Quantcast

Precision shooting: Single or two-stage trigger?

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by Sebastian, Dec 19, 2018.

?

Which is better for precision shooting: A single or two-stage trigger?

  1. single

  2. two stage

  3. neither. try a hybrid

Results are only viewable after voting.
  1. Picher

    Picher Member

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2003
    Messages:
    1,270
    Location:
    Maine
    My deer rifles have 3 lb. pulls, due to the colder temperatures and wearing gloves. Besides, a deer, even at 300 yards, is a pretty large target, compared with trying to shoot tight groups on a target range. There are also no scoring rings on a live deer, so missing by a half-moa is not a problem, even at 400 yards.

    Range centerfire rifles that I own are usually set at 2 to 2 1/4 lbs, but .22LR range rifles may be down to as little as 1 lb. Jewell Rimfire Benchrest rifle triggers, when I competed, were 2 ounces.
     
    Sebastian likes this.
  2. ATLDave

    ATLDave Member

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2011
    Messages:
    6,076
    Yeah, if I were chasing a super-light pull on a trigger that was still suitable for something other than bench work, I'd look hard at a set trigger.
     
    Sebastian likes this.
  3. taliv

    taliv Moderator

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2004
    Messages:
    23,585
    does anyone make a modern set trigger? i've only ever seen them on quigly type stuff
     
  4. ATLDave

    ATLDave Member

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2011
    Messages:
    6,076
  5. Sebastian

    Sebastian Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2018
    Messages:
    123
    The more I look at those set triggers the cooler they are. :cool:

    Still noticing how close the voting is...I honestly didn't expect that.

    I am impressed with this forum:thumbup:
     
  6. taliv

    taliv Moderator

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2004
    Messages:
    23,585
    I wasn’t advocating for set triggers. They’d be super slow for matches etc. just saying I thought the technology was cool for its day.
     
    Sebastian likes this.
  7. ATLDave

    ATLDave Member

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2011
    Messages:
    6,076
    Definitely a horses-for-courses thing. Set triggers are probably good for hunting guns that people also want to wring accuracy out of. Probably not great for a timed PRS event!
     
    taliv likes this.
  8. Casefull

    Casefull Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2009
    Messages:
    1,217
    Location:
    Sawtooths
    This is not an answer to the OPs question but a helpful suggestion. Learn to pull a double action pistol trigger well and a 3 lb rifle trigger will become really easy to pull properly.
     
  9. Varminterror

    Varminterror Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2016
    Messages:
    4,914
    Just really not applicable for the type of shooting we’re talking about.
     
  10. Casefull

    Casefull Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2009
    Messages:
    1,217
    Location:
    Sawtooths
    I suppose that means I cannot shoot half inch groups with my single stage triggers. What type of shooting are you referencing? Lots of pitfalls in assuming we all have the same abilities and handicaps. BTW I know intimately “the type of shooting” Op is referring to.
     
  11. cfullgraf

    cfullgraf Member

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2010
    Messages:
    8,451
    Location:
    East TN
    I inherited a short action Mauser rifle (6.5x54 Kurz Mauser) that had been my grandfather's. It has set triggers. It is fun to shoot once in a while but it takes another mindset to shoot well in stressful situations.

    Not that it is difficult to learn, but using the set trigger has to be second nature. It is kind of like remembering change triggers on side by side shotgun with two triggers.
     
    Sebastian likes this.
  12. bfoosh006

    bfoosh006 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2008
    Messages:
    629
    Just going to add... "backing out " of a trigger pull, for me , is far easier with a 2 stage.
     
  13. Varminterror

    Varminterror Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2016
    Messages:
    4,914
    I guess every rifle coach in the world has been missing the boat by neglecting to tell their RIFLE students to run out and buy a DA pistol to practice with their competition rifles. Silly professionals...
     
  14. Casefull

    Casefull Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2009
    Messages:
    1,217
    Location:
    Sawtooths
    If incapable of having a discussion with someone with different experience’s than yourself, immediately try and disparage said person. You obviously think you have a corner on firearms knowledge and operation. Good for you. You will never know what you do not know with that attitude.
     
  15. Varminterror

    Varminterror Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2016
    Messages:
    4,914
    I carry a DA pistol every day, have for over 15yrs, and shoot weekly with it. I’ve been instructing shooters for almost 20yrs as well, and have been competing in various precision rifle sports for over 20. Never in my use of a DA pistol have I felt it offered significant advantage to rifle work. Maybe for someone without even a base of fundamentals, as they’ll feel much greater control, and sure, shooting begets better shooting, but I don’t pretend to believe a recommendation to practice with a long & heavy DA trigger is anything but trolling.
     
  16. Varminterror

    Varminterror Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2016
    Messages:
    4,914
    One thing - back on topic - to consider when choosing a two stage trigger for your AR-10:

    Compare the stage weights of the options you’re considering. A 3lb total isn’t the whole story - a 2.5lb 1st with a 1/2lb wall will feel very different than a 1/2lb slack 1st with a 2.5lb stall. I like to have the weight on the front end, with a brief, light stall at the second stage. I just want to feel the wall, JUST feel it, before it breaks. So for me, a good trigger like the Rock River National Match or Varmint is backwards. Their triggers are light up front, with a heavy wall. The Savage Accu-trigger is similar, a light take up on the sear block blade, in front of a heavier trigger break. They work, obviously, and I do recommend them, but I personally prefer a heavier take up with a surprise “trip,” not a slack take up in front of a more single stage feel.
     
  17. fpgt72

    fpgt72 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2011
    Messages:
    1,660
    On the phone so forgive me if choppy. The CZ I have is not a double set but a single. push trigger forward and it gets set to the light pull... don't and it is standard pull both are adjustable in about every way. This way you have standard pull for gloves, or real light for range
     
    Sebastian likes this.
  18. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2006
    Messages:
    56,291
    Location:
    Alabama
    Since the OP pictured an unlimited class Benchrest gun I assumed he meant for bolt guns, and not ARs, but yes, the AR requirements would be different than a bolt gun. No worry about a double in a bolt gun.
     
  19. taliv

    taliv Moderator

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2004
    Messages:
    23,585
    later in the OP he was talking about his AR308 though...
     
    Walkalong and Sebastian like this.
  20. Jessesky

    Jessesky Member

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2016
    Messages:
    357
    My first gun I owned was a Turk Mauser 98. I shot the daylight out of that thing. It had a two stage trigger, I knew it well.

    When I bought my second centerfire I ever owned (a Winchester 94) the single stage trigger was foreign and uncomfortable to me. This is because I was so versed on the two stage. I felt like I almost couldn’t tell when the single stage would break.

    Now between the two, I’d go single stage all day. On my surplus mausers, sometimes I find myself discharging too soon as I creep up the double stage to the sear. That is however because the take up was heavy and pressure to break the sear was light. In other guns like my k31 the two stage is superb, and still performs better than some aftermarket high end two stage triggers I’ve used. It really is remarkable what the Swiss can do.

    In short, I learned on a two stage, hated single stage at first. But once I got used to it I realized it was superior.
     
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2018
    Sebastian likes this.
  21. Sebastian

    Sebastian Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2018
    Messages:
    123
    Hello bfoosh I've seen you around here and elsewhere and appreciated your threads. :thumbup:

    I'm a bit ignorant, "backing out" of a trigger? You mean after a shot for the reset/follow-up or just easing off and not breaking a shot?
     
  22. Sebastian

    Sebastian Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2018
    Messages:
    123

    Yeah that makes good sense. The MBT I just installed is quoted as a 4.5lb = 2.5lb first stage / 2.0lb 2nd stage although my trigger pull gauge (Wheeler) shows it to be a bit lighter. I did get a chance to shoot it while function testing/ tuning my AGB a few days ago and while I am no trigger connoisseur, I do like the trigger and look forward to hunting for some good groups after I finally roll up these 165 SST's. I would say that it feels noticeably better to me than a RRA NM which I have shot in a few different AR's (not that I disliked the RRA NM I just feel the MBT is better). I have also shot an Accu-trigger and liked them. I thought just using the MBT would be a bit hard to get used to because I was used to shooing a 1.5lb single stage with pretty much zero movement before the break, but found the MBT very agreeable...moreso than the RRA NM.

    I kinda feel like I need to pay more attention to the triggers I use because I don't think my trigger palate is terribly sophisticated yet but I'll get there eventually. I've still never even shot a Geissele. PSA just had the SSA-E on sale for 156 bucks which I was very tempted to pick up but I just got this MBT so I figured I better play with what I have for a while yet.

    LOL
     
  23. Sebastian

    Sebastian Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2018
    Messages:
    123
    Yes sorry I might have been a bit ambiguous but I am using an AR308 but didn't want to necessarily specifically limit the subject matter and appreciate any number of viewpoints and philosophies in regards to preferred trigger types as they relate to dependent/specific applications. I had often heard (generally speaking) a 2-stage for precision shooting but found that at odds with many precision rifles...hence the poll and looking for insight. :)
     
  24. Sebastian

    Sebastian Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2018
    Messages:
    123
    Again I thank you all for the great replies. Merry Christmas.

    SantaRifle.jpg
     
  25. Driftertank

    Driftertank Member

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2010
    Messages:
    724
    Location:
    Yakima WA
    I'm another "it depends" guy.

    On my ARs i prefer a two-stage, usually about 2.0+2.5lb for general purpose, 2.0+1.0 or so for target/varmint rifles. I like the extra sear engagement for moving around guns. Also means i can kind of "lean into" my trigger when shooting under stress, if that makes sense.

    For my bolt guns, i like a sharp, clean break at 2.5-3lbs with no take-up or creep, so i prefer a good-quality single stage. It turns the trigger manipulation into less of a pull, more of a pressure.

    As always, YMMV and opinions are worth every penny you pay for them...
     
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice