BlackHand1917
Member
- Joined
- Nov 24, 2008
- Messages
- 187
Nothing beats a high quality add-on recoil pad, like the one made by Pachmayr. It is an excellent product.
Pump action shotgun is not for everyone
- Thread starter dekibg
- Start date
Conelrad
Member
My shotguns are both 590 Milsguns. Tough and extremely reliable.
Heavy beasts, but I don't plan on hiking or hunting with them. Just covering whatever threat or problem pops up on the 10ac homestead.
Mostly pigeons and the occasional rattler or bad feral dog.
Not once has any load thru it caused me discomfort. Weighty weapons have their place...
Heavy beasts, but I don't plan on hiking or hunting with them. Just covering whatever threat or problem pops up on the 10ac homestead.
Mostly pigeons and the occasional rattler or bad feral dog.
Not once has any load thru it caused me discomfort. Weighty weapons have their place...
I once had a 26" barrel SxS that didn't weigh squat. When shooting SC at the club after 20 or so shots things would get uncomfortable. I was shooting 1 1/8oz loads. That's when I learned 1oz, then 7/8oz, and finally 3/4oz loads in the 12ga guns were more to my liking. At 76 years young I don't need all that recoil.
Oldschool shooter
Member
8've owned and shot a 10 ga. SxS with 3 1/2" mag loads. That was unpleasant. To be honest, I have never found a need for more than the 2 3/4" loadings for what I use my 12s for. Whether it's slugs for deer or small game loads, the 2 3/4 shells have always worked for me.
Capybara
Member
I'd say it isn't a pump shotgun issue OP, it's a 3" or 3.5" shell issue.
IMHO, there are few reasons to ever shoot 3" shells. Perhaps
long distance shots for Goose hunting? Or perhaps Elk with slugs?
IMHO and based upon tests, for HD, 2.75" shells provide more than enough horsepower
and 3" shells are obviously not need for clays. Short stroking is a thing though, practice, practice, practice and
once a pump gun loosens up with wear a little, it's much less of an issue.
IMHO, there are few reasons to ever shoot 3" shells. Perhaps
long distance shots for Goose hunting? Or perhaps Elk with slugs?
IMHO and based upon tests, for HD, 2.75" shells provide more than enough horsepower
and 3" shells are obviously not need for clays. Short stroking is a thing though, practice, practice, practice and
once a pump gun loosens up with wear a little, it's much less of an issue.
Old Hobo
Member
Can't say I have any sort of ongoing love of pump shotguns, yet when it comes to getting a lot of lead in the air and quickly so, the pump has been a proven winner for well over a century. Practice practice = better and better. What with the government assaults on "assault rifles", the pump shotgun readily comes to mind as an alternative for one's home/business defense. And with the ready availability of rifled barrels for the use of saboted slugs, one might even consider the shotgun for aimed fire (within range, not at distance). I was most pleasantly surprised at how accurate my Remington 870 is with the rifled barrel. Got a 3" group at 100 yards with the open rifle sights. This performance caused me to more greatly appreciate my pump shotgun.
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Gordon
Member
I recently bought a son for Christmas a Remington TAC 14 12gauge cheap = $325 including shipping and let him pick it up at FFL in his name to be registered (don't worry I merely refunded my 50 YO son what he had to pay, no straw purchase BS) . He shot it gleefully and thought it was funbut all he had were hibrass full heavy loads to play with. I steered him to a Fiocchi 1300 fps 12 pellet #1 buck and some 7/8th .oz 1200 fps managed recoil slugs and after he attached an Olight Baldor Pro light/green lazer to the Magpul foreend he really finds it a viable defense tool. The slugs at 25 yards were sighted in and the buckshot patterns at 15 feet were arount 10" and reasonably centered on the lazer dot. He is buying a 1 round extension for it = 5 shot tube . It will supplement his indoor response systems , or ride under his jeep seat at night .
If I was to buy another shot gun for defense , it would be a new Beretta 1301 or the newer Police Shorter version that just came out. I still have my old Benelli M1 Super 90 with wood stock and love it , it is rather clunky tho. as is my 1100 3 gun , which is even more so .
If I was to buy another shot gun for defense , it would be a new Beretta 1301 or the newer Police Shorter version that just came out. I still have my old Benelli M1 Super 90 with wood stock and love it , it is rather clunky tho. as is my 1100 3 gun , which is even more so .
Last edited:
BlackHand1917
Member
- Joined
- Nov 24, 2008
- Messages
- 187
I have three words to offer here:
Aftermarket.recoil.pad
It really helps.
Aftermarket.recoil.pad
It really helps.
tws3b2
Member
Dang, You gonna have to start eating your wheaties. I'm 75 and still shoot my 12ga. pump with 3". For hd I practice shooting from the hip. In a hd situation you probably won't notice recoil at all.
I'm enjoying this thread and so am bringing it back to life to see if anyone else has anything to add.
I had a new Super-X 1 and thoroughly enjoyed learning to shoot with it on a skeet range, but carrying that heavy thing for mountain grouse was just too much and I sold it. For that and quail I settled on a Beretta over and under 20 gauge at about six pounds.
I had to have the stock shortened when I found the Beretta's 14"+ length of pull to be ridiculously long for me, and that's a cautionary tale for those who want to have a shorter stock or recoil pad added: the first gunsmith really butchered his attempt by cutting the stock at both the wrong length and and the wrong angle. Fortunately, when getting it corrected I lucked into a stock-fitter who knew what he was doing - a previous coach of the US Olympic skeet team. I now know how long my stocks need to be. The moral? Be really careful with who you trust your long gun stocks with, and maybe even risk insulting him by telling him exactly what you want and don't want.
I've been shooting that exclusively for almost forty years, but have now come into a 12 gauge pump, a Winchester 1200 (28", Modified) , almost 50 years old, and I'm about to try a 12 again. The original recoil pad is dried out and useless and is a bit too long, but before changing it I'll try it with a PAST pad and see if I like it. For the first time in my life I now have both a 20 and and a 12 and so have to be careful not to let the shells get mixed up. Who knows, maybe that will be be enough for me to start learning Sporting Clays?
I had a new Super-X 1 and thoroughly enjoyed learning to shoot with it on a skeet range, but carrying that heavy thing for mountain grouse was just too much and I sold it. For that and quail I settled on a Beretta over and under 20 gauge at about six pounds.
I had to have the stock shortened when I found the Beretta's 14"+ length of pull to be ridiculously long for me, and that's a cautionary tale for those who want to have a shorter stock or recoil pad added: the first gunsmith really butchered his attempt by cutting the stock at both the wrong length and and the wrong angle. Fortunately, when getting it corrected I lucked into a stock-fitter who knew what he was doing - a previous coach of the US Olympic skeet team. I now know how long my stocks need to be. The moral? Be really careful with who you trust your long gun stocks with, and maybe even risk insulting him by telling him exactly what you want and don't want.
I've been shooting that exclusively for almost forty years, but have now come into a 12 gauge pump, a Winchester 1200 (28", Modified) , almost 50 years old, and I'm about to try a 12 again. The original recoil pad is dried out and useless and is a bit too long, but before changing it I'll try it with a PAST pad and see if I like it. For the first time in my life I now have both a 20 and and a 12 and so have to be careful not to let the shells get mixed up. Who knows, maybe that will be be enough for me to start learning Sporting Clays?
Because he said so
Cast iron skillets aren't for everyone either........... What's your point?
Riomouse911
Member
The guys have answered very well.
No one this side of Krypton buys a gun and runs out the first time shooting perfect scores, especially when using a three pound sledge to drive tacks.
Learning from an instructor the solid fundamentals, proper fit of the gun to the shooter and tailoring the shell/load to the purpose will greatly increase your confidence and abilities.
Whoever convinced you to shoot 3” shells when you are just starting out was being downright mean, that’s like feeding a novice boxer to an angry Mike Tyson. 3” magnum shells are loaded full tilt for a reason: to get the maximum payload out to the maximum distance the choke allows to harvest game.
Low base 2 3/4” #9 trap loads are where you want to start out with a new shotgun to learn the guns function and to see how it fits. Once you are dialed in and have it down pat, then it’s OK to turn up the horsepower.
Anything else is just abusing yourself and ingraining bad habits like closing your eyes, snatching at the trigger, flinching, etc. because you are intimidated by it. (In 31.5 years in LE, I have never fired a 3” buckshot or slug round for defensive purposes. 2 3/4” slug or buck loads are plenty for that task.)
Good luck with your progress.
Stay safe.
No one this side of Krypton buys a gun and runs out the first time shooting perfect scores, especially when using a three pound sledge to drive tacks.
Learning from an instructor the solid fundamentals, proper fit of the gun to the shooter and tailoring the shell/load to the purpose will greatly increase your confidence and abilities.
Whoever convinced you to shoot 3” shells when you are just starting out was being downright mean, that’s like feeding a novice boxer to an angry Mike Tyson. 3” magnum shells are loaded full tilt for a reason: to get the maximum payload out to the maximum distance the choke allows to harvest game.
Low base 2 3/4” #9 trap loads are where you want to start out with a new shotgun to learn the guns function and to see how it fits. Once you are dialed in and have it down pat, then it’s OK to turn up the horsepower.
Anything else is just abusing yourself and ingraining bad habits like closing your eyes, snatching at the trigger, flinching, etc. because you are intimidated by it. (In 31.5 years in LE, I have never fired a 3” buckshot or slug round for defensive purposes. 2 3/4” slug or buck loads are plenty for that task.)
Good luck with your progress.
Stay safe.
entropy
Member
#9 Trap loads?! That's a Skeet load!
Some 3" chambered autos won't cycle the 1 oz and less loads.
Some 3" chambered autos won't cycle the 1 oz and less loads.
Not to beat a dead horse, but with shotguns it's all about fit and technique. When I was around 25 I bought a mossy 500, in my 50's now. I'v got somewhere over 20,000 rounds threw it now including a couple of classes. All types of shotshells. It has a 18.5 inch barrel. For several years I could shoot it OK. Wasn't till I installed a Magpul stock and fitted it to me that I really got good with it. That old mossy is my preferred home defense long arm at this point. Shouldering it now is like a handshake with an old friend. To be honest at this point I can't really tell the difference between 23/4 and 3 inch shells. So find a stock that fits you, get training and practice a lot.
Micro
Member
A lot of people don't really appreciate the sort of recoil a 12 gauge can generate. People will complain about a .30-06's or a .300 Win Mag's recoil, but not appreciate the fact that a 12 gauge 3" or 3 1/2" will generate much high recoil forces than either, up into and beyond the ranges of .375 and .40 african-rifle cartridges.
A shotgun with a perfectly fitting stock helps with felt recoil, but only so much. Recoil in the 50+ ft/lb range is a lot no matter the stock fit, action type or recoil pad. And a morning pattering 3" and 3 1/2" 12 gauge rounds will leave you looking a bit discolored.
A shotgun with a perfectly fitting stock helps with felt recoil, but only so much. Recoil in the 50+ ft/lb range is a lot no matter the stock fit, action type or recoil pad. And a morning pattering 3" and 3 1/2" 12 gauge rounds will leave you looking a bit discolored.
entropy
Member
That pic shows bruising from shooting with the stock in the wrong place. It's too far out from the 'pocket', that area where the pectoral muscle provides a cushion, between the clavicle and shoulder joint. It's also too far up, my guess would be from waterfowling from a pit or coffin blind where you're shooting almost straight up. In that case it's hard to avoid, but if that pic is from patterning Magnum shells, you're leaning way too far into the bench. I actually stand when I pattern.
When I taught Rifle and Trap for 4-H, one of the things I taught even before they fired a round was how to properly shoulder a long gun.
This is a hilarious video on You Tube of guys shooting a .577 Tyrannosaur, most of them dropping the very expensive rifle, or letting it slide off the top of their shoulder and hit the glass if the booth. Only one guy, named Klaus, shoots the .577 correctly.
He's at @ 4:32 in, but watch the whole thing, it's pretty funny.
When I taught Rifle and Trap for 4-H, one of the things I taught even before they fired a round was how to properly shoulder a long gun.
This is a hilarious video on You Tube of guys shooting a .577 Tyrannosaur, most of them dropping the very expensive rifle, or letting it slide off the top of their shoulder and hit the glass if the booth. Only one guy, named Klaus, shoots the .577 correctly.
He's at @ 4:32 in, but watch the whole thing, it's pretty funny.
tws3b2
Member
I'm 76 and shoot my Mossberg 500 regularly. From the shoulder and hips. No problem.
I don't shoot 3". 2 3/4 works fine.
20" is to long for home defense? That's only 1 1/2" more than the 18 1/2. My home is small 20" would be no problem.
The gun and caliber are not near as important than "Can You".
If you can't handle it, no need to blame the gun.
I don't shoot 3". 2 3/4 works fine.
20" is to long for home defense? That's only 1 1/2" more than the 18 1/2. My home is small 20" would be no problem.
The gun and caliber are not near as important than "Can You".
If you can't handle it, no need to blame the gun.
