Reloading Browning BLR 308

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srini_durand

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Just wondering, I recently came into a 1975 BLR 308cal; looking like it is brand new. Shoots wonderful with factory ammo.

Reloading however it has rather expensive taste, in order to get the rounds
to eject properly.

Equipment used:

RCBS dies, full length resize.

Wilson Case gauge to measure head space

Each case trimmed to 2.010 exactly ( Mid point as I measured brand new core lokts)

Here is what I noticed:

1) Building a round starting at min load with Varget, occasionally get a round that does not eject. Does not matter ranging from mid to max load as recommended from Hogdon charts. However, if I trim down to 2.005 and use Varget trouble really begins ejecting leading to madness and lots of curse words.

2) Building a round with CFE223 at min load to max load 90% of all rounds stick when ejecting. Not so bad you need to pry it open but enough so you do not want to use this load.

I Double checked each round with Wilson Gauge before and also after the bullet was seated to ensure the round was not somehow bent.

I Double checked the crimp to ensure no jagged edges and properly trimmed.
Tried with and without a crimp BTW. Even use 0000 steel wool after the
trim and clean up to ensure no rough edges.

Same situation no matter what bullet weight, 150 hard ball or 125 sst.

One thing noted is CFE223 has a slower burn rate than Varget. Might the situation improve to factory ammo conditions if I even step further down or rather fast powder burn rate.

Browning no help.. obviously with reloads.

Also Ultra Max professional reloads eject like crap too.
So cases trimmed to 2.010 using Varget works 95% of the time like factory ammo.

One thing I noticed is when using a dummy round and loose bullet to measure the breech, backing the bullet 5 thousands off the start of the rifing places the bullet too long to fit into the mag.

Any ideas what is going on here? I would like to understand what is going on here. Also, would like to build a round that I can say 99.9% will eject correctly.
 
Browning BLR chambers run tight. Yours maybe more than normal. I would use a small base sizing die and not mix brass w/ other guns.
 
The blr's for the most part had tight chambers. Are you having problems with ejection or extraction? Usually small base dies will cure case sticking or hard extraction.
 
The BAR, BLR, and I think maybe the Savage 99 are the main rifles that RCBS recommended small base dies for. You can buy a small base sizer as a separate die, since you already have a set of dies. I think this will cure your problem. Lightman
 
Will try a set, just placing the order. Funny rounds chambers correctly no problems. I am kind of a stickler for repeatability when if comes to reloading, we'll see with the small base dies. Thanks guys..
 
I've loaded for our BLR's with standard dies for years now. If your rounds chamber alright, but have tight extraction you're probably experiencing pressure problems. Double check your manual to make sure the powder charge you are using isn't over the max. Drop your loads back 10% and work up slowly. I have a 270 (not a blr) that I can't get much over the minimum listed loads before things start getting out of hand.
 
Pressure Problem? What brass are you reloading?

Even use 0000 steel wool after the
trim and clean up to ensure no rough edges.
Click to expand...
You need a chamfer deburring tool.
One thing I noticed is when using a dummy round and loose bullet to measure the breech, backing the bullet 5 thousands off the start of the rifing places the bullet too long to fit into the mag.
Click to expand...
Maximum COL is 2.810" to a minimum of 2.490"
 
As all have said, BLRs are tight. My '76 BLR is tighter than my case gauge so I use the BLR to check my cases. I found that I had to adjust my die to really go about a 1/4 to a 1/2 turn past it touching the shell holder.

It is worth all the trouble though. Mine will shoot nice groups at 100 yards. It's my dad's rifle, so I know it's lineage ;-)
 
My Belgum BLR in 243 handles all factory loads just fine but for reloads I have to use a small base sizer. The loads I built for my bolt guns will not chamber.
 
My recent production .308 Win BLR chamber is tighter than my Wilson case gage.

I have to use the chamber as the final gage for resized brass to confirm if they will fit.

If a case or a cartridge won't fall and release from the chamber under it's own weight w/o getting hung up, I don't use it. My takedown version makes it much easier to use the barrel as a gage :)

I'm resisting playing the small base die "card" so far, but I understand the syren call...
 
jhwolfe said:
My Belgum BLR in 243 handles all factory loads just fine but for reloads I have to use a small base sizer. The loads I built for my bolt guns will not chamber.
Click to expand...
I have a small base die on order, suppose to be in next monday. So I will give it a try, does not hurt to have a backup set of 308 dies in anycase. Makes sense though, new cases shot in this gun, resized, trimmed, chamfered seem to work perfect. Cases, picked up at the range; completely resized using the full length resize seem to be the 1s to give me trouble.

What is strange, is all rounds chamber perfect. I wish I was smarter to understand the more about the physics of what is happening. I would image case hardness has a bit to do as well with the problem.

The idea RCBS recommends using small base die to help level action guns means, in my mind, there is something I do not understand about the situation or rather something I have misunderstood about the situation.

I guess I am about to learn, I hope, the guns really shoots sweet though its is worth the effort.
 
Cases, picked up at the range; completely resized using the full length resize seem to be the 1s to give me trouble.
Click to expand...

That's probably the biggest thing to stop doing. I've not had an Blr yet that would work well with cases fired from another rifle. Maybe it you put a couple of fireform session on that range brass it might work better, but that brass might be better for a bolt gun or trading material.
When accuracy testing these BLR's keep in mind they are a hunting rifle, and have lite weight barrels. Stick to 3 shot groups , or let the barrel cool between 3 shot strings and that rifle will likely shoot clover leaves all day long with it's favored load.
All the BLR's I've been around seem to favor Remington brass and factory loads.
 
I had significant extraction problems with a "foreign" bulk ammunition brand of brass in the BLR (*not* LAPUA or Norma) that I got as range pickups. Checked with another local reloader, he said the brass was poor and didn't recommend it's use for any kind of reloading. (I don't remember the brand, but I'll post it later when I check my notes).

So all brass is not created equal. Using range pickups also means you could be dealng with raw product that needs a small base die to get down to the dimensions the BLR needs. (Because the prior firing was in a very generous size chamber).
 
not sure I'll ever be able to shoot "clover leaves" :) maybe 30 yrs ago with my GP100s but not anymore at least Clover has nothing to worry about.
 
Cases, picked up at the range; completely resized using the full length resize seem to be the 1s to give me trouble.
Click to expand...
If you pick up any of my brass off the range it is because the primer pockets are loose, the neck is split or there may be indication of insipient case separation.

My rule-to-self regarding range brass is to never pick up range brass unless the guy next to me is firing factory-new rounds and tossing his brass.

Poper
 
rodregier said:
S&B in .308 Win was my nemesis. I wouldn't recommend their fired brass to any reloader I liked...
Click to expand...
One would think that after it was completely resized, trimmed, inspected, and passes Wilson gauge for headspace and case length brass would be fine. Sort of suggests the hardness of different brass has a great deal of impact. Funny, primmer show no sign of overloading.
 
My experience is that the S&B looked and gaged fine up to and including firing until I tried to extract it.

Fairly difficult extraction in the BLR. Now, the BLR doesn't have a lot of extra margin in that department, but none of the other stuff that gently fit into the chamber had any issues coming out again after firing in the BLR. The loads I was testing were fairly mild too, I wasn't trying to max out the cartridge. I suspect brass formula/hardness was the issue with the S&B. The S&B brass has a slightly different color, more red and less yellow.
 
I used small base dies to cure CHAMBERING problems. You say the rounds CHAMBER OK, but are difficult to extract AFTER FIRING--correct?
I personally don't see how the kind of die you used would affect the extraction/ejection on a lever gun. This is after the EASILY CHAMBERED round has been fire-formed to your chamber.

Factory loads do good? I would be taking a closer look at my brass for signs of pressure etc. The primers may look OK, but are there any marks from the bolt face on the headstamp?

Also, in a mag-fed repeating firearm, you are limited to the OAL prescribed by the magazine unless you plan to use the gun as a single shot. I always load to max mag length and never play with seating depth from that point, unless it's to seat deeper. All the "seating just off the lands" business is out the window.

I don't know about the Wilson case gage, but most all drop-in case gages I've seen are simply straight-drilled to a certain depth to check headspace. In other words the inside walls of the gage are NOT tapered like your chamber. The only case gages I've found that are tapered like a rifle chamber are made by JP Enterprises and available in 223 and 308. They are made using actual chamber reamers. There may be others that are made the same way, but I've never heard of them. The regular straight-walled case gages will measure headspace fine, but they will not catch a collapsed/bulged shoulder etc. I drop every loaded round in my JP gage before it goes in the ammo can, and rest assured it will chamber when called upon.

http://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-t.../barrel-tools/match-case-gauge-prod41313.aspx

YMMV
 
I'm only having extraction problems with one kind of brass that another experienced reloader also says is junk.

Factory ammunition and my other reloads in other brass extract just great in my BLR.

My point was primarily to illustrate that not all brass is created equal.
 
Not sure you answered my question which was were you having trouble extracting or ejecting? The blr mechanism has zero caming unlike a typical bolt action gun. It's easy to get a case stuck. If you do get one stuck in the chamber do not pry on the lever. Instead take a range rod, wooden dowel and tap it to dislodge the offending case.

I had a good friend that learned the hard way and tried prying on the lever which broke the gear mechanism and it was all downhill from there. Browning sent him the parts, but it takes an expert to get the gears timed correctly. He finally sent the gun back to them and they had it up an running in short order.

By the way Browning recommends or used to small base dies.
 
Don't know if the owner's manual came with your gun or not. Most folks assume the safety is half cock which is wrong on the pre81 which is what you have. The safety is with the hammer all the way down. Just thought I'd let you know. If you can find an extra magazine at a decent price you might want to buy a spare.
 
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