Recent Tangfolio Customer Service Experience

[Torian]

So I recently posted about an issue I had with my Elite Match 10mm under the gunsmithing forum. I was having an issue with the trigger pin moving under recoil. I brought the firearm into a local gunsmith and he told me the pin was undersized, and recommended against using some type of adhesive like loctite to hold it in place. According to him, it would be a fairly easy installation, with the right hammer and pin set, to put the new one in. He even offered to do it for free if I brought it in.

Thanking him for the information, I later called Tangfolio customer service thinking I would be go to go on this, and boy was mistaken. I was given two options to get this fixed:

1. Send the entire firearm in (I pay for shipping)

2. Pay 14.00 for a trigger pin (plus 10.00 shipping / handling) to have the pin sent to me.

10.00 shipping and handling...really?

Nowhere in the phone call did I get an apology for a failure on their part to properly QA/QC their product, nor did I get an option of sending back the faulty pin with a return shipping label.

A follow up email complaint to their customer service hasn't even garnered a response (been two weeks).

Pretty disappointed that I was given such a large amount of grief for an item that probably costs them .50 cents to make.

Sigh...

 

[Deus Machina]

Are you sure it's undersized?
My CZ's new pin (the original design here) went in with only a good push on a punch.
See that chamfer around the pin hole? Yeah, the old pin had been pushed into place and then flared at the ends.
It might be a matter of a tapered punch, a brace on the backside, and a good tap with a hammer.

 

[hardluk1]

Good reply

torian Don't think your local smithy is anything special and all knowing ether. he should have come up with the same answer deus did.

 

[wally]

By "Tangfolio" do you mean you called EAA customer service? Let the "we told you so" begin.

 

[Torian]

By "Tangfolio" do you mean you called EAA customer service? Let the "we told you so" begin.

Yes. There seems to be a never ending debate as to referring to them as EAA or Tangfolio. I've given up trying to figure that one out

Regarding the advice from the first two posters:

Yes, I agree, a faulty installation is a possibility, however, if I want a new pin to give me a warm and fuzzy, and to also confirm proper tolerances, I darn well should get what I want. What the actual problem is with the pin is irrelevant when it comes to the poor response from EAA / Tangfolio.

The gun is otherwise a fantastic shooter, very accurate, fantastic trigger (when the pin isn't falling out), and devours hot loads.

The people running this company are as dumb as a rock. What a pathetic way to lose what could have been a loyal customer.

 

[wally]

There seems to be a never ending debate as to referring to them as EAA or Tangfolio.

Tangfolio is the manufacturer, EAA is the importer and responsible for customer service, or lack there of.

The Witness Elite pistols are one of the best buys in the market as long as you don't need customer service. I don't understand why Tangfolio doesn't get someone else to handle their product line, they must realize they lose sales because of the poor support, as complaints are all over the Internet.

 

[M2 Carbine]

I assume you mean EAA.

I can not express in mixed company what I think of EAA.

I bought a Tangfolio Witness 45 ACP steel compact from EAA. Good gun.
I liked it so well I bought the same gun with the plastic frame.
The gun was flat dangerous. When shot the frame would flex, pushing out the take down pin. A couple more shots and I'd be eating the slide.

A couple times I talked to a EAA butt head, that called himself a gunsmith. He wouldn't make a pimple on a gunsmith's butt.

All he kept saying was I was shooting +P ammo (which I wasn't).
Finally he admitted the plastic frame flexed but there was nothing EAA would do about it.

I gave away the guns (with the proper warnings).

I wouldn't have a EAA, Tangfolio gun if it was given to me.

 

[hariph creek]

They should send you a free pin. What a simple/cheap way to retain a customer. Plus keep bad feelings like this off the forums.
The Witness 10mm is the ONLY double stack 10mm, that fits my hand.
I would have one in a heart beat. If not for EAA's (shoddy) reputation.

 

[Torian]

They should send you a free pin. What a simple/cheap way to retain a customer. Plus keep bad feelings like this off the forums.
The Witness 10mm is the ONLY double stack 10mm, that fits my hand.
I would have one in a heart beat. If not for EAA's (shoddy) reputation.

Indeed it is. I can already see the "I told you so" crowd clamoring towards this thread

I still love the pistol, even with the incompetent customer service.

 

[Zaydok Allen]

Sucks. Sorry for your troubles, but yeah, heard stuff like this before.

 

[Bush Pilot]

I have a couple of their 10s, I hope I don't have to send it in. It makes me wonder how many guns go unsold because of their lack of customer support.

 

[A-FIXER]

I was thinking of their Hunter sidearm, I guess I'll wait for the Para version thanks for the info...

 

[Jim K]

I don't have one of those guns, but with your kind permission, I would like to make a general comment. Some guns of that type have a retainer spring that sits in a groove in the trigger pin and prevents the pin from moving. But the spring is offset to one side, and so is the groove. If the pin is put in with the groove on the wrong side, the spring will not sit in the groove and the pin can move out under recoil. The spring is often a combination spring, powering something else (like the slide stop) as well.

Jim

 

[Torian]

I don't have one of those guns, but with your kind permission, I would like to make a general comment. Some guns of that type have a retainer spring that sits in a groove in the trigger pin and prevents the pin from moving. But the spring is offset to one side, and so is the groove. If the pin is put in with the groove on the wrong side, the spring will not sit in the groove and the pin can move out under recoil. The spring is often a combination spring, powering something else (like the slide stop) as well.

Jim

Jim, the pin does not have a groove on it. I believe one of the posters above correctly identified the deficiency in this case. Thank you for the comment all the same.

See that chamfer around the pin hole? Yeah, the old pin had been pushed into place and then flared at the ends.
It might be a matter of a tapered punch, a brace on the backside, and a good tap with a hammer.

 

[joecil]

Armscor handles some of the Tangfolio guns but a limited line and sold under RIA banner. I have a 9mm MAPP1 MS which is the same as the EAA Witness P as far as out ward appearance however the slides are different with one referred to as a wide frame the other sold as a slime frame. Hence parts such as caliber change kits etc won't work on the Armscor versions. Armscor's customer service is the best I've ever dealt with bar none.

 

[Deus Machina]

A much-belated apology to the way I cam across, Torian. You're correct that the issue here is EAA's customer service, and this doesn't excuse them.

Just noting that--assuming it's the same as my CZ--it would be a simple matter to get a punch and a hammer, or offer a local smith the quickest job he's ever done, to bypass their CS completely and sort of flip them the economical bird for it.

 

[Japle]

Wally:
“The Witness Elite pistols are one of the best buys in the market as long as you don't need customer service. I don't understand why Tangfolio doesn't get someone else to handle their product line, they must realize they lose sales because of the poor support, as complaints are all over the Internet.”

I spoke to Mr. Tanfoglio about this at the SHOT Show a few years ago. As soon as he understood what I was talking about, he turned his back on me. Let’s just say I reacted badly.

Bottom line: Tanfoglio knows how bad EAA is and they don’t care.

 

[zaphar]

Perhaps he's locked into some sort of importation contract with EAA that he can't get out of and would rather "not know" about them until he can legally find a new importer. It seems rather odd that he'd do that unless there was a particular reason.

 

[cfullgraf]

It has been a long time, like since the mid 1990s, but i had good service buying parts from the US distributer of Tangfolio guns. I had a Springfield 40 S&W P9C that Springfield had abandoned. Since the gun was manufactured by Tangfolio, they had replacement parts that would work.

It may have been EAA that I dealt with but I have slept since then.

In general, i was not happy with the reliability of the pistol but was pleased with being able to get replacement parts. The folks I dealt with were very helpful and delivery was prompt. Of course, lots of things change in 15 years or so.

By the way, the P9C is no longer part of my collection, a rare event for me.

 

[Torian]

Interesting interaction. Too bad he didn't have the courage to thank you for the honest opinion.

If I owned the company, you'd be exactly the type of individual I'd want to talk to.

 

[Salmoneye]

Can't simply match the roll pin diameter at the hardware store, trim to length, and tap it in yourself?

 

[Torian]

Can't simply match the roll pin diameter at the hardware store, trim to length, and tap it in yourself?

As I pointed out earlier to Dues Machina, it is the principle that is at issue here. Yes...I could like go to a local hardware store and get the pin machined or sized as needed. In fact, I could probably just go to my gunsmith and use the same pin, this time, properly installed. However, I purchased this firearm from EAA, so why should I have to waste my time and money going to them?

The point of this thread is not what I can do to fix it on my end, but rather the response I received from EAA when I tried to get them to resolve this problem. It was a trivial matter that I expected them to quickly resolve with a professional demeanor. I received neither.

 

[Zaydok Allen]

Sell the gun, never buy from them again. Problem solved, and you stuck to your priciples. The only way Tanfoglio is going to give a crap about how much EAA sucks is if they stop selling guns in this country. THEN they will pay attention.

 

[Torian]

Sell the gun, never buy from them again. Problem solved, and you stuck to your priciples. The only way Tanfoglio is going to give a crap about how much EAA sucks is if they stop selling guns in this country. THEN they will pay attention.

Where else am I going to find a good double stack 10mm on the market? If you respond with something that mentions "glock", I don't know if we can stay friends...

 

[Japle]

I replaced the roll pins in my Witness pistols with drill rod. I hate roll pins.

After trying to deal with EAA’s “customer service” I sold my 9mm and .38 Super Witnesses. The only one I have left is my Witness .45. It was part of a special run, with a full-size frame and compact, ported slide and barrel. I replaced the original ported barrel with the one shown. Both barrels function the same, except the longer one isn’t ported and gives higher velocity.
The grips are Hawaiian Koa, custom made for the pistol.

It’s for sale. Cheap.
Be advised that the gun locks the slide open with rounds still in the mag pretty frequently and EAA’s famous “customer service gunsmith” refuses to fix it.

Please don’t post advice on ways I can fix it. I’ve tried them all.