Riflemans Creed

[blarby]

Given its provenance,

Is is disrespectful to use, or repeat, the riflemans' creed if you are not a Marine ?

 

[M-Cameron]

do you find yourself needing to recite this often?

 

[230RN]

^ Quotes, references, for those of us who are not mind readers and too lazy to look it up?

 

[blarby]

No, Cameron.

I've just been hearing it a lot lately, seemingly every other time my desire for a particular rifle comes up !

Was just curious. Especially what our Marine members might have to say on the subject, specifically.

 

[hammerklavier]

"This is my rifle, this is my gun, ..."

 

[shuvelrider]

Add to that the " Soldiers Creed, NCO Creed, Officers Creed, Warrant Officers Creed, Civilian Creed (government employee), Rangers Creed, and any other creeds out there. Recite them for extra points and an extra helping of hooah in your life, just another form of indoctrination when your young and impressionable. Not a bad thing for some people who need direction and something to focus on in their lives.

 

[OldDoggy]

The Creed

This is my rifle. There are many like it, but this one is mine.My rifle is my best friend. It is my life. I must master it as I must master my life.My rifle, without me, is useless. Without my rifle, I am useless. I must fire my rifle true. I must shoot straighter than my enemy who is trying to kill me. I must shoot him before he shoots me. I will...My rifle and I know that what counts in war is not the rounds we fire, the noise of our burst, nor the smoke we make. We know that it is the hits that count. We will hit...My rifle is human, even as I, because it is my life. Thus, I will learn it as a brother. I will learn its weaknesses, its strength, its parts, its accessories, its sights and its barrel. I will keep my rifle clean and ready, even as I am clean and ready. We will become part of each other. We will...Before God, I swear this creed. My rifle and I are the defenders of my country. We are the masters of our enemy. We are the saviors of my life.So be it, until victory is America's and there is no enemy, but peace!

Just Another Old Doggy, Don

 

[Sheepdog1968]

I've always liked this creed.

Having not served in the military (though interviewed with Navy when I was finishing grad school to discuss career opportunities) myself, I don't say these creeds out loud as I don't feel I have earned that privilege and some could take offense. There are plenty of other ways I can be patriotic.

 

[CraigC]

I wouldn't repeat it but I like it and I believe in it. The nation was founded by free citizens with rifles and you don't have to be a Marine to be a rifleman.

 

[rswartsell]

You don't have to be a Marine to be a rifleman, true enough.

You DO however have to be a rifleman to be a Marine. I like it, but leave it to it's proper owners in the Corps. The more generic "I am an American fighting man..." (A.K.A. Soldiers Creed) I kept from my days in the USAF, yes we "wing nuts" shared it with the Army in those days.

http://www.vfwpost192-nj.com/the-original-soldier-s-creed.php

P.S. Hammer059 and shuvelrider, I take some pride in accepting this "indoctrination" while "in need of direction". I did so voluntarily with eyes wide open. I have no doubt you have contributed your share to the cause of preserving the way of life you enjoy, I do not need to know what it is because I have no need to criticize you.

 

[Officers'Wife]

Given its provenance,

Is is disrespectful to use, or repeat, the riflemans' creed if you are not a Marine ?

Perhaps the easiest route would be to formulate your own. Marines have a specific outlook that is ... well, that is the Marines.

This is my rifle, it is a 32-20 Winchester made of steel, wood and the skills and experiences of the people that made it. It is not a magic wand, it is a tool. As a tool it is only as useful as my skill in operating it. My rifle is only as good intentioned as my intentions make it. It cannot do evil unless I do evil...

I may have to work on it. Might be fun.

 

[bikerdoc]

I cleaned this thread up a bit.

Thanks to all who kept it high road.

Continue in this manner.

 

[orionengnr]

I have read/heard the first few lines a number of times through the years. Never seen/heard the whole thing. Thanks for sharing.

I am not now, never have been, and never played a Marine. I was a sailor, and sailors and Marines have a long-standing and (usually) good-natured mutual ribbing thing going on.

That said, I have always had a deep and abiding respect for anyone who willingly charges a machine gun nest (although in my younger days, my words may not have always reflected this, see above ribbing comment).

In my advancing years, I count several among my friends.

 

[22250Rem]

Parris Island SC, rifle range, Oct. 1969: I remember someone in my platoon saying; " It's really not MY rifle 'cause eventually I have to give it back!". This was way back in the M-14 days when we shot them all the way out to 500 meters. Probably the first time in my life I ever shot past 100 yds. or so. It was pretty exciting for a 19 yr. old kid. I still have my RIFLE MARKSMANSHIP AND DATA BOOK. The serial number of my M-14 was 33116.... How's that for trivia.. I'm the only ex-marine I know who still has his boot camp marksmanship book. Does that qualify me for "Rifle Looney" status? P.S. - The Riflemans Creed is on page one of that marksmanship book.

 

[shuvelrider]

I saw the Rifleman's Creed back in 1981 during my army basic, when I was young and more impressionable back then. Active duty, reserve duty, military technician on the civilian side plus two deployments later, and still serving with 24 years time in uniform. I can honestly say I'm tired of seeing"Creeds" everywhere I go, at my age I really don't need a creed to tell me who, what, where, and how I should conduct myself. Pretty sure I've got that covered by now through experience, that perhaps I can pass on to others. Compliments of this old NCO. Criticize??????, NEVER!!! To speak my mind of what creeds have become and used for, most definitely. Recite them verbatim in army schools to get an extra "bullet" comment on your DD-1059, and a chance at "honor grad". Rather then keeping a copy of a creed that means something to you on a personal level, to study and reflect upon the words privately. Then to incorporate that creed into your daily life, I do hope that young service-members still take it upon themselves to do so.

 

[blarby]

Well, I apparently missed a whole bunch.

According to Doc, that was a good thing.

Still no closer to the tootsie center.

 

[1911 guy]

First, let's look at what a "creed" is. It is a system of belief or unifying dogma.

Secondly, do you agree or accept this creed as a personal conviction?

If so, fine. If not, it's as meaningless to you as is the Nicene Creed to a Buddhist.

Now for me, I was Navy, but worked closely with a lot more marines than sailors. I never heard the Riflemans Creed. Ever. Except for that one time we all watched Full Metal Jacket in the day room. I'm not sure they're attached enough to it to be offended if someone appropriated it. Unless, of course, that someone was trying to pass as a Marine.

 

[RetiredUSNChief]

First, let's look at what a "creed" is. It is a system of belief or unifying dogma.

Secondly, do you agree or accept this creed as a personal conviction?

If so, fine. If not, it's as meaningless to you as is the Nicene Creed to a Buddhist.

Now for me, I was Navy, but worked closely with a lot more marines than sailors. I never heard the Riflemans Creed. Ever. Except for that one time we all watched Full Metal Jacket in the day room. I'm not sure they're attached enough to it to be offended if someone appropriated it. Unless, of course, that someone was trying to pass as a Marine.

1911 guy pretty much nails it on the head, here.

A creed is a doctrine statement, and creeds are tailored to the group/organization for which they are written for.

Speaking as a retired Chief Petty Officer, if you honor the creed, then you are, yourself, displaying honor and integrity. The power of the creed is reflected in it's ability to inspire others in just this way.

If, however, you dishonor the creed by putting it in a bad light, misrepresent its meaning, or otherwise dishonor or defame the creed or the organization to which it refers, then you have no honor and no integrity and you will most definitely be looked down upon.

A Marine isn't born a Marine. He's forged into a Marine from something that was NOT a Marine. He earns the creed because he lives the creed. If you choose to live the creed, you may not be a Marine...but you do HONOR the Marines by doing so. It's a recognition and validation of their creed.


If you will, think of a creed as a standard. The very best standards are those which are high and which must be worked hard for in order to achieve. A standard which is not high, or for which little (if any) effort must be made to achieve and maintain, is not much of a standard. Such standards do not inspire others to become better or to move organizations to greater heights. The adage "your lowest standard is their highest standard" is very true indeed.

The Rifleman's Creed, the Chief Petty Officer Creed, the Marine Creed...they're all tailored to express what it MEANS to be part of such organizations/groups. You cannot BE a Chief Petty Officer unless you BECOME a Chief Petty Officer. But you can HONOR Chief Petty Officers by choosing to honor his creed and live up to its meaning yourself.


I hope this makes sense.

 

[rswartsell]

Ummm, OK,

IMHO if you truly have system of beliefs you feel strongly in, as Officer's Wife suggested voice it in your own creed. If you are not a Marine I fail to see the necessity of co-opting their creed unless you are trying to pass for one. Can you explain to me why this would be necessary? If NOT necessary, I personally choose the relatively easy demonstration of respect that comes with allowing their creed to be theirs. That simple. The rest of this is becoming stretched to the point of nonsense.

 

[blarby]

It does make sense.

 

[herrwalther]

I personally like the Infantryman's creed. Although there are several unofficial ones I like far better, just no moto to look them up at this hour.

"I am the Infantry
I am my country's strength in war,
her deterrant in peace.
I am the heart of the fight
whereever, whenever.
I carry America's faith and honor
against her enemies.
I am the Queen of Battle.
I am what my country expects me to be,
the best trained soldier in the world
in the race for victory.
I am swift, determined, and courageous,
armed with a fierce will to win.
Never will I fail my country's trust.
Always will I fight on
through the foe, to the objective, to triumph over all.
If neccessary I will fight to my death.
By my steadfast courage I have won 200 years of freedom.
I yeild not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superiour odds.
For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight.
I forsake not my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty.
I am relentless
I am always there, now and forever
I am the Infantry
Follow me!"

 

[Kaeto]

And then there is the Lone Ranger's Creed.

 

[200Apples]

.
The topic I'm replying to is the subject of the Rifleman's Creed. I appreciate shuvlrider's take on the matter from his perspective.

I'm a civilian and I have little desire to perhaps disrespect the tradition, the guidance that any military creed may give a young soldier, sailor or Marine by using theirs... but I can understand why some people wish to adopt a creed or even write their own, but why is that?

Jeff Cooper says something about it in his book, "The Art Of The Rifle":

Personal weapons are what raised mankind out of the mud, and the rifle is the queen of personal weapons. The possession of a good rifle, as well as the skill to use it well, truly makes a man the monarch of all he surveys. It realizes the ancient dream of the Jovian thunderbolt, and as such it is the embodiment of personal power. For this reason it exercises a curious influence over the mind of most men, and in it's best examples constitutes an object of affection unmatched by any other inanimate object.

So if you're not a Marine, why not write your own "creed". I don't feel the need to do so, but I certainly do enjoy handling, shooting, cleaning and admiring the few rifles I own.

 

[morcey2]

I have a son who's a Marine. He said that I'd never be able to honestly recite the Rifleman's Creed. He thought it would go something like this if I said it:

This is my rifle. There are many like it, but this one is mine. So is that one. And that other one. That one over there in the corner is mine, but it needs some work. The AR is great, but it needs a better trigger. I gotta reblue the 257 Roberts at some point. I haven't shot the Turk Mauser yet, but the M48B shoots really well...

He says I'm too easily distracted and my mind tends to wander.

Matt

 

[blarby]

^^^^ now thats funny.