

It does seem to me that the THR Reloading Forum does have a really, really, good set of hard-core members who are experienced, reasonably intelligent, and articulate, and appropriate moderation to keep the forum in shape.

There's never been an answer I couldn't find here, save for undocumented data--and that's the way it should be.

Jim H.

 

[flashhole]

My belief is - the internet, while a great source of information, is a strong contributor to the dumbing down of society. Seldom do I find anyone in the younger generation willing to roll up their sleeves and really dig into a problem. For example, most of the young profesionals I work with believe Wikipedia to be the fountain-of-all-knowledge for anything worth knowing in the world today and if it's not there it can't be worthy of pursuit. This is not a slam on anyone, just an observation. I'm sure I will get flamed over these comments but show me where I'm off the mark.

 

[ReloaderFred]

flashhole,

You won't get slammed by me for your comments, since I consider them spot on. The younger generation's attention span is about 30 minutes, since TV shows are that long, and they think all life's problems should be solved in that length of time.

It's beyond my comprehension why someone would take the word of a faceless, anonymous stranger on the internet over real personal research, or real world experience from someone they actually know and would normally trust.

Fred