Restrictive States-How do you keep from losing your mind??

[one45auto]

Chaim,

I see you live in my neck of the woods, are you as surprised as I am that Rouse and company haven't tried to enact some sort of ridiculous city-wide gun law? My neighbors are all transplanted liberal yuppies and you should see their reactions to the pro-gun stickers on my truck.

 

[Shanghai McCoy]

Hey serpico,I was BORN in Northern California and started seeing folks leave as far back as the late 60's,early 70's.I left for the service in 73 and hav'nt lived there since.Don't miss a bit,especially when I'm sitting on my 200 acres in Oklahoma.......

 

[QuarterBoreGunner]

The_antibubba, artherd, stv and anyone I missed; we will and are making a difference. As has already been stated, as goes California so goes the rest of the nation and even though I dearly love my town, you’d be hard pressed to find a more infuriating 49 square miles in the entire nation. People have to remember that California isn’t just SF and LA. I’ve got family out in the central valley around Lockford and it’s a different world out there, a little dull but not too bad.

Oh and as I’ve stated many times in previous threads regarding “you need to move out of that Commie state and get back to America†statements, I’ll say it again. Do you really want a bunch of Californians moving to your state? Before you answer talk to some Oregon or Washington state natives.

It’s a slow process and an aggravating one, but I am staying here as well. Just remember that little changes can add up.

 

[The_Antibubba]

QBG,

That is exactly the point. I don't think Wyomans (Wyomingites? ) would care for 1 million Californians moving in, and Utahns wouldn't be thrilled with all those Left Coasters settling down.

To paraphrase, " I love California; it's the State I hate." The place is a Paradise. I'm two hours frome the Coast, 1&1/2 hours from skiing, and the multitude of cultures and customs is dazzling. And OHHH! the weather here...anyone who has suffered through a summer in Ohio will understand. I laugh at the natives who complain about 100 degree days, because the RH is only 20%-not the 99% of Ohio. I also laugh to see them in Winter coats when the temperature dips below 60 .

And the produce-don't get me started on the freshness of the fruits and veggies and meat [Homer]unnhhh[/Homer]...Jerseyites, trust me, You are NOT living in the Garden State!

And with so much to love here, there is even more to lose. If I were raising kids, I'd be reluctant to stay here too, but, despite what the inhabitants would have you believe, it is not all LA or SF. Much of the northern state is rural and fairly conservative, and would like nothing better than to secede from SoCal (One issue at a time). Changes can be made.

In case I haven't mentioned it, The High Road has been an enormous boon to me, as well as a top-notch source of inspiration and information to me. Even if you should leave California (or Jersey, Maryland, Illinois, etc, etc, etc), don't leave here. This is the best on-line community I've ever been to.

Thank You, Oleg, and all the others who give their time, blood, and sweat.

 

[artherd]

The_Antibubba- you've got it man. I'm lucky enough to live in the CA Wine Country. It's bloody amazing. There are other places on earth that are outstanding in many different ways, but this part in particuliar of CA will always be my home. I'm blown away just getting up in the morning here.

CA is only ~10 years or so ahead of the laws of most other states in this rapidly becoming Nanny Nation, so I'm just going to stay here on the front lines. If I retreat, it'll only buy me another 10 years before they come for that state too, and I have to move again.

The second they drive me from my home land, I will have lost in my eyes and heart. ???? THAT.

 

[artherd]

I converted two, if not antis, then at least people who'd never thought much about or of guns, this weekend.

The grin after shooting all of my collection, but my AR-30 in particuliar (and making 500 yard hits the first time.) was worth it's weight in gold.

2 more pro voters.

 

[Serpico]

"Hey serpico,I was BORN in Northern California and started seeing folks leave as far back as the late 60's,early 70's.I left for the service in 73 and hav'nt lived there since.Don't miss a bit,especially when I'm sitting on my 200 acres in Oklahoma"

I could probably get 400 acres if I sell my house...Is that supposed to make me want to move to Oklahoma? I think all you ex-patriots from the 5th largest economy in the world are really loney and want us Californians to come join you or you would keep your paradise a secret instead of recruiting....thank you all for the invite but I like it just fine here...

 

[Don Gwinn]

I live in one of these states (Illinois) and have gone back and forth from defiantly staying to fight to leaving for Texas or Tennessee several times. I've had some chance to think about it.

First of all, Serpico, I don't blame people who leave one bit, even though I don't have any immediate plans to do so. Illinois is actually leading the nation in the number of refugees it produces according to Allied Van Lines. Of all the people who rent Allied Vans, 60% are moving out of state! When you consider the number of in-state moves, that means very few people are moving into this state as compared to those moving out. Those people aren't all moving because of gun laws. The way Illinois works and is governed is corrupt and foolish in just about every aspect. Taxes are ridiculous. Elected officials are notorious liars with varying degrees of debt to mafiosi and other criminals. Everyone who doesn't live near Chicago is still dominated by it.

The way I look at the stay-or-go question is this: If you're fighting the good fight wherever you are, it doesn't matter where you are. Yes, I do take a certain perverse pride in living here and fighting uphill, but that doesn't mean I'm going to move to Chicago so I can really be in the belly of the beast! Frankly, if money, jobs and family determined where I lived, Chicago would make a lot of sense. I'd be making twice as much money up there and we'd be near my in-laws, but it's an awful place to live. Not worth it.

If you want to move to Texas or Oregon, that's OK with me, as long as you don't get complacent and quit fighting. We need people to advance in the areas where we're strong as much as we need people to fight back where we're outnumbered and surrounded. We need people to convert more permit states to Alaska/Vermont style. We need people to argue for automatic weapons. These are things you can't do effectively in a place like Illinois for now because there are so many steps between, but in Indiana and Texas and Arizona they're possible.

In short, there are usually lots of good reasons to leave an oppressive anti-gun state aside from guns. A very anti-gun state is usually characterized by other attitudes that go hand-in-hand with a prohibitionist mindset. And it is still possible to do a LOT for the cause in a pro-gun state as well.



Lastly, there's the issue of what people mean by "fighting." Jeff White just became a Republican precinct Committeeman, and what did he find in southern Illinois? An organization in disarray. Leaderless, planless, useless.

I joined the "Sangamon County Grassroots" a week ago, and I didn't see much that looked like grassroots activism. Mostly it was a meeting of very nice people who got together to argue about gun control and what to do about it. They've got no funds, less than 20 members, and I was the youngest person in the room by about ten years (I'm 26.) That's not "fighting for our rights." So I determined to join and try to improve things. That's fine as far as it goes, but I can't help but wish I had done it 8 or 10 years ago. I've been coasting, and most gun owners here have done a lot less than I have.
So now I have to question myself--when I was talking about moving out, when it seemed hopeless, had I really done everything I could do? Of course I hadn't even started.

YMMV. I leave you with a quote that will tell you a little bit about how rigged the game really is in Illinois.

 

[Serpico]

I could care less if everyone moves the hell out...we could use 2 or 3 million less people....read my first post....all I said was I was tired of people telling me to move......

 

[chaim]

I see you live in my neck of the woods, are you as surprised as I am that Rouse and company haven't tried to enact some sort of ridiculous city-wide gun law? My neighbors are all transplanted liberal yuppies and you should see their reactions to the pro-gun stickers on my truck.

Not really. Columbia isn't really a real city. It is the world's largest (I think, if not the world's largest, it is the US's largest) planned community and neighborhood association. The Columbia Council is a joke, it can't pass any real legislation. It is really there to make sure your neighbor doesn't paint his home purple, to mow the grass and repave the bikepaths in our open spaces and build new properties (parks, athletic facilities, etc). The reason the incorporation struggle is so uphill (in fact, outright impossible) is because any change to the bylaws needs a unanimous vote of all property owners and renters here (btw- it doesn't matter if you are 80, if you don't own a home or have a lease here you cannot vote in Columbia elections, and if you own 10 apartment buidings but live in NYC you have 10 votes). Anyway, I suspect to ban guns they would need to change the bylaws. Even if not, that isn't the kind of stuff that CA really bothers with. Howard County wouldn't go for it either- many of the new additions to Columbia are rich Republicans (the rich ones aren't often friends of gunowners, but usually distrust gov't incursion) and old Howard County is still pretty rural.

As for the neighbors, it is certainly true of the older (pre-late 1980s arrivals) Columbia residents that they are almost exclusively far-left wingers, many former 60s idealists and radicals who never outgrew it. Still, many of the newer residents aren't like that, and I think within a few years Columbia will be at least 50/50 Republican (and out of Columbia Howard County is already better than that). Most of my neighbors are new arrivals (though it is an old part of town, most of those who I grew up around are gone) and no one seems to mind. I did get a weird look from one neighbor once when moving some rifles to the car for a range trip, but I wonder if he was just surprised (but could be supportive if I talked to him about guns) since he has a "Bush/Chaney 2004" sign in his front yard.

Well, that was a longwinded way of me saying, no I'm actually not shocked that Columbia still allows gun ownership. The Columbia Association is basically an overgrown neighborhood association that has morphed into a business that builds and maintains services and tries to sell you memberships that gain you access to the better services, they don't pass laws. The Columbia Council is just the Board of Directors of that company. I doubt that the liberals in Columbia could influence Howard County to enact a ban because: 1) the rest of the county is far more conservative than Columbia and 2) even here in Columbia the population is becoming far more conservative. Anyway, I'm pretty sure Maryland has state-preemption on gun laws because I don't know of any localities that have stricter gun laws than the state (and I'm sure Baltimore City would ban guns if they could).

 

[artherd]

..all I said was I was tired of people telling me to move...

Second that with emphasis!

 

[one45auto]

Chaim,

I don't think that Columbia will ever be able to enact a ban. What I meant to say in my earlier post was that I was surprised that none of the liberal transplants or sixties idealists have ever tried to suggest it. From time to time I've perused our local association newsletter and it can be nauseatingly politically correct on occasion.

By the way, speaking of rural, remember when Sewell's Orchard was actually an orchard? (Good strawberries they were, too!) Ah, the good old days....

 

[MikeK]

MD - As some have said earlier, there is still some small glimmer of hope. We did beat the proposed AWB ban this year.

Do I think about moving? Every day. Why not? :
A legally blind mother
A small business
My wife has a part-time job with good medical benefits
A disabled daughter that likes it here and the state does have good systems for support that our high taxes fund.

How do I keep from losing my mind? Shoot and buy Jack Daniels on sale.

 

[Ryder]

Restrictive States-How do you keep from losing your mind??

Freedom is a state of mind, not a state of the union. A free mind is not afflicted by political whim.

 

[MeekandMild]

Seriously, how in heaven do those of you that live in states like Maryland, New York, Illinois, DC, etc., live with all those restrictions?

They probably ignore them a lot more often than you'd imagine.

I was in the Air Force with a guy, really nice fellow from New York. He carried a little NAA .22 everywhere he went. I think he unloaded it to fly, but may be wrong.

In any regard AFAIK this guy's pistol was never registered nor licensed. I'd suspect there are probably a million or so others out there. Nobody knows about them because armed citizens don't normally cause a fuss.

I would never advocate breaking the law, but I can guarandamntee you if I'm ever called on to sit on a jury to judge some Joe Nobody who got caught carrying without a CCW I'm going to think long and hard before I waste my county's jail money putting him behind bars.

 

[AnklePocket]

IMHO, I think that the absolute best measure is to look at the big picture. The RKBA is a smaller part of the entire concept of personal responsibility, accountability and self reliance. Here, in New Jersey, the battle will not be won on the gun issue alone. One must stay consistent across the board on the complete range of core American values. And, I must say, that many more people than you may suspect respond quite favorably.
I say this with ease, but to actually act on it in an effective way comes at great personal cost. One can get involved in politics, and I did, but there is little refuge in the Republican Party in questionable areas. I've concluded that states that are in trouble are so because they lack balance in government. The local and state Republican parties are generally very weak because the candidates and elected officials are Democrats in Republican clothing, hence the unbalance and subsequent poor leadership.
So, to be effective in the manner being discussed here one must be prepared to go it alone and I mean alone. Many will support you on election day if you stay the course with unwaivering conviction, but along the way you will be the hot potato of the community. It is very, very lonely.
Other activities, of course, are Letters to the Editor. I've had a lot over the past few years. My best, I think, was written a few weeks ago, but no one would print it. It's getting lonely again, but I'll push onward.
Hope the preceeding wasn't too incoherent, but I do have a realtor in Pennsylvania emailing me listings every few days and we've been looking at a few homes here and there so fleeing is definitely an option. There's one in Yardley that we'll be looking at next weekend. It would be sad to leave, but I just might have a much better go of it raising my kids in an area more in line with core American values. I haven't yet given up the fight, nor will I ever, but it's very tough, really.