Pulled over Ticket then Questioned?????

[Optical Serenity]

You guys who keep talking about "JBTs" should remember one thing. You are generalizing big time, and wanting to pre judge. Now, imagine if it went the other way around:

In our jobs, we deal with the absolute worse days of people's lives. We see criminal after criminal, and many bad mistakes and some very bad crimes occur. Suppose we start to assume (as you obviously do about us) that all non-LEO are criminals!? Then what?

You see, its about education and it goes both ways. Its about professionalism both ways too. Both the LEO & the citizen needs to be courteous and professional.

I have many traffic stops where in the video it is obvious the person is being a total jerk, and you see me simply say "yes sir, I understand your frustration." even though he's calling me every name in the book. Now when we get to court, things get very interesting for him because there he shows up in a suit claiming to have been harassed and cursed at. Imagine his surprise when he finds out the video proves he just lied on the stand?

Now, instead of giving out advice to be rued and uncourteous on the side of the road to the officer, how about just plain being yourself? Unless of course your typical personality is to be a jerk?

Like I said in my original post, I can't remember the last time I wrote someone a ticket who had a GA Firearm's Permit or an out of state CCW. I can remember however many who said "What the f**k did you stop me for you a**hole? I'll see your motherf**king a** in court" well, to that type person...my verbal warning obviously will not suffice in getting them to rectify whatever they got stopped for.

 

[Ryder]

Looks like he thought you would kill him over a $20 fine?

 

[Curare]

Optical Serenity--I appreciate the sacrifices LEOs endure. It truly is a thankless job in many respects, though incredibly important. Stay safe.

 

[MrTwigg]

LEO's do get killed and worse over $20.00 tickets

Looks like he thought you would kill him over a $20 fine

This happens more often than you might think. I'm not flaming you when I say this, but I remember an incident in Riverhead, Long Island when a cop stopped some guy for a loud muffler. The stop went without incident but the dude came back ten minutes later with a 12 gage pump and literally blew the cop's face off. The cop actually survived but he was now is blind, deaf and had to have a entire new jaw built. Ruined his whole life, last I heard he's still undergoing reconstructive surgery. The who did it managed to get away that night but surrendered the next day with his attorney in a very public manner to avoid getting what he deserved. :banghead:

 

[Herself]

Even if your state doesn't have a requirement to notify, it makes sense to me to hand over your CCW, DL, registration and proof of insurance, preferably with the CCW on top.

It may make sense to you but as other have pointed out, states vary a lot along those lines. In Indiana, I have seen different recommendations; handing over your CCW on a traffic stop can go either way.

But if you get nipped on a legitimate traffic vioation, take your medicine! And don't be a jerk about it. I average one minor traffic stop every 6 or 7 years -- light speeding, one very deep amber light and several "driving in the wrong neighborhood late at night."

Those stops are not jackbooted thuggery, they're cops doing their jobs and the extent to which I make it easier for them -- Pulling off the road if possible, license and registration ready, dome light on, hands in plain sight and purse on the far seat -- it is over faster and sometimes with only only a warning.

I am no fan of speed traps; I'll warn oncoming motorists of one if I can, which serves the same purpose of getting them to slow down without the excitement and sirens. But if I get caught in one, I face it; it is nobody's fault but mine.

Speed limits are low. They are not set for you. They are set for the beginning driver and the little old lady with really slow reactions, with whom you share the road.

--Herself

 

[HankB]

Should I have told him to back the "F" off?

Uh . . . bad idea. Maybe he's "wired" for sound and has a dashboard cam running. Do YOU want to be featured on an episode of "America's Worst Drivers" or something, cussing out a cop? Or in court before judge Buford T. Justice, with a tape of you cussing out his brother, a fine, upstanding minion of the law?

The (very) few times I've encountered someone in authority who becomes rude and obnoxious, I find it's much better to speak very softly and dispassionately. Unless he's a junkie or something himself - in which case you've got a problem no matter how you look at it - you sort of take the wind out of his sails by NOT reacting to provocation the way he might want you to.

Speed limits are low. They are not set for you. They are set for the beginning driver and the little old lady with really slow reactions, with whom you share the road.

Sometimes . . . but all too often, they're set for a purpose which can be summed up in two words: Revenue Enhancement.

 

[Raph84]

(PlayboyPenguin) An officer has to ask permission for a search first but if you refuse they can do a warrantless search on grounds of suspicious behavior. Just like they do not need a warrant to check your pockets.

Refusing to an officers request of a search does not rise to articulable suspision which is required for a warrantless search.

An officer may check your pockets for his own safety (terry stop) but he may not do this to your car, if he fears for his safety he can take you out of his car and put you in the back of his.

 

[Hot brass]

Things were stolen from my wifes car and I called the cops. Responding LEO was looking thrugh the car and I informed him that I had a CCW and was armed. He did not flinch, said don`t worry about it.

 

[aufevermike]

Here in Alaska you better tell them upfront that you have a CCW even if you are not carrying at the time. It's better than having them find out just the way that the cop did in your situation. If you don't.....well he'll be pissed that you didn't tell him or her. Besides it shows that you are an honest citizen and has even gotten be off on a few.

Mike

 

[HankB]

Here in Alaska you better tell them upfront that you have a CCW even if you are not carrying at the time.

I thought Alaska had gone to Vermont-style carry?

 

[roo_ster]

Ix-nay on the Uck-fay

Telling someone to "eff off" is almost guaranteed to bring about a negative reaction.

I'm not quite sure what folks who want to get all hostile expect to accomplish. Even if Officer Attitude is being a jerk. You are at a disadvantage: A man with a firearm is behind you, his lights may be blazing, he is likely wearing body armor, and he is used to using (maybe abusing) his authority.

Remain cool & collected. Know and understand your obligations in that state as far as CCW goes. If Officer Attitude's question can be taken one of several ways, respond to the most charitable interpretation. Respond to Officer Attitude in a calm manner. Do not accede to any searches/etc. without a warrant and always be mindful of your rights and the legitimate execise of his authority. If Officer Attitude steps over the line, make mental note of all that occurs.

If you really think Officer Attitude is out of line (legally or attitudinally), carefully record your recollections as soon as you are able and inform his superiors, both administrative and elected. If his superiors do not respond, you can assume that it is a department-wide problem and you will get no satisfaction from this route. If the incident is egregious/serious enough, a call to a lawyer may be warranted.

Just this demeanor got my buddy out of a contested ticket and got Officer Attitude a dressing down in court from the judge.

 

[Hokkmike]

Sounds like a case of instinctive survival training setting in. Being a little tactless doesn't compare to being in harm's way. His questions do seem a little out of line maybe. I supposed I would have asked if you were carrying now, and where was it?, just for my own (if I were him) piece of mind. The why's are not really his business.

I'd let it go. Life is too short.

 

[para.2]

What never ceases to amaze me when I read one of these threads, is why after the officer finds out you have a CCW he becomes concerned. He has now determined that you are one of the good guys, having gone through the time/trouble/expense/background checks, etc. required to obtain such a permit. There are studies I have read, which I don't have links to readily available at the moment, indicating that the CCW licensed public is far more law-abiding than the public at large, and even more law-abiding as a percentage than the sworn LEO community.

For him to become concerned at this point only clearly indicates to me that he'd rather be the only one on the planet with a gun.

And, for the poster who asked who we'd call if our house was broken into, as I've posted before, due to my multiple negative impressions of local law enforcers when I have, in the past called them for different situations, I don't call the police anymore. If it's important enough for me to take care of, I take care of it. If it isn't important enough, I let it go.

 

[glockamolee]

I'm surprised that this was Montana. I could see if it was one of the Communist states such as CA, NJ, or their ilk.

I think he was anti CCW.

 

[Taurus 66]

Here in Alaska you better tell them upfront that you have a CCW even if you are not carrying at the time. It's better than having them find out just the way that the cop did in your situation. If you don't.....well he'll be pissed that you didn't tell him or her. Besides it shows that you are an honest citizen and has even gotten be off on a few.

That's what I don't get! If government agencies did a better job in communicating with one another, all the officer should have to do is take the drivers license number, run it through the DMV, which should be communicating with the County Clerk's Office, or whatever department holds CCW records, all states. The officer would know from dispatch or computer if a person is CCW legal. One question to the motorist reamins: "Are you carrying now?"

On an additional note: A person who is legally carrying concealed and doesn't inform the officer is still far less of a threat (infact no threat at all, because ... well ... his is peace) than some BG packing illegally who possibly wants to do harm to the police.

 

[c_yeager]

Sounds like a case of instinctive survival training setting in. Being a little tactless doesn't compare to being in harm's way. His questions do seem a little out of line maybe. I supposed I would have asked if you were carrying now, and where was it?, just for my own (if I were him) piece of mind. The why's are not really his business.

I'd let it go. Life is too short.

Has it occured to you that the guys you *really* need to worry about are the people who don't have permits and lie to you when you ask "do you have a gun"?

Seriously, your survival instincts better be ticking over *more* when you have *less* information, not the other way around.

 

[Scott F]

If you ever get stopped again try this line, “Good evening officer, I have a CCL and I am carrying. How would you like me to proceed?” This is stated with your hands in plain site, something like the 10-2 position on the steering wheel.

The officer will know you have a CCL sooner or later and this shows your willingness to cooperate up front. A survey of those using this approach showed than not one was issued a ticket. Some did get warnings but no fines. I have not been stopped in well over twenty years but if I do this will be my attitude. Give it a try.

 

[ajkurp]

Why do you have a gun?

Well, gee officer- I never thought about it much. Why do you think I have a gun? Aren't I supposed to?

In a reflective, civil "asking my shrink" tone.

or, try this...

"Why are you using that crosswalk?"
Well, gee officer- I never thought about it much. Aren't I supposed to?

 

[ScottS]

"Why do you have a CCW permit?" "Officer, am I free to go now?"

"Why are you Carrying?" "Officer, am I free to go now?"

"What are you Carrying?" "Officer, am I free to go now?"

Why would you even consider answering inane questions?

 

[usmarine0352_2005]

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