Pull and reload Norma training rounds?

[Snowdog]

I recently stumbled upon 800 Norma plastic training rounds that I had stored away for years after finding them not only useless, but possibly damaging to bores. These rounds feature a non-corrosive Berdan primed brass case, plastic bullet (with blue sealant between the bullet and case) and a 5mm iron ball embedded in the tip of the bullet that I assume is for positive feeding or perhaps stability in flight. However, shortly after purchasing these rounds dirt cheap, I read reports that some claimed the iron ball would sometimes end up peening the bore.

An idea occured to me... why not pull the worthless bullet, discard of the powder and simply reload the primed brass? I found the case to be completely non-magnetic, so I am guessing it's brass. If it's brass, I suspect it can be reloaded.

I seriously doubt a kinetic impact bullet puller would so anything more than possibly dislodge the iron ball, but I believe a collet puller might work.

Here are my questions: Being that I currently use a Lee auto-index press, does anyone know of any stand-alone collet-style pullers or a collet with compatible threads for my press? So far I've only found Hornady and RCBS collet pullers.

Second, is anyone aware of anyone who has tried this or has any additional information on these practice rounds and its componants? The 36 round box is marked "9mm kptr m/39" and the headstamp on each cartridge is a 6 to the left of the primer, a 035 at the bottom of the primer and a 5 to the right of the primer (which indicates to me it being manufactured in '65).

Below are the original two threads I created in 2002 at TFL, both include some ballistic findings and small photographs (which I will attempt to attach to this post).

Thanks in advance!

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=97097&highlight=training

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=119728&highlight=training

 

[Snowdog]

Alright, I've pulled 50 of these guys and it hasn't gone horribly wrong so far. One concern I've developed is whether these cases are capable of handling the pressures typically associated with traditional ammuniton. As they were loaded with very light plastic bullets (and a 5mm iron BB), I don't know if these cases were also used by Norma to load other forms of live ammunition or if they were made specifically for these plastic projectiles. However, I found these cases were loaded 3/4 full of a powder, so these cases obviously have to handle some degree of pressure.
What makes me wonder is the internal case walls don't appear to taper towards the flash hole but instead seem to keep the profile of a cylinder. That said, I've never really looked inside Berdan primed brass of lead/copper ammunition, therefore I don't know if this is typical of Berdan primed fodder as opposed to being something unique to the cases used specifically for the training rounds.

I pulled and resized 50, 15 of those I reloaded. I decided to use what I consider a very mild load consisting of 4.0 grains of Winchester 231 topped with a 124gr Zero-brand JHP and Winchester WSP. I'll put these through a steel-frame auto with a fully supported chamber (probably a K9) and inspect the brass. If there are no problems, it looks like I've got over 800 primed brass coming my way.

I'll likely post some pictures and information including my finding after firing these 15 rounds. If all goes well, perhaps someone out there who has a few hundred or thousand of these relatively worthless training rounds will have a new use for them as well.

 

[tlen]

If the cases are in fact Berdan primed they are only good for scrap value and not for reloading. Removing the bullets to salvage the case for reloading is a lot of work just to save the price of a primer. I'd just find a way to dispose of the ammo if it wasn't shootable.

 

[Dakoma]

I have 2 864 Round crates of them I packrated.Was told that they were used in a swedish submachine gun that had a special barrel that was tapered so as to turn the plastic to dust,and that bb or little round ball is what came out of the barrel as the projectile.Used to have a 9 but sold it.Dont know where to find Berdan primers anyway.They were made by Norma,post results.

 

[PTK]

Snowdog

If you'd like to sell those and buy loading supplies or loaded ammo instead, PM me. I'm interested in purchasing however many rounds you have remaining.

 

[Dakoma]

I think I'll keep them for awhile,let me know how your tests(or reloads) perform with this brass.Bet you know where to get some berdan primers?Seems funny how all the Berdan primed brass is now considered scrap,most people dont know how to get those primers out without destroying the case.That's allright I do.Just cant find primers right now.

 

[Snowdog]

Whoo hoo!

While I only fired 30 rounds from a Kahr K9, all fed, fired and ejected flawlessly and POI was identical to the same recipe using Boxer primed mixed brass. This is very much the "best case scenario" that I was hoping for. For years I thought these things were nothing but a waste space and now I find I can actually put them to use.

Here I have thousands of various 9mm JHPs and FMJs and plenty of Alliant Bullseye, PowerPistol and Winchester 231... but had few remaining brass and fewer primers.
Now I have 800 primed brass that will be ready to use with very little work that I originally spent very little for.

I very much plan to toss the fired brass much like one would dispose of CCI Blazer spent cases.
Now I just hope these don't become a collectible in the future.

BTW, if anyone would like the pulled "bullets" for whatever reason, pay the shipping and you can have it (or pick it up and it's yours).

 

[res45]

Snowdog I do the same thing with equal results but with rifle rounds the Lapua 5 Gr. Wooden bullet practice ammo,but i did it intentionally because I wanted the value of reloaded ammo but in some cases I didn't want to have to worry about losing my good boxer primed brass so I bought a nice stash of these after I tried some out and It has worked out exactly as I expected. I put about 200 rds through my SKS so far with this berdan primed brass with my boxer primer receipt without a hitch function wise with no change in accuracy.