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Remington 870P- Lots of Questions

Discussion in 'Shotguns' started by Snowblind, Feb 15, 2011.

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  1. Snowblind

    Snowblind Member

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    New member (but been following for a while).

    Planning on getting an 870P, but have had so many questions about it that I never got around to buying.

    I suppose I'll start with what I had in mind. The ideal shotty was an 870P with the standard synthetic stock and ribbed forend, plus two-shot mag extension and "Ghost Ring" sights.

    So here's where the questions start. What would the aforementioned setup cost me? I've seen/heard numbers ranging from as little as $500 to as much as $1,000. My planned max budget was $1,000, but of course I'd love to save some if I could. (Ammo isn't free.)

    Next question: what is the difference between the "Standard Synthetic" and "Standard SPEEDFEED" stocks? I know that some of the SPEEDFEED stocks come with tubes built in for spare ammo (this is definitely NOT something that I want). Which one is just the plain old synthetic stock?

    As for sights, how are the Ghost Ring sights? They sure look cool, but do they really help? Looking at some of the pics online, the aperture for the rear sight looks pretty tiny, which would drive me absolutely crazy. (I fired an M4 with a peep sight that looked to be about the same size aperture, and it was thoroughly irritating.) Also, how exactly do they mount? The rear assembly looks like it's screwed to the back of the receiver, does this mean it's not really removable? Would the assembly get in the way if I wanted to add additional optics?

    Also, on a tangent topic to optics, according to New York law, laser sights are illegal, at least the kind that project a laser dot on the target, but what about optics that utilize a laser/ holographic reticle?

    Thanks for being patient with a newbie. :p
     
  2. AndyJ

    AndyJ Member

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    Well, you are gonna get tons of replies to your query and they usually degenerate into two branches -- mag extension vs none and 'Why don't you get a Mossberg?' The longer the thread gets the more personal preferences will overwhelm what you are asking as the OP. Oh well, such is the nature of the internet and free advice.

    To answer your question-- the ghost ring rear sight is pretty pricey because it sets toward the back of the receiver on the curve. As you know, 870's are not drilled and tapped. So to set the Ghost Ring in, you either get it from the factory or you use a jig that is no longer manufactured. A simple bead is my preference for fast acquisition and ease of use. One step further== Get an XS Big Dot sight that JB welds over the bead and you are certainly good to go. It is an easily installed option.

    I prefer a set of wood furniture because it absorbs felt recoil and it is not as noisy. I do not care for any magazine extensions after using them on and off for years. I also do not care for a side saddle on the receiver. I prefer a simple butt cuff for balance and ease of loading.

    There is a guy called J D MacGuire at http://www.aiptactical.com/ who knows more about 870Ps than just about any man on earth. He will also shoot you straight on this and that and build a gun to your liking. He is not cheap but the best never is. I am in no way affiliated with JD but I have purchased parts from him and you never hear a bad word said regarding his integrity or level of service.
     
  3. Snowblind

    Snowblind Member

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    The site you linked seems to make sense, and even for some of the more elaborate setups the price isn't too bad. I didn't plan on going crazy with it, plus most of what I've heard is that simple is usually better.

    As for the free internet advice, it is what it is. In an attempt to dissuade anyone from telling me to get a different gun: I've been looking into this for months, and I've settled on the 870P over the Express or Mossberg 500. I'm trying to figure out what to do now that I've settled on a gun.
     
  4. Youngster

    Youngster Member

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    I took the magazine extension off my 870P as it hurt the balance and the seam between the mag tube and extension would catch on either a shell rim or the follower on occasion. I did some filing and fixed the problem but never completely trusted it after that, so off it went.

    Ghost rings? I personally don't like them, and even if I did I probably couldn't justify the cost of having them installed when you can get rifle sights from the factory if you don't want a bead.

    As it is I think the bead is the best overall option, FAST and simple.
     
  5. Youngster

    Youngster Member

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    One thing I forgot to mention, parkerized 870Ps take a LOT of wearing in until they're as smooth as a blued model because they are parkerized on the inside of the receiver as well as the bolt.

    This means you have to wear away that gritty, sanderpapery finish on these surfaces, or replace the bolt with a blued or chromed model, before they'll run without a lot of sticktion.

    Just to avoid that hassle I'd look for a blued model. Also, don't be afraid to look for something used, either a older 870 or a Wingmaster with a short barrel, you'll save a lot of money for a gun that's probably better made and is likely to be at least somewhat broken in already.
     
  6. mbogo

    mbogo Member

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    If I were you, I'd buy a used 870, and install the desired parts myself. I had set up my 1100 with Choate synthetic fore-end and butt stock w/pistol grip, three-shot magazine extension etc., for about $100. Of course, it would cost more today, but the parts are widely available on the 'net and the total cost would be less than any Remington OEM offering.

    As far as I know, laser sights which project a dot are not illegal to possess in NYS; you may not use them while hunting big game, but can use them at night while hunting coyote.
    Holographic dot sights have always been legal and with practice are very quick on target.

    mbogo
    P.S. I'd skip the Mossberg option; I think Mossbergs are too light for use with 12 ga. slugs, buckshot, and turkey loads.
     
  7. Rshooter

    Rshooter Member

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    There's two types of 870P's. The new 870 police magnum and Wingmaster police guns. There is the 18 inch with bead sight and 20 inch riot gun which I usually see with rifle sights. I currently have one of each and would take a nice Wingmaster over an 870P magnum any day. Since Obama the used Wingmasters are almost impossible to find and run about twice what they did but you can find them.

    I would not get the ghost rings if an M4 sight bothers you.
     
  8. Snowblind

    Snowblind Member

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    Thanks for the help.

    It looks like you're right, laser-dot type sights are legal, just not for hunting big game.

    What exactly is the difference between the 870P and the Wingmaster Police?
     
  9. Horny Toad

    Horny Toad Member

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    Do you have your heart set on synthetic? If not, you might want to consider an 870P with walnut furniture. I picked one up recently for under $500 brand new.

    If you're interested, contact Linda at Lou's Police and see if she can still get one for you. She's a pleasure to work with.

    [email protected]
    Lou's Police Distributors, Inc
    Serving the Law Enforcement Community Since 1954
    Family Owned and Operated
    7815 West 4th Avenue
    Hialeah, Fl 33014
    Tel: 305.416.0000
    Fax: 305.824.9205
    Website: http://www.louspolice.com

    Pics borrowed from shotgunworld.com:

    P1020028.jpg

    P1020024.jpg

    P1020030.jpg
     
  10. Snowblind

    Snowblind Member

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    As classy a gun as that is, it's just not my personal preference.
     
  11. RONSERESURPLUS

    RONSERESURPLUS member

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    Hello all

    I've takes a REM 870 Express, added a Synthetic stock and forend, added a Lazer and side saddle and all that far less than 500$, I have tried the Ghost rings and as ohers advised if M-4 Site don't thrill ya this won't either and if you shoot Slugs and Buckshot a Standard Bead or Leaf front site are fine! The Ghost ring appeals to may folks, but takes geting used to and to many it's a item to show down your site pick up and rapid fire, so to me, thats a NO GO? Good Luck and let us know what ya find and get and how ya Modify it?
     
  12. RONSERESURPLUS

    RONSERESURPLUS member

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    RON L gain

    I ave a Set of Standard Synthetic and they don't have the speed feed, I wish mine did as it's not a bad feature, but I saw this set used cheaper so went that way, the old wooden set on my Express was Crappy looking so it had to go!
     
  13. dfariswheel

    dfariswheel Member

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    First the difference in synthetic stocks is the Speedfeed I version has a pair of internal magazine tubes that hold two sells on each side, for a total of 4 extra shells carried in the stock.
    This stock has the openings on the top sides, so all you have to do is reach down and flip a shell out and into the magazine.

    Some people like this design, some don't, and a few report that shells may tend to pop out of the stock magazines if it's bumped.

    Next, Remington hasn't made a Wingmaster police gun for over 20 years.
    The only actual Police guns are the 870P models which are available in blued or parkerized, and in synthetic stocks or walnut.
    They do make a sort of "retro" 870P with the blue and walnut that looks like the old Wingmaster police gun, but it's not a Wingmaster.

    If you want a Police gun, simply find a local FFL Dealer and have him order one for you.
    This may present minor problems. Most FFL Dealers buy guns from commercial distributors and don't normally do business with the few Remington factory authorized Law Enforcement distributors.
    Standard Remington distributors don't carry LE guns so this means your local FFL may have to find a LE distributor and make a special order.

    For that reason, some local dealers may not want to go to the effort to make a special order, or they may try to "scalp" you on the price.
    Some local dealers may go so far as to blow you off by telling you that Remington won't sell a Police gun to a "civilian".

    Currently, Remington doesn't show a ghost ring gun with a magazine extension except for the 870P MAX version.
    To fix that, simply have the local dealer also order you a factory magazine extension at the same time.

    Here's Remington's current 870P shotguns:

    http://www.remingtonle.com/
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2011
  14. Snowblind

    Snowblind Member

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    Thanks for the clarification on the stocks.

    I already had my local dealer track down a LE distributor. I was all but set to put down a deposit, but then I couldn't decide on exactly what I wanted. The price was quite reasonable too, if I remember correctly.

    I think I'm going to end up getting just the bead. (I'll probably take AndyJ's advice and put an XS big dot over it later on). So the final setup would be 870P parkerized, 18" barrel, Speedfeed standard stock & forend, 2 shot mag extension.

    Of course, this only when I have money again.
     
  15. Youngster

    Youngster Member

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    My 870P was orginally order with a Speedfeed.

    I liked the thickness and heft of it but it was difficult to get the first shell out of each tube in a timely fashion so i usually just ran one shell in each tube, and also at a 14" LOP I found it too long on a defensive shotgun. Shortening it would be more trouble than its worth IMO.

    The recoil pad it came with was rather uncomfortable as well, although Remington may be offering them with better pads these days.

    I ended up replacing the Speedfeed with a Hogue short stock and don't miss the gimmicky shell storage feature at all.
     
  16. stnjohnson

    stnjohnson Member

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    Sounds like a solid setup. I also vote for the bead. My first instinct was to get some big rifle sights on my HD gun until I got it and actually started shooting it a little. Beads are super fast for the shots you would take with that gun. Big dot sounds cool though. I'm going to check that out.

    If you're feeling poor go for a more basic 870 or a used one. It's way more fun to have them and be able to shoot than to wait on that perfect set-up. Anyway, once you get the first you'll be hooked.
     
  17. red rick

    red rick Member

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    I bought mine about 2 months ago off gunbroker, 18", bead sight, speedfeed stock, 2 shot ext. new for $499.00.

    I had one ordered from a local police supply store. I ordered it Oct. 2nd and still havn't heard from them. I checked on it 3 times and they never got back to me. Only good things is that they didn't get any money up front.

    I tried the Hogue 12" LOP stock, it was to short for me. I sent it back and now I am waiting on the speedfeed youth stock, it should be here Mon.
     
  18. red rick

    red rick Member

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    I got my Speedfeed youth stock right after I signed off today.

    I like the 13" LOP for me. The fit was excellent as the orginal stock was a Speedfeed II. There were 3 things that I think that Speedfeed could do better though. There youth stock does not have a very good recoil pad on it and it would be nice if the holes in the recoil pad were pre-drilled for the screws. Also it is drilled for a sling stud, but they do not include a stud or a plug to cover that hole in the stock if you choose not to install one.

    I used the orginal Speedfeed II recoil pad on it. The fit is not perfect, it is a little longer than the youth pad, but it works. I am happier with it than the Hogue 12" LOP stock.

    The Hogue stock is well made and has all off the things that I wish Speedfeed would include in there's, sling stud, pre- drilled pad and decent recoil pad. Maybe not as good as the Speedfeed II pad, but I haven't shot it, so I am just judging buy appearance and touch.
     
  19. Ship A'Hoy

    Ship A'Hoy Member

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    I have both a new 870P and an old old Wingmaster.

    The Wingmaster has a bead sight and wood furniture.

    The 870P has rifle night sights and a short Hogue stock.

    I love them both but I'd grab the 870P first for battle.
     
  20. monduconstruct

    monduconstruct Member

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    I picked up a used 870P last summer and have thoroughly enjoyed it since. I bought it for $400 in MA, where all prices are inflated and ridiculous because of our gun laws. Anyway, mine has synthetic stock and a 2 shot mag extension. I have a rifle sighted barrel, though I plan to switch to a bead once I deem this barrel to be beyond repair (getting there!). I second others' suggestions to look for used - I've even heard that some of the older models are more reliable than the new stuff. I have no personal knowledge of this, I've just heard Remington build quality, even in the Police line, is not what it once was. My $0.02. Message me with any specific questions.
     
  21. Snowblind

    Snowblind Member

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    Used ones are really hard to find... that's one the main reasons I was planning to buy new, though I am concerned about the quality of a new versus old/used. (Some have mentioned that the finish seems especially lacking on newly made guns)

    Any recommendations for where I can buy used? I live in upstate New York, anywhere in Adirondack park I would deem within reasonable driving distance.
     
  22. Youngster

    Youngster Member

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    You could look for a used Wingmaster, and get a short barrel for it if it doesn't already have one. That's the route I wish i'd taken instead of buying a new 'P', as you avoid the rough parkerizing on parkerizing action and overkill heavy magazine, carrier and trigger springs of the 870P.
     
  23. monduconstruct

    monduconstruct Member

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    I'm not familiar with the upstate NY market - only MA and NH. When I was searching, I just placed a lot of calls, and it was actually a fellow-THR member who ended up finding my used 870P, which had just been traded in by a police dept south of Boston. I'd check with small local shops, it's probably your best bet. Some recommended gunbroker.com, but I never saw any that weren't scooped up in seconds. I imagine a new one would be just fine, might just require a little more break-in considering the parkerization.
     
  24. monduconstruct

    monduconstruct Member

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  25. Snowblind

    Snowblind Member

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    Like I said, used 870P's are hard to find. Used wingmasters are impossible to find. I don't mind spending time to break it in.
     
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