Reloading flukes

[hk940]

Hi all:
I have bee reloading and shooting for forty years with out a problem,until recently.
About five years ago I bought a Rem 700 VSSF in .223
I tried working up an accurate load with different components but could not get it to shoot any better than 1 moa. (I know I am spoiled, I shoot a 6ppc that will shoot much better than I can), any way I had about two boxes of the most accurate load for that rifle left over. (55gr rem power lock hp 27.2 gr BLC-2 lot 2, Rem cases weighed to 3% variation Fed primers velocity 3250)
In the following years I sold the rifle and bought a Rem 700 LH 223, when I tried the loads in the new gun I was amazed, I put eight shots into one ragged hole .700 at 100 yds. That was it! I had my load for this rifle, so I loaded up about 100 rounds and was off to PA.
When I fired the first round I noticed the bolt was a little hard to open.
When I fired the second round I could not open the bolt.
After several attempts I was able to get the bolt open and extract the case which was firmly attached to the bolt face. After some surgery I was able to remove the case (with the extractor) the primer was totally gone as well as the flash hole. The opening in the case head was as large as the primer pocket.
The temperature was within 2 or 3 degrees during both sessions.
The only thing I can come up with is I had four cans of the powder and I used a different can for the new loads.
Can a different lot of powder have that much difference to create a overload?

My second problem with ammo was with factory ammo. I had a partial box of Rem 6mm 100gr pointed soft point that was about 35 years old, It has been stored in GI ammo cans and in a climate controlled room. The first round fired fine,the second round blew the base of the primer away. When I sized the cases I fired, and the rest of the fired cases four of the primers back ends were punched out but the side wall of the primer was left behind.
Has any one ever had a problem like this with factory ammo?
Any feed back would be appreciated.

 

[Lost Sheep]

Thanks for asking our advice.

Let me make sure I got this straight.

New gun. Handloads that show alarming pressure signs, but those same handloads behaved well in a different rifle.

Factory loads (but 35 years old) that show alarming pressure signs in that same rifle.

Would you suspect that the rifle might be the problem? Tight dimensions, perhaps?

Can you run some of those problematic rounds through another rifle? Can you buy a few rounds of factory-fresh rounds to run through your new rifle?

Just a few thoughts off the top of my head. I hope they help.

Lost Sheep

edit: Oops! I mis-read your post. I thought you were talking about ONE rifle. I'm stumped.

 

[FROGO207]

With the new 223 rifle I would think tight/short chamber/long brass creating over pressure. That as long as loads were below max for the propellant used in them-I did not check your data. Returns to the point that every firearm has a different chamber/pet load. I would check chamber length and bullet seat length with the new rifle first. How does it fire with factory ammo? Is that the same length of brass and bullet as your reloads are?

In the second was the ammo fired in the same rifle as it was 35 years ago? Did you reload 35 years ago? The primers in the other previously fired rounds could have been bad but you may have not noticed as it is now that you are punching primers out to reload the rounds. I have had the same problem with primers separating but always on brass with crimped primers. If a new rifle, it might be a tight chamber also. Could have been some bad ammo/primers from way back then is my best attempt to analyze this one for you.

 

[hk940]

Reloading flukes reply

You are correct. I am talking about two different rifles. The rifle I had the blown case was a Rem 700 .223. The load that I had the blown case in was a load that was very accurate last summer and had not shown signs of excessive pressure. I pulled several heads and checked the charge weights and they were within a tenth of a grain of what they were suppose to be.I have thought about trying these loads in another rifle but I don't want to risk damaging another rifle.(I was lucky that the only damage was a broken extractor.)
I know it is a pain to pull 100+ heads but that is a small price to pay.

The second rifle that I had a blown primer in was a Browning B78 in 6mm rem
using factory ammo(Remington-Peters cases)
Last night I gathered up all of empty R-P cases in 6mm I had (about 120) and sorted them by weight they ranged from 166.9 to 185.0 gr.
This batch was different from other batches I have sorted in the past,most times there is a low weight a high weight and the majority in the middle.(I separate my cases to within no more than 3% variation) The so called Bell curve. This batch was more or less spread out evenly over twenty different weights. I have about eight rounds left of the factory ammo that I am going to pull the heads and sort the cases by weight and start from scratch with a new load.
I will post the results when I am done.

 

[Cop Bob]

I too thinking tight chamber, over length case, seating depth issues.. I have a 17 rem that is really bad about stretching cases, and blew some primer pockets and had some sticky bolts.. closer inspection showed rifling starting to engrave itself on the case mouth... I tend to measure and trim a lot more these days...

But the factory loads blowing out has me stumped... I have shot stuff that was unbelievably old and not had issues... Snipers in Viet Nam used to have WWI surplus ammo dropped to them, as it was the only 30-06 in inventory at the time, with no issues and 800 yd hits..

 

[gamestalker]

I'm leaning more toward a head space issue, like excessive haed space? I've had my issues with factory ammunition that siexed the bolt over the years as bad as what you've described, but the primer, and or pocket, didn't blow out. And as someone else pointed out above, the same rifle had probelms with a well establsihed hand load too? I would be looking at that entire action and suspect you'll discover something that is out of spec. by a pretty good amount.
I've been reloading for a very long time as well and know your frustration. Our level of experience and attention to detail pretty much eliminates the hand load from the possible cause. But, it probably couldn't hurt to pull 1 or 2 of your bullets and check the powder charge and if possible, make sure you didn't inadvertantly use the wrong powder. I've done that on one occasion no too long ago, and was fortunate enough to realize my error prior to seating the bullets.