5.56 reloading issue

[buba68]

Thanks for the help guys. That’s why I came here. After reading some of your comments I have done some of the trouble shooting you guys mentioned. I remeasured my gun with the OAL Gauge and the vmax. I still come up with 1.931.5 as an average. But, I might have Misread my OAL Gauge when combined with the comparator. I didn’t zero it out after adding the head space comparator on it. When I did this I got a lower number. I now have 1.889.5 as an average on the rounds. This length does fit in all of my mags.

As far as the dies go, I did a full length resize on them and I didn’t change anything on the die when I switched from 223 to 5.56.
I did try some test loading on just the cases. I did empty 223 and 5.56 cases. Didn’t have any real issues with either. A tiny bit stiff but nothing like what I have to do with the Vmax rounds.

Ok sounds like you are getting closer. I would suggest you forget the OAL gauge and only worry about the OAL of the complete cartridge which is the dimension from the tip of the bullet to the bottom of the brass case. The OAL for the case with the Vmax bullet needs to be in the 2.2 inch range I load a 69 grain sierra to 2.23 and it chambers ok. So you need to seat your Vmax bullet deeper and you should be good to go.
Here is a pix that shows where the OAL is measured.

The dies that you use do they use a small base resizing die? A lot of guys that reload for semi autos use a small base die to make sure the brass will chamber in any gun they are shot in. Hornady and RCBS make die sets with a small base resizing die. The Hornady set item #564228 has a seating die which has a floating sleeve which helps to hold the bullet in alignment with the case better. Not telling you to go out and buy a set of dies just curious as to what you use. Keep us posted on your progress.

 

[lordpaxman]

Talk about a classic Kepner-Tregoe! A troubleshooting technique that asks the question “what changed”? If the only thing different is the bullet, there’s your answer. The lesson is you need to check Max OAL with every bullet you use, and don’t forget to write it down, keep good notes.

Also, you guys were right about the bolt carrier. The carrier doesn’t close all of the way with these Vmax rounds. I have no idea how I didn’t notice this! So I guess I’ll need to def shorten them up some more.

As others have said, pretty lucky it didn’t close enough! Let us know how you make out. Good luck!

 

[armoredman]

Ditto on the Small Base dies - I used the Lee Full Length when I was loading for my BREN 805, with a mil spec chamber, but the civilian chambers in two ARs said "no" on a few rounds, causing the same issue, stuck and mortar. I switched to the Small Base RBCS die all those problems vanished.

 

[wdsimpso]

sharpie the bullet, neck, and shoulder of the vmax round that is an issue. Chamber it and then see where the sharpie is rubbed off....there's your interference.
do your 5.56/vmax rounds fit in the magazine?

Thank you, I will try this when I get back home tonight. And yes, they load into the magazine with no issue.

 

[wdsimpso]

Ok sounds like you are getting closer. I would suggest you forget the OAL gauge and only worry about the OAL of the complete cartridge which is the dimension from the tip of the bullet to the bottom of the brass case. The OAL for the case with the Vmax bullet needs to be in the 2.2 inch range I load a 69 grain sierra to 2.23 and it chambers ok. So you need to seat your Vmax bullet deeper and you should be good to go.
Here is a pix that shows where the OAL is measured.

The dies that you use do they use a small base resizing die? A lot of guys that reload for semi autos use a small base die to make sure the brass will chamber in any gun they are shot in. Hornady and RCBS make die sets with a small base resizing die. The Hornady set item #564228 has a seating die which has a floating sleeve which helps to hold the bullet in alignment with the case better. Not telling you to go out and buy a set of dies just curious as to what you use. Keep us posted on your progress.

View attachment 941488

Thank you. I actually am using the Hornady 564228. I will shorten the rounds and def try it out. I was just trying to make the most accurate hunting round I could with these Vmax.

 

[KYregular]

I load mine all at 2.255 and see no need to load a semi auto out to, or jammed into the lands. Your asking for trouble. I have loaded many sub moa loads without going any farther, including the 60 grain vmax. Save loading close to lands for the bolt guns, especially if you plan on shooting those rounds thru multiple AR platform weapons.

 

[wdsimpso]

So I just shortened the Vmax rounds to an even 2.200 overall length. Now they cycle fine. I haven't fired them yet however, Will most likely do that tomorrow. My next question now goes back to the 223 rounds. They are set at 2.270 give or take .002 +/- in overall length. They shot fine the other day like I said before. Should I shorten these rounds to the 2.200 or if you guys think this length is fine, should I make the Vmax the 2.270? Sorry for so many questions. I'm just trying to tap into yalls knowledge being a beginner loader.

 

[Demi-human]

They shot fine the other day like I said before.

Why fix what isn’t broken?

 

[David Hoback]

Hmm ... So all the rounds go in the mags with no problem, but won’t chamber? Odd. Typically mags are 2.26” max OAL, plus/minus. I’ve never heard of any 2.26” round hitting the lands?? But if 2.20” is working well with these bullets, go with it!

As for the other bullets you are using, if 2.27” OAL fits in your mags, and fires in your rifle without any problem, stay with it. No need to change the OAL just because!

Welcome to reloading. One of my favorite pastimes. I find it centers my focus, and helps calm the nerve pain I deal with. Hope you enjoy it as much as I do. Oh yeah.... NEVER be sorry for asking questions. You are doing this very intelligently. Not afraid to do yourself, and asking/learning as you go. I commend you my friend.

 

[buba68]

So I just shortened the Vmax rounds to an even 2.200 overall length. Now they cycle fine. I haven't fired them yet however, Will most likely do that tomorrow. My next question now goes back to the 223 rounds. They are set at 2.270 give or take .002 +/- in overall length. They shot fine the other day like I said before. Should I shorten these rounds to the 2.200 or if you guys think this length is fine, should I make the Vmax the 2.270? Sorry for so many questions. I'm just trying to tap into yalls knowledge being a beginner loader.

It sounds like we finally got you there. If your Vmax rounds function ok at 2.20 let them go at that length. No need to change them. When you go back to the 223 rounds I would run them at 2.27. When you do an actual live fire test if they cycle ok and get you the accuracy you are looking for run both at the lengths they are at now. Don't sweat a couple thousandths one way or the other. We are not building rocket motors.

What brand mags are you running? Promags will usually let you load a little longer than a steel mag. But even if you can load longer doesn't mean you need to. The Hornady dies you are using should be the small base dies so that is good. Keep us posted on your progress after you do live fire tomorrow.

 

[71GTO]

So I am new to reloading and have referred to this forum for help for other issues. But this one baffles me on how to fix. So I am using a Hornady AP Press to reload 223 and 5.56 rounds for my Daniels Defense AR. I loaded about 500 55gr 223 rounds the other day and had no issues when I shot them yesterday.

Now comes my issue. I loaded 5 5.56 rounds using Hornady 60gr Vmax bullets (loading this round for coyote hunting in my AR) with Winchester WSR primers and 8028 XBR powder. The casings were all trimmed to 1.750. I used an OAL and headspace gauge to measure the inside of my rifle for the Vmax rounds. I found a max OAL of 2.918. However, my magazines will only allow for a 2.894 max. I go outside and test fire a few rounds. First trigger pull, **Click** no boom and I have to really pull to extract the bullet. Second round, Boom and ejection was just fine. Third trigger pull, Boom and ejection.

So I load 10 more rounds up of the 5.56 Vmax to take to the range to dial my AR in with them. Get to the range and every trigger pull is the same. Click, hard pull to eject, Click, hard pull to eject, Click, hard pull to eject, Click, hard pull to eject.

So I mag dumped another 40 of the 223 rounds I had also made at the same time as the Vmax rounds. Again, I had no issues with these rounds.

I thought there may be a primer issue. I checked the rounds and there were no indentions on the primers when I checked them. So my guess is that the primers are recessed to far into the brass preventing the firing pin from striking them. But I don't see any adjustment for primer depth on my press. Maybe when I cut the crimp out of this brass I somehow cut a deeper primer pocket?

Any help would be great. Again, I am new to the loading game, so sorry if this is a stupid question.

I just read your post and am very curious as to what brand magazine that you are using that will accept a 223/556 round that has an OAL of 2.894"?? Thank you

 

[Skgreen]

1. Welcome to THR.
2. IMHO, and from my own experiences, a new reloader with a comparator = more frustration than it's worth. Plenty of time for that kinda entertainment later.
3. Use published data / Hornady manual to set your COL the 'old school' way.

THR NOT RESPONSIBLE - USE AT YOUR OWN RISK

From Hornady #9 and Hodgdon website:
60 gr Vmax part # 22281 - COL 2.250"

223:

Winchester brass and primer
Hodgdon 24" barrel / Hornady 26"
IMR 8208 XBR
Hornady - MAX load 25.3 gr @ 3000 FPS
Hodgdon - MAX load 23.6 gr @ 3057 FPS

5.56 NATO

Hodgdon - NO DATA
Hornady 20" barrel Hornady brass - Winchester primer
IMR 8208 XBR
Hornady - MAX load 24.4 gr @ 3000 FPS

Confusing/Contradictory? Can be. Not uncommon to see such things either.

(In this instance, it appears that the Hornady 5.56 brass may have less case capacity than Winchester brass. Couldn't tell you 'what's up' with the Hornady vs Hogdgon 223 data),

Keep it simple! / Be safe! / Have fun!