Rescue Mexico from US guns

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MErl

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http://www.csmonitor.com/2007/0720/p08s01-comv.html
Lax gun laws and enforcement in the US only feed the 'iron river' of weapons across the border.

It's not only poverty propelling Mexicans into the US. Rising gun violence by drug gangs, and lately a military surge against them, have driven many to cross the border. And where do these drug cartels get their arsenal of weapons? El Norte, of course.

Lax gun laws and lax enforcement in the United States have made it easy for Mexican gunrunners to buy and transport everything from AK-47s to Stinger antiaircraft missiles, which then allows the cartels to use these high-powered weapons against rival gangs or against a military attack. More than 90 percent of the thousands of guns confiscated yearly in Mexico have been traced to US origin.

A two-part Monitor series on the problem looks at what US and Mexican officials are doing to curtail this "iron river" of weapons, but also what still needs to be done.

Most alarming is the increasing flow of combat-style rifles into Mexico, often just a few at a time hidden in the trunk of a car. That trend is partly a result of Congress allowing the US ban on assault weapons to lapse in 2004. But also worrisome is an increase in Mexican gang agents at US gun shows who brazenly pay citizens to buy weapons for them. The US does not have enough federal officials to catch such acts, while many states have loose rules about sales at gun shows.

An undercover investigation by Garen Wintemute, a University of California professor, found such illegal "straw purchases" are common at gun shows. He used hidden recording devices at 28 shows in five states during 2005 and 2006 to detect 24 illegal sales. Often, such sales happened in plain sight of law-enforcement officers. He found one Phoenix vendor with a sale sign in Spanish, offering various assault rifles.

He says California has stronger gun laws than the other four states, and his research shows the result is less illegal trade and proves that tough regulation can work.

The federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives admits it doesn't have enough agents to patrol gun shows for Mexican gang agents, and they usually only go to one if there is a tip of a potential illegal sale.

The Bush administration has waked up late to Mexico's gun problem. Last year, Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff told Congress he didn't know where most of the confiscated weapons in Mexico come from. Since then, the US has greatly beefed up cooperation with Mexico, especially on sharing intelligence, while the Mexican military has begun to inspect vehicles traveling south from the border for guns. It has even taken over the Mexicali airport to prevent flights of smuggled weapons.

Just as the US expects Mexico to curtail illegal migration, the US needs to do far more to help Mexico in its current campaign against powerful drug cartels and to block these private armies from getting US guns. More than 1,300 people this year have been killed in Mexican drug-gang-related shootings.

The US and Mexico already work together against drug trafficking. But it is weak gun laws in the US – compared with strict ones in Mexico – that help drive the cross-border gun trade. Mexico itself can do more, too, such as curbing corruption among customs agents. But if Americans want to help improve life for Mexicans, they'll need to stand up to the gun lobby in Congress and state legislatures.

also
http://www.csmonitor.com/2007/0720/p01s05-usfp.html
 
Um, Maybe CLOSE THE BORDER until we know who and what is crossing it! Here in Tucson we have had a few similar articals in the local papers. Usually shortly after a story about mexican bandits (whoops did I say that, I mean unknown assialants) shooting up a group of illegales trying to hijack the other coyotes load.
 
Now maybe I've been missing a big part of the fun, but how exactly do lax gun laws make it easy to buy Stinger missiles?
 
Oh a bunch of BS. Stinger missles, AK-47s (not clone knockoffs in semi, but just plain ol AK47) and tons of other things just so prevelent here.

What really endangers Mexico is its corruption, and the fact that normal civilian gun ownership is pretty much outlawed with a few exceptions.
Ironicly they have a second amendment inspired by the United States Second(Article 10 of the Mexican constitution)themselves, but they did it with a wording that basicly made adding it pointless. Here is the wording:

"Citizens of the republic may, for their protection, own guns and arms in their homes. Only arms sanctioned by the Army may be owned, and federal law will state the manner in which they can be used."

Because of the bold parts they might as well have not added it as it effectively said the government could outlaw arms, which for all intents and purposes they have. Governments throughout history have never wanted thier subjects armed, they want as little danger posed to themselves, and thier stability and absolute control as possible. So if given the choice they will always disarm a population. History teaches us this. That is why the founding fathers didn't write that it allowed the citizens to have arms, it forbid the government from not allowing them. Shall not be infringed.

Yet of course the organized crime and criminals of Mexico involved in the profitable drug trade obtain firearms illegaly wherever they can, going both north and south. So many of course come from the United States.

Yet Mexico has a murder rate that far exceeds the US murder rate. In fact Mexico has the 6th highest murder rate of all nations per capita in the world.
The murder rate in Mexico is about double that of the US. The US also is more likely to report most of its murders, while many likely go unreported in Mexico, so they likely have even higher murder rates that the statistics based on reported ones.
Yet firearm ownership is illegal. This means the killing is done mainly by the bad guys.

However it really is a lifestyle and freedom choice, more important than mere statistics. In the US bad guys and good guys have guns. In Mexico only bad guys have guns (not counting police because they are present after the fact acting as remedies and deterents, not protection or a safety net for anyone.)
 
More than 90 percent of the thousands of guns confiscated yearly in Mexico have been traced to US origin.

Umm, cite that source please? I'm calling shenanigans.

Nicaraguan/Honduran/El Salvadorian AK's aren't flooding into Mexico from the north. Next they'll be telling us the Cali Cartel is run out of a bar on 242nd street in the Bronx.
 
"Citizens of the republic may, for their protection, own guns and arms in their homes. Only arms sanctioned by the Army may be owned, and federal law will state the manner in which they can be used."
Sad that some want OUR second ammendment to "mean" the same thing.
 
Save Mexico From U.S. Guns?

Fascinating article, thanks for posting it.

Wrote a little letter to the Editor, perhaps they'll read it, perhaps not.
Pretty much asked them what activity practiced by these drug/gun smugglers WAS illegal, and that Mexico's problems were NOT our fault.

So many laws violated, we clearly needed to ban smuggling, murder, and shooting at law enforcement again. THAT will fix it.

What fools.......
 
What a load of Anti-Gun crap. That letter is right out of Sarah Brady's hand book. This is some more of the reasons that the Dems and the left will use to get another A-Rifle Ban Bill.
It was only a month ago that the Mexican Army had to disarm the police in some of the towns The police use their own weapons on the people. That letter blames lax US gun laws gun shows Etc. I did not see one thing about the tons of military arms coming out of South America. And when was the last time you saw a Stinger for sale at a gun show. We even have a lefty California Proff. to back up these facts. The person who posted this is either stupid or a Troll.:evil:
 
Look here politicians.

I tell you the truth when I say there is more common sense and wisdom on this forum than comes from D.C. on this matter.:):)
 
What a load of baloney.
An undercover investigation by Garen Wintemute, a University of California professor, found such illegal "straw purchases" are common at gun shows... He found one Phoenix vendor with a sale sign in Spanish, offering various assault rifles.
Yes,obviously catering to Mexican cartels.:rolleyes:
Let's make a deal...we'll stop sending guns to Mexico and they'll stop sending drugs to the USA!
 
Let's play, "I'm a Mexican Drug Lord". Where would I get my guns... In the US, I can get semi-auto AWs, but I have to smuggle them south through border security and customs.

If I go to El Salvador, Columbia, or any other South American country, I can get machineguns, grenades, and God knows what else, from numerous other cartels or leftist groups. Yep, I'll get my guns in the USA... :rolleyes:
 
Everything about this article should be suscpect by the 3rd paragraph.

"Lax gun laws and lax enforcement in the United States have made it easy for Mexican gunrunners to buy and transport everything from AK-47s to Stinger antiaircraft missiles"

I know the article is just gun-control BS but it is not even plausable BS. Where do I go to get MY stinger missile? I have a distant hope that the hyperbole often used in gun-control rants will backlash and make many people check things out for themselves.
 
I know the article is just gun-control BS but it is not even plausable BS. Where do I go to get MY stinger missile? I have a distant hope that the hyperbole often used in gun-control rants will backlash and make many people check things out for themselves.

I hope people will check this stuff out for themselves as well, but unfortunately many people believe everthing the media tells them.
 
So let me get this straight... people stream north, and guns stream south...

huh?

never mind the stinger missiles... i mean.. omg... where can i find the lax laws for those - i bet that would be a BANG up Fourth of July =) heheh

oh well - wait - we are the US.. its our fault... rofl.. :p
 
Need I cite for instance the youth crime statistics the brady bunch used where people up to 21 years old were considered children? These leftist think thier so damned right they can lie because they feel its justified. But you tell me how can your cause be just if you have to rely on brainwashing and constant lies? Further the professor should be fired for violating the mutual pact professors are supposed to have about credible sources...More fascinating fact for (Mr. Head so far up my A$$) its a known fact vast majority of Americans prefer the AR-15 we consider it "The Patriot gun" in fact it is advertised as thus on on the AR-15 homesite. Comparetively few Americans even use AK-47's which can only be semi auto any how. Remind me again why a drug lord would buy an AK-47 in the USA where they cost three times as much as South America?
 
I guess Garen Wintemute never heard of the Mexican Special Forces unit that started out fighting the cartels. Then, after eliminating the competition they realized they could increase their incomes by several orders of magnitude if they started their own cartel. So they stole their weapons and ammo (from the Mexican Gov't, natch) and went into business. The gov't still hasn't killed them all. Of course these guys were the best of the best down there.

Do Mexican drug gangs need to illegally buy weapons from the U.S.? Not as long as they have a Mexican gov't to take them from. I really doubt that Prof Wintemute actually risked his/her neck to REALLY find out where Mexican drug gang guns come from. If that had happened he/she would be in a hole in the desert, not writing pseudo-academic pap.
 
Ok...

So the US has lax gun laws...

Mexican criminals are buying these guns and bringing them into Mexico...

This is causing massive violence in Mexico...

Causing Mexicans to flee into the US...

Where the guns are coming from in the first place:confused:


I guess the criminals must have such a successful smuggling business that they have managed to remove the majority of guns from the US... :rolleyes:
 
The Bush administration has waked up late to Mexico's gun problem.
:what: Someone, anyone out there can explain why it is our government has to wake up to Mexico's problem particularly since Mexico is a state criminal enterprise?

Last year, Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff told Congress he didn't know where most of the confiscated weapons in Mexico come from.
:scrutiny: Lemme get this right. Chertoff (certainly no constitutional prize himself) has no idea where MEXICO's guns come from so the US is whipped to doing something????

The US and Mexico already work together against drug trafficking. But it is weak gun laws in the US – compared with strict ones in Mexico – that help drive the cross-border gun trade. Mexico itself can do more, too, such as curbing corruption among customs agents. But if Americans want to help improve life for Mexicans, they'll need to stand up to the gun lobby in Congress and state legislatures.
:banghead:Someone, anyone out there explain why Americans feel compelled to improve the life of Mexicans particuarly since their own government is offloading them as fast as possible.

Foregoing statist gobbledygook from both sides of the border makes sense only if you assume from the outset the US and Mexico are one and the same. There is a bad moon on the rise for gun owners in the US because it looks like our Second Amendment rights will become an issue because it is painted as a foreign policy impediment. I can not wait to hear how advocates of the north american union want to deal with gun rights in the US.
 
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