Question about a JC Higgins Model 50

[JD Pinardi]

I have a Model 50 in 30-06 I inherited from my father, he bought the gun new. It has a Belgium FN Mauser action. My question is, after checking some of these out, they all seem to have open sights. This one doesn't, was this an available option? I stripped and refinished the stock, replaced to old recoil pad with a White Line, and dumped the 2 piece trigger for a Timney otherwise, the gun is as I first saw it in the mid 60's.

JD

 

[Merle1]

View attachment 233728 View attachment 233729 View attachment 233730 View attachment 233730 View attachment 233731 I have a Model 50 in 30-06 I inherited from my father, he bought the gun new. It has a Belgium FN Mauser action. My question is, after checking some of these out, they all seem to have open sights. This one doesn't, was this an available option? I stripped and refinished the stock, replaced to old recoil pad with a White Line, and dumped the 2 piece trigger for a Timney otherwise, the gun is as I first saw it in the mid 60's.

JD

It's had a lot of time to be modified.......

 

[Slamfire]

This is an original ad. Of the original rifles I have seen, none had checkering and only hard plastic buttplates. Not to say that some could have been made with checkering, or different butt pads.




This is mine in 30-06. I added the Mauser recoil bolt and installed a rubber buttpad. I also installed a Timney trigger and “glassbedded” the action.





It will hold the ten ring at 300 yards, even when the ammunition is so old that the case necks crack!



I make it a practice to grease the bullets as this chrome lined barrel fouls excessively with non greased bullets. Just doing what out Grandfathers did around WW1 to reduce jacket fouling.

 

[JD Pinardi]

Thanks, as I said I haven't seen one yet without open sights, my father had a good friend who was a gunsmith maybe he had them removed and reblued, if so, he did a good job, I can't find any sign of them ever being there. as for the stock engraving, my father did that....he loved woodworking!

Nice shooting Slamfire, these are good shooters and I love the action. Sears and Roebuck......go figger??
JD

 

[22250Rem]

What a classic old sporting rifle! Too bad I hardly ever seem to come across those; or if I do, the seller is asking too much. Back when that was made, iron sights were just about standard equipment on all rifles. Back in those days there were still a lot of old timers who swore by open or peep sights and didn't trust the scopes that were available then, because those older scopes weren't as trouble free as what we have available today. The guys who used those scopes also tended to stick with a straight power like 2.5, 4, or 6x because the variable power models were found to be less reliable than the straight power versions.

 

[bannockburn]

JD Pinardi

Nice old J.C. Higgins you've got there! Your Dad did a nice job with the wood carving and you did a nice job of refinishing the stock and installing a new recoil pad.

I can remember walking into a Sears store up at the mall and being able to handle rifles like that right out on the sales floor! They were secured to a shelf fixture with a length of chain and had their bolts removed but you could still pick them up and look them over. Those were the days!

 

[natman]

They all had some form of iron sights. Remember that these were originally sold in the very early 50's; scope technology wasn't anywhere near as advanced then as it is now and selling a rifle without some form of iron sights was practically unheard of.

Early 50s had the rear sight mounted "backwards" with the dovetail in the receiver. The rifle in the ad in post #3 is from this era. Most had a base soldered on the barrel with the base toward the front. Your rifle has been reblued, probably to remove the marks when the sights were removed.

 

[natman]

I make it a practice to grease the bullets as this chrome lined barrel fouls excessively with non greased bullets. Just doing what out Grandfathers did around WW1 to reduce jacket fouling.

You may be experiencing excessive fouling, but it's not typical of the chrome lined barrels. I have two 50s and neither exhibits excessive fouling.

It will hold the ten ring at 300 yards, even when the ammunition is so old that the case necks crack!

I suspect this may be contributing to the problem

 

[RPRNY]

Time capsule goodness!

 

[Slamfire]

You may be experiencing excessive fouling, but it's not typical of the chrome lined barrels. I have two 50s and neither exhibits excessive fouling.

I have several military rifles with chrome lined barrels and they don't have a fouling problem either. I don't know if my M70 PBR is chromed lined, but it does not foul. There is something off with this barrel. I paid a gunsmith to lap this barrel and that reduced the fouling but did not eliminate fouling. But, greased bullets totally eliminate fouling, which is why the ammunition on the bench is dunked in greasy hair goop.

It will hold the ten ring at 300 yards, even when the ammunition is so old that the case necks crack!

I suspect this may be contributing to the problem

As gunpowder breaks down it out gasses NOx. One component of NOx is nitric acid gas. Gunpowder has stabilizers which sop up the NOx but in time the stabilizer becomes depleted. When that happens one of the first indications of old gunpowder is case neck cracks and corrosion. For example:


Corrosion like I have never seen

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=542632

I inherited a bit of ammo when my Father died, and among that cache was a box of Norma 220gr .30-06 (from the 60's by the look of the box)...

I pulled them out to look at them this AM, and this is what I found

:

Five out of 16 rounds have this corrosion on them...On two, the corrosion has expanded the case below the bullet to the extent where the brass ruptured...This box was stored bullet down for decades at Dad's, and for a few years now here...They had a cardboard divider in the box so none touched, and there is no sign of water damage to the box or divider...I have looked through the rest of the 06 ammo boxes, and all are pristine like they came from the factories yesterday (but none are Norma)...

What the heck am I seeing here?

Is this corrosive primers gone bad and dripped through the powder to the base of the bullet and then eaten through, or is this deteriorating powder fuming through the case?

I obviously am not going to fire any of these rounds, but are they even safe to subject to bullet pulling in an impact puller???

I'd love to salvage the bullets at least...

Any help or opinions would be appreciated

I am shooting up the cartridges I loaded up the in late 1980's as I am starting to see cracking issues. Because this barrel also fouls with newly reloaded ammunition the age of the ammunition has no bearing on fouling.

 

[RugerNo]

After seeing the rollmarks on the barrel, it appears a low grade blue job was done. The edges of the letters are radiused comming from improper buffing technique. Not the sign of a quality gunsmith job.

 

[JD Pinardi]

RugerNo
Are you talking about my gun?

JD

 

[SwampWolf]

They all had some form of iron sights. Remember that these were originally sold in the very early 50's; scope technology wasn't anywhere near as advanced then as it is now and selling a rifle without some form of iron sights was practically unheard of.

I'm old enough to say (admit ) that even today, to me, a rifle doesn't "look right" without iron sights, even if it doesn't really "need' them. I think Ruger is one of the last to include iron sight options on some of the models of their Model 77 bolt-action rifles.

 

[natman]

RugerNo
Are you talking about my gun?

JD

Yes, he is. Your rifle, or at least the barrel, has been definitely been reblued. The finish doesn't look like a stock rifle's and the letters are slightly rounded from polishing. This is especially evident in the "J.C. Higgins Model 50".

That's why there are no marks where the sights used to be.

 

[JD Pinardi]

After all this info, I have no doubt the gun was reblued, I got it as a hand me down when I was 16 in 1972 and whatever was done was already done. I guess I don't have your keen eyes, the gun looks the same as my other blued guns, better than my M77 I purchased new. But then I'm not studying the rifle off some photos taken with my $49 camera phone.
Thanks for all the info, maybe it's time to end this post.

JD

 

[Elkins45]

I guess I don't have your keen eyes, the gun looks the same as my other blued guns, better than my M77 I purchased new. But then I'm not studying the rifle off some photos taken with my $49 camera phone.
Thanks for all the info, maybe it's time to end this post.

JD

Your sarcasm is uncalled for. You asked a question and people gave you reasonable answers based on the evidence you provided. They weren't insulting either you or your gun.

Even if your gun has been reblued that doesn't mean it's not a very good rifle.

 

[jaysouth]

Does your rifle have a serial number on the receiver? I have one in 30-06 without a SN. I was told that actions imported in that day and age did not require a SN. Mine has had all the bluing replaced with a nice brown patina of age and loving use. With cheap walmart ammo, it shoots MOA with a Weaver K-4(new version).

I left the gun with my father when I went into the army. After coming back from a tour in VN, he had learned to checker gun stocks on a ball bat and dowlings. He had done a very lavish checkering job on that cheap stock. I have been tempted to put another stock on it, but even though he has been dead for decades, i still feel his hand every time I handle the gun.

However I have not shot anything but cast bullets in it for years. It is holding up well despite it's appearance. I have a grandson with a love of shooting, reloading and casting bullets who will get this gun to pass on to his sons or grandsons.

 

[natman]

After all this info, I have no doubt the gun was reblued, I got it as a hand me down when I was 16 in 1972 and whatever was done was already done. I guess I don't have your keen eyes, the gun looks the same as my other blued guns, better than my M77 I purchased new. But then I'm not studying the rifle off some photos taken with my $49 camera phone.
Thanks for all the info, maybe it's time to end this post.

JD

How about not shooting the messenger? You asked, I answered. There's no need to take it personally.

The photo is plenty sharp enough, it's a question of knowing what to look for. Compare the photos of a stock finish 50 above and yours. Notice the slightly brushed finish on the stock barrel compared to the high polish. Note how crisp the edges of the letters are on the stock barrel compared to the rounded edges on the reblued gun. Finally, your gun has no sights nor any sign any were there. The sight bases were soldered on and removing them would leave marks on the finish. They were removed and the gun was repolished and reblued to remove the marks.

So yes, your gun was reblued. It's no big deal since the gun's value is as a shooter and it won't affect how it shoots.

 

[JD Pinardi]

Yes Natman, I see the difference, and after getting the info that they all had opens sights, I know the gun was reblued. I guess it was the "not the sign of a quality gunsmith job" that got me, the gun was obviously reblued well over 50 years ago, it still looks good to me, I've got other guns with less years and far less hunting trips that haven't held up that well.
I apologize for the sarcasm.

JD

 

[cdb1]

I'd love to own a Model 50. With the FN action and Hi-Standard barrel they have a reputation for incredible accuracy. Very worst case scenario is the OP has a great donor action that would cost a pretty penny if purchased.

 

[SwampWolf]

I apologize for the sarcasm.

No need for any apology in my view. I certainly didn't see any unwarranted or intentional sarcasm from you. Some people seem more injured by words than they are by sticks and stones.

 

[natman]

I'd love to own a Model 50. With the FN action and Hi-Standard barrel they have a reputation for incredible accuracy. Very worst case scenario is the OP has a great donor action that would cost a pretty penny if purchased.

I can't see rebarreling over a trivial cosmetic issue. I have seen a few 50s that were used as donors. I even saw one once in 30-06. Unless the barrel is actually damaged it always seemed foolish to rebarrel one. They are extremely accurate as is, and if you rebarrel one you'll spend hundreds of dollars and be lucky if it shoots as well afterwards as it did before.

 

[cdb1]

I wouldn't rebarrel it either unless it was shot out. Those barrels are probably the best feature of the rifle. If the barrel were toast you'd have an excellent CRF action though for a rebarrel or custom rifle.

 

[FLIGHT762]

I have a Model 50 in .270 Winchester. Very plain Jane like most of them are, but a great shooter. I've taken a number of Deer and Hogs with it.

 

[Elkins45]

No way I would rebarrel that gun if it were shooting well. Those chrome lined barrels were very high quality and you would spend hundreds and maybe end up with a less accurate replacement. Keep that rifle and be proud of it.