rarest caliber in a pre-64 model 70 winchester?

Status
Not open for further replies.
tark

tark

Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2013
Messages
5,193
Location
atkinson, ill
I have always wondered what is the rarest caliber offered in the pre-64 Model 70 Winchesters? I have heard everything from 7.92 Mauser, to 7,65 Argentine Mauser to 300 Savage....and everything in between. There were only 22 shipped in 9X57 Mauser, supposedly. That's an odd one.

Were there any one-offs, special order guns, chambered in really off beat calibers?

The reason I am asking is to settle a bet, and I know very little about Model 70s ....other than I want one!

Help me out....
 
According to Firearms magazine the 300 Savage followed closely by the 35 Rem are the rarest production calibers although there were some custom guns chambered for others. The rarest order is: 300 sav, 35 Rem, 458, 7X57, 358,250-3000 and 300 win mag.
 
I know one thing, there were 208,218 pre 64 Model 70 rifles made chambered for the 30-06 and that makes me one lucky man. I wouldn't want to own all of them but the thought makes me smile!
 
There was at least one in 32-20, factory marked on the barrel. R.I.A. Co. had it up for sale a few years back. Obviously a one-off, probably done by or for some big wig at Winchester. The barrel was marked 32 W.C.F. and the stamp used was the same one used to mark the 92s. The estimate was $27,000 - $35,000. It didn't sell.
 
I traded for a 1952 in 30-06 and have enjoyed it ever since. About 1975 or so. Best rifle ever? No. Stock is somewhat "clunky", but it shoots great and it is fun to look up the value each year. Thousands of rounds with cast bullets and very few jacketed.
 
20,000 were chambered in .22 Hornet. Not rare, but mine, manufactured in 1946, is exceptional because it was my dad's favorite rifle.
 
I once passed on a 300 H&H (actually reasonably priced) at a collector show.
<where's that bang head emoji??>
 
That 32-20 is the rarest I'm aware. The 9x57 was indeed the rarest production instead of one off. >35 Remington was rare as were others mentioned
 
Toml;

As a 1946, that should be a transition gun. Does it have the scalloped, or "cloverleaf", rear tang, or the smooth arc? What is the configuration of the safety, & the shape of the safety's operating lever?

I'd live to have a pre-64 in .257 Roberts. They're not rare-rare, but also not found easily.

900F
 
They made 22 in 9X57 . I believe that is less than the .300 Savage. Saw one of them in the same auction as the 32 WCF. it didn't sell either.
 
CB900F said:
Toml;

As a 1946, that should be a transition gun. Does it have the scalloped, or "cloverleaf", rear tang, or the smooth arc? What is the configuration of the safety, & the shape of the safety's operating lever?

I'd live to have a pre-64 in .257 Roberts. They're not rare-rare, but also not found easily.

900F
Click to expand...

I am interested in this subject. The safety is a thin blade with light x-hatching on both sides. It has a curved top, straight drop on the back; moves two positions to left to safe and straight back to fire. The safety extends past the receiver in fire so the back is vertically in line with the cocked bolt. (A simple cocking indicator?) The tang tapers like the top of a bowling pin. This is a mid-run standard rifle, s.n. 55XXX. I believe the rear sight was a leaf. I added a Weaver K-4 in the late 60s and have since upgraded, still using low scope mounts. Is this helpful? I'd be interested to know what this boils down to.

My dad ordered this rifle at the end of the War. Because it was slow in coming he took advantage of the opportunity to purchase another Model 70, s.n. 92XXX, and then this one was delivered. Bonus!
 
Last edited:
I saw an ad in a WW II era American Rifleman for the standard grade Model 70 at $54. IIRC, the Super Grade was $70. As the prices of everything jumped right after the War, the standard grade went up to $70.
 
Toml;

Is the receiver rear tang tapered or cloverleaf? It very much sounds as though the safely is pre-war.

900F
 
CB900F said:
Toml;

Is the receiver rear tang tapered or cloverleaf? It very much sounds as though the safely is pre-war.

900F
Click to expand...

The tang does not resemble a cloverleaf. It is similar to the shape of the neck of a Coke bottle, smoothly tapered towards the wrist of the stock. IMG_2040.JPG IMG_2042.JPG Do these images help?
 
Toml;

Photo two, darkly, does show the rear tang. That is a "cloverleaf" tang & that's the term used, I didn't create it, but I do agree that it does not look particularly like that vegetation's leaf structure. Nonetheless, you should check the serial number against the Winchester Collector's Society records, that will give you an accurate date of manufacture. The reason I suggest this is that with a cloverleaf receiver and old style safely, that gun may have been made pre-war & commercially sold, rather than a military sale, post-war.

900F
 
CB900F said:
Toml;

Photo two, darkly, does show the rear tang. That is a "cloverleaf" tang & that's the term used, I didn't create it, but I do agree that it does not look particularly like that vegetation's leaf structure. Nonetheless, you should check the serial number against the Winchester Collector's Society records, that will give you an accurate date of manufacture. The reason I suggest this is that with a cloverleaf receiver and old style safely, that gun may have been made pre-war & commercially sold, rather than a military sale, post-war.

900F
Click to expand...

Thanks for the information. Never would have described that as a cloverleaf. Collector's Society records confirms a 1946 date of manufacture; the other in 1948.

Could you enlighten me about pre-war/commercial vs. military/post-war sales?

(Sorry, tark, don't mean to hijack your thread; hope this is helpful to others besides me.)
 
Toml;

Really, there's nothing I meant in that statement to indicate any obscure marketing on Winchester's part. Simply put, commercial sales are to civilian entities, both pre and post war. The various military branches may have purchased some rifles made for the civilian market in WWII, but I'd think those guns were made before all production was turned to military firearms. If Winchester made civilian market guns at all in WWII, there weren't very many at all I'd think & probably none after early 1942. The idea of the statement was that Winchester may have retained some unreleased civilian guns through WWII & then sold them post WWII while they were converting from military production back to civilian production.

To get full & accurate details, I'd find & buy a copy of the Olin/Winchester corporate history.

900F
 
I have a M70 Target that shows on the charts as 1942, but the barrel is dated 1955. I have heard of others. They might have rebarrelled one in 1955, but multiples?
 
I did see a Mdl. 70 in the 1960s marked 6.5X58 Port. The 6.5 Portuguese dated to 1904 and was a popular hunting round. But the Mdl. 70 must have been a gun smith custom. I could never find it listed as a Winchester caliber.:)
 
If you have ever spent time in South Africa you would be familiar with the light Mannlicher carbines owned by professional hunters before WWII. There were two 6.5 Ports. It was said, they could drop an elephant. I would not know? I am sure you could research these cartridges.:thumbup:
 
I am familiar with the .256 aka 6.5x54 Mannlicher, rimmed or not, also the entirely different 6.5x54 Mauser Kurtz.
6.5 Portuguese sporter is a new one on me. But then I haven't been to SA.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

ol' scratch
  • Locked
What is the deal with pre-64 Winchesters?
Replies
9
Views
1K
Vern Humphrey
V
N
  • Locked
Winchester model 70 pre 64
Replies
9
Views
2K
IndianaBoy
I
G
  • Locked
Model 70 Controlled Round Feed
Replies
4
Views
703
Guyon
G
Bwana John
  • Locked
Model 70 Winchester scope base hole pattern, pre vs post
Replies
3
Views
6K
Art Eatman
A
S
  • Locked
hunting with winchester 70 pre 64
Replies
4
Views
455
tn hp
tn hp
Back
Top