Quantcast
  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Registration of Home-Made Sound Suppressor

Discussion in 'Legal' started by carnaby, Jan 9, 2007.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. carnaby

    carnaby Member

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    Messages:
    1,356
    Location:
    Bellingham, WA
    I know I have to register the thing, but my question is: can I register it, destroy it, make a new one and not have to register the new one and pay the tax? Seems like perfecting a home-made suppressor would be awfully expensive otherwise.

    That, and I live in Washington State, so I'd have to go to Oregon or Idaho to try it out.

    Lastly, does the shooter even hear the ballistic crack from a super sonic round? The shock wave should be conical and never pass the shooter's ears. Or is it the reflections after the wave hits the ground and other objects? Either way, it should be quieter than standing anywhere in front of the muzzle. Anyone know?
     
  2. wdlsguy

    wdlsguy Member

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2004
    Messages:
    2,880
    Location:
    TX
    There is a sticky thread titled "Homemade can... FORM 1" in the Suppressors forum at ar15.com that might be useful.
     
  3. carnaby

    carnaby Member

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    Messages:
    1,356
    Location:
    Bellingham, WA
    Good fracking grief! One of those guys got a letter from the BATFEXYZLMNOP which states in part (emphases mine):

    So if I clip one of my fingernails just right to help with the assembly of a certain part of a suppressor, does my finger magically become a "silencer"? This bureaucrat is full of bureaucrap, trying to cover all possible bases. I think being such an idiot should null and void his entire letter. :mad:

    Even Finland doesn't regulate suppressors any more. They've come into the modern era and realized that there aren't any drawbacks and only benefits to suppressors. Argh!
     
  4. carnaby

    carnaby Member

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    Messages:
    1,356
    Location:
    Bellingham, WA
    Here's the Finnish study which also concludes that suppressors are not effective for poaching since they do NOT SILENCE a weapon.
     
  5. gezzer

    gezzer Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2004
    Messages:
    2,052
    Location:
    NH
    If you have made it before you have a an approved form 1 it you are in DEEP Crap. You cannot make it until you have an approved form 1.

    Get a form 1 approved and then make it. You are then the manufacture of the item. If you need to repair it you may as long as the bad parts are destroyed first and no extras are made.

    If you are serious go to Subguns.com the folks there are more knowledgeable about NFA than here.
     
  6. carnaby

    carnaby Member

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    Messages:
    1,356
    Location:
    Bellingham, WA
    In the letter in the sticky at arfcom, the guy (idiot?) at batfe states clearly that you must get a new form1 for EACH part you replace, since each part is in itself a silencer. It is a complete non-sequitor, but that's what he stated.
     
  7. DMF

    DMF Member

    Joined:
    May 10, 2004
    Messages:
    2,247
    Location:
    Nomad
    If you have a complaint about the legal definition of a silencer blame the guys who wrote the definition, which is NOT the ATF.

    18USC921(a)(24):
     
  8. carnaby

    carnaby Member

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    Messages:
    1,356
    Location:
    Bellingham, WA
    Which idiots wrote that? Anyway, there it seems to be all about INTENT, but in the ATF bureacrat letter, they don't seem to give a ratt's butt about intent. Heck, I've got a roll of tape that I "designed" into a wad with the INTENTION of using it to diminish the report of my portable firearm. Is it a silencer? Do I need to pay $200? Am I going to jail for 10 years and do I have to pay a $250k fine?

    It boggles the mind.
     
  9. Futuristic

    Futuristic Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2004
    Messages:
    109
    Location:
    Baton Rouge, LA
    carnaby wrote:

    That is the interpretation that BATFE has of the law. Based on my reading they are probably right, the Suppressor legislation is one of the more precise pieces of legislation I have seen passed by the Congress.

    The reason that Suppressor Manufacturers can make replacement parts is that they are treated slightly differently since they have a Type 07 FFL with SOT (Special Occupational Tax) paid for manufacturing Suppressors. This means that they don't pay an individual Tax on each part they make, they pay an overall yearly tax that covers all parts made. Otherwise they would also have to pay Tax on each part made.

    It is highly impractical to make your own Suppressor (legally) AND make replacement parts as needed (legally). It works out much cheaper and easier in the long run to just buy the things (legally!).

    Futuristic
     
  10. carnaby

    carnaby Member

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    Messages:
    1,356
    Location:
    Bellingham, WA
    I just "made" a silencer without a form 1. What do you think?
    [​IMG]
    I can hear the AFT pulling up out front as we speak! :p
     
  11. DMF

    DMF Member

    Joined:
    May 10, 2004
    Messages:
    2,247
    Location:
    Nomad
    Yes. The roll of tape itself, or even the wad of tape are not silencers unless they are "designed or redesigned, and intended for use in assembling or fabricating a firearm silencer or firearm muffler," which you have confessed to doing. If the item is not "intended only for use in such assembly or fabrication" of a silencer, then the government would need to prove it's intended use. Not an easy thing to do sometimes, very easy to do other times.

    BTW, the people you are calling "idiots" are the US Congress.
     
  12. carnaby

    carnaby Member

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    Messages:
    1,356
    Location:
    Bellingham, WA
    Yeah, I know, it was a rhetorical question, they are largely idiots. What about that bunk about cutting the integral muffled barrel off of a paintball gun? They say that just cutting the barrel off constitutes making a silencer whether you intend it for that reason or not. Did I say idiots? That's the ATF talking there, "interpreting" things in the most general possible way.
     
  13. carnaby

    carnaby Member

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    Messages:
    1,356
    Location:
    Bellingham, WA
    Yeah, but you can, with one Form 1, make a complete "silencer", no? So why do you then need a new Form 1 for EACH replacement part. If ever there were cause for a "duh" moment, that was it.
     
  14. GunnySkox

    GunnySkox Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2004
    Messages:
    1,129
    Location:
    Raleigh, NC
    And? Sounds pretty accurate to me.

    ~GnSx
     
  15. Derby FALs

    Derby FALs Member In Memoriam

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2004
    Messages:
    978
    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    Too polite...
     
  16. bogie

    bogie Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2003
    Messages:
    9,569
    Location:
    St. Louis, in the Don't Show Me state
    The way I read that, one has to register their lathe/mill in order to make a silencer.
     
  17. Harry Tuttle

    Harry Tuttle Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2003
    Messages:
    3,093
    http://www.corin.com/bill/paintball/silencer.html

     
  18. carnaby

    carnaby Member

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    Messages:
    1,356
    Location:
    Bellingham, WA
    I sent the following message to my state senator and my two representatives. I wonder if it has any hope?

     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2007
  19. molonlabe

    molonlabe Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2004
    Messages:
    873
    Location:
    Mountaineer country WV
    So, I keep my S&W in my bedroom next to the bed. We have 4 pillows on the bed. Does this mean we need to register each pillow? What about the pillows in the other bed rooms? heck what about the potatoes in the potato bins?:D
     
  20. ceetee

    ceetee Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2003
    Messages:
    1,998

    This is not the first time this fact has been noticed:


    "Suppose I was a Congressman. Suppose I was an idiot.

    But I repeat myself..."


    --Mark Twain
     
  21. MD_Willington

    MD_Willington Member

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2005
    Messages:
    3,692
    Location:
    Canuck in SE WA State.
    Man to think we used to use "tall boy" beer cans on the end of our Marlins when we were teenagers back home in Canada... Of course the evidence of our evil doings was destroyed at the recyclers :rolleyes:

    I guess we better start registering beer cans here in the States, the cans were somewhat registered in Canada as you had to put down a 10 cent deposit on each can...

    Crazy laws!
     
  22. Sniper X

    Sniper X Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2007
    Messages:
    2,635
    Location:
    New Mexico
    Crazy laws indeed

    I wonder when the US beaurcrats will notice it is beneficial to their re-election to grandfather these cheesy laws? If The Republik of ********** had not adopted such assonine laws about firearms I may still live there paying idiotic amounts of money each year in taxes! I moved away from there because of their politics. I now live in New MExico where gun laws are at least fair.
     
  23. Flintlock Tom

    Flintlock Tom Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2006
    Messages:
    180
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    Since the BAFTE insists on a strictly literal interpretation of the law; why do they not consider earmuffs as sound suppressors since they, very definately, are designed for "muffling, or diminishing the report of a portable firearm"?

    :rolleyes:
     
  24. ctdonath

    ctdonath Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2003
    Messages:
    3,618
    Location:
    Cumming GA
    Don't need Finland for that. Just fire 1 supersonic round from my "silenced" .223 - it's quieter than usual, yes, but hardly "silenced". Still friggin' loud.
     
  25. Ranb

    Ranb Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2003
    Messages:
    896
    Location:
    WA, USA
    I also live in WA. So far the local sheriff has signed 8 ATF form 1's for me. It sure does suck that I can only use them I leave the state. If there is a policeman at the range, I will let him/her give them a try as the AG has exempted the police from prosecution for using a silencer.

    Ranb
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page