I got a new one of these. Tried 55 grain PMC, AE, and Remington UMC. PMC was about 1.5 inches at 100 yards. The others far worse. Do I need a heavier grain bullet. I thought my research concluded 55 grain would be fine for 1:9 twist. Maybe I was wrong. Thanks.
Remington SPS Tactical in .223
- Thread starter CJK8
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If you get cheap ammo, you'll get cheap results.
I bought a Savage Axis .223 for fun. This week I took it out and ran Remington 62gr Match through it and it shot well under 1".
Try some match ammo and see how that does. The accuracy in a .223 is very dependent on ammo. Then see about loading your own. It isn't hard. Promise.
I bought a Savage Axis .223 for fun. This week I took it out and ran Remington 62gr Match through it and it shot well under 1".
Try some match ammo and see how that does. The accuracy in a .223 is very dependent on ammo. Then see about loading your own. It isn't hard. Promise.
You could easily load match grade ammo yourself for less than what Remington UMC and PMC usually sells for.
If you reuse the brass you already have or at least load the brass you buy 6 or more times you would probably be looking at about $7-8 per box of 20 for reloading.
If you reuse the brass you already have or at least load the brass you buy 6 or more times you would probably be looking at about $7-8 per box of 20 for reloading.
Cop Bob
Member
+ 1... I load my own.. however I have had good luck with Hornady TAP. Bubba is right about some of the match grade ammo... With the 1 in 9, I would go heavier than 55grs.... 60 to 70, 75 grain.. You will find something that will dial in...
It will work fine, just don't expect it to be accurate. Its not that heavier weight ammo won't work, its just that cheap steel cased ammo won't be that accurate. I've shot a lot of steel case stuff through a variety of firearms, from bolt guns to ARs, and it typically averages 2-3" at 100 yards.
There is no reason that rifle shouldn't shoot, but you are going to have to spend the money on good quality MATCH ammo to see how accurate the rifle can be. Or, take up reloading and roll your own.
dagger dog
Member
A Lee Loader Classic in .223 Rem, 100 primers and a box of Sierra Match Kings in 69 gr. a pound of Varget. Then roll your own and I'll bet it will put them all within a quarter if you do your part.
LTR shooter
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Not wrong , a 55 grain can be extremely accurate in a 1 in 9" twist. Match or good quality varmint bullets are going to provide the high level of accuracy over bulk FMJ bullets. Have a 20" 700 LTR that has fired many tight groups with Berger 55 and Sierra 52 match bullets.
I have several boxes of 55 grain, Rem UMC FMJs in the yellow box. They only shot about 1 1/2" at 100 yards in my pillar-bedded Tikka 595.
As an experiment, I pulled the bullets on a whole box, and without changing the powder, seated some Sierra 55 grain PSPs and suddenly groups tightened to 3/4". Whenever I need some quick and dirty varmint loads, I just do it to another box.
That rifle shoots my regular handloads into 3/8" at 100 yards. Lots of range fun!
JP
As an experiment, I pulled the bullets on a whole box, and without changing the powder, seated some Sierra 55 grain PSPs and suddenly groups tightened to 3/4". Whenever I need some quick and dirty varmint loads, I just do it to another box.
That rifle shoots my regular handloads into 3/8" at 100 yards. Lots of range fun!
JP
Your 223 with 1/9 twist will shoot 1.00 moa or less with reloads using 52 gr match bullets most any brand but Sierra and Berger are the best for me. If you can find a commerical brand with 52gr think you will be pleased, the cheap stuff will shoot poorly.
wally
Member
If 1.5" @ ~$0.30/shot isn't good enough for you, only you can answer the question if $1.00+ per round is "worth it" to get maybe 0.5" groups.
Its not for me.
Reloading will get your costs much closer to the cheap ammo cost and match ammo accuracy if your time and labor are "free" and its a fine hobby in its own right. But you have to shoot a fair amount to amortize the cost of the reloading tools.
dc.fireman
Member
The old 1.5" groups, are what got me started reloading .223. Try a decent box of .223 first, and see what it can do. Take your time, this is still a new rifle, correct? Get the barrel nice and broken in ( somewhere between 200-300 rounds), and then start shooting for group size, again, taking your time. Try several different brands of ammo - I've had the expensive stuff (TAP) not shoot worth a damn in some of my rifles, and yet the cheap old PMC or Blazer do just fine... give it a try - you might be surprised.
Huckelberry75
Member
My SPS Tactical shot this group with 69gn Nosler Custom Comp's. Reloading will be your best bet to milk the most performance out of this rifle.
I tried some Fiocchi 55 gr and Fiocchi 50 gr vmax that I hadn’t tried yet. Those two were the ticket. Got about a three quarter inch group at 100yds on both.
I think I’ll go down the reloading route. I started thinking of doing the 69 gr sierras with varget powder as I see many suggest that. I have read many say varget is good for heavier grain bullets. However, I see varget requires a lot of compressed loads. Any issues with compressed loads?
Also, is varget powder good for dropping down to 50, 53, or 55 gr bullets? If not, what do you recommend? I think people like 8208 and H335. I was planning on buying winchester brass but don’t know whether to buy federal or CCI primers and whether they should be benchest or standard primers. I am only shooting from the bench and generally no more than 100 yards. And obviously my goal would be to improve upon the Fiocchi
Thanks.
I think I’ll go down the reloading route. I started thinking of doing the 69 gr sierras with varget powder as I see many suggest that. I have read many say varget is good for heavier grain bullets. However, I see varget requires a lot of compressed loads. Any issues with compressed loads?
Also, is varget powder good for dropping down to 50, 53, or 55 gr bullets? If not, what do you recommend? I think people like 8208 and H335. I was planning on buying winchester brass but don’t know whether to buy federal or CCI primers and whether they should be benchest or standard primers. I am only shooting from the bench and generally no more than 100 yards. And obviously my goal would be to improve upon the Fiocchi
Thanks.
LTR shooter
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My 700LTR shoots best groups with H322 or Benchmark when using the 69 Sierra plus both meter much more accurately than Varget in my measure.
I've had very good results with H335 and 52,55 grain bullets and it is also one of the best metering powders through my measures. Benchmark has performed very well.
Probably the best powder bullet combo I have tried is VV N-133 and the Sierra 52 Match. My 1 in 9" twist 700 LTR , SPS Varmint and TC Super 14 all shoot this combo with great accuracy.
If you are using standard primers, is there any advantage to match grade primers then? In layman's terms, what does the close match the military 5.56powder mean? More conistent and more accurate? Will it have temperature resistance like Varget and 8208? Thanks.
redbullitt
Member
Ok, I think I can help you out. Your rifle should have a 1/9 twist.
I have the same rifle and went through the exact same thing. Most every load and bullet combo I ran through it was pretty crappy by handloading standards. Groups just about like yours. Factory ammo ran just about the same, but I didnt try any high end stuff.
Sometimes the stock can be flexing enough to mess with the consistency. Mine did not seem to be an issue. I have shot with my good load with the hogue stock and with an hs precision stock. Little if any change.
The best load I found is 23.8 grains of varget under a 69smk. CCi primer, mixed brass, loaded just a bit off the lands. The 70 grain berger VLDs shoot equally well, but I have an easier time getting the smk.
The velocity is not smoking by any means (2660ish), BUT it is very consistent and very accurate. Half inch groups at 100 are common. Definitely better than before. Works great out to 500. I dont have any more distance here, but I dont see why it wouldnt reach further.
Hang in there. I was just about to sell the rifle until I got the load dialed in.
I have the same rifle and went through the exact same thing. Most every load and bullet combo I ran through it was pretty crappy by handloading standards. Groups just about like yours. Factory ammo ran just about the same, but I didnt try any high end stuff.
Sometimes the stock can be flexing enough to mess with the consistency. Mine did not seem to be an issue. I have shot with my good load with the hogue stock and with an hs precision stock. Little if any change.
The best load I found is 23.8 grains of varget under a 69smk. CCi primer, mixed brass, loaded just a bit off the lands. The 70 grain berger VLDs shoot equally well, but I have an easier time getting the smk.
The velocity is not smoking by any means (2660ish), BUT it is very consistent and very accurate. Half inch groups at 100 are common. Definitely better than before. Works great out to 500. I dont have any more distance here, but I dont see why it wouldnt reach further.
Hang in there. I was just about to sell the rifle until I got the load dialed in.
I am comletely new to reloading, so forgive the questions. Would I see any difference betwen standard and match primers? Since you are using Varget, do you have compressed loads? Are compressed loads an issue in any event? When you say "mixed brass", does that literally mean a bunch of different brass with same load and no diferrence in accuracy? I was hoping to try some vmax, had you tired that with any luck? Thanks.
dagger dog
Member
Compressed loads are not a factor with Varget but you always want to use a starting load and work your way up, usually you will find the best accuracy before you reach max. Since Varget is relativley large extruded granules, and the .223-5.56 case is small you find that you have a compressed load very soon.
Match primers could make a difference if you are shooting a custom chambered rifle but for an off the shelf rifle the regular primers should give all the accuracy you need.
Most factory 1in9 twist bolt rifles are produced to shoot every thing from 40 grs up to about 70 grains, which is why they twist with 1in9, they want the rifle to shoot about any type bullet right off the shelf. A rule of thumb; if you don't know for sure, over twist for weight-length.
It is the length not the weight that governs twist, and longer bullets that usually weigh more than shorter bullets require more twist to stabilize.
Mixed brass, you want to segregate military brass from your oridnary brass, the military brass is thicker walled and has less volume so it reaches max pressure with the same powder weight before the ordinary. It's not a problem you just have to work the load up for the military brass and don't mix the two.
If you are serious about reloading spend some bucks on reloading manuals, not only do they give safe reloading data but also a lot of knowledge. Read as much as you wallet allows, you will allways resort to you reloading library on questions, it's not to early to start.
Vmax's shoot great in my Savage 1in9 twist but my best was with the longer 69gr. SMK's .
Match primers could make a difference if you are shooting a custom chambered rifle but for an off the shelf rifle the regular primers should give all the accuracy you need.
Most factory 1in9 twist bolt rifles are produced to shoot every thing from 40 grs up to about 70 grains, which is why they twist with 1in9, they want the rifle to shoot about any type bullet right off the shelf. A rule of thumb; if you don't know for sure, over twist for weight-length.
It is the length not the weight that governs twist, and longer bullets that usually weigh more than shorter bullets require more twist to stabilize.
Mixed brass, you want to segregate military brass from your oridnary brass, the military brass is thicker walled and has less volume so it reaches max pressure with the same powder weight before the ordinary. It's not a problem you just have to work the load up for the military brass and don't mix the two.
If you are serious about reloading spend some bucks on reloading manuals, not only do they give safe reloading data but also a lot of knowledge. Read as much as you wallet allows, you will allways resort to you reloading library on questions, it's not to early to start.
Vmax's shoot great in my Savage 1in9 twist but my best was with the longer 69gr. SMK's .
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