Rust blue services

Status
Not open for further replies.
J

Jackrabbit1957

Member
Joined
Apr 6, 2018
Messages
2,899
I have been kicking around the idea of offering a rust blue service in addition to tuning and repairs already offered. Anyone interested in such a thing? What would be a fair price for a revolver? Thanks in advance.
 
Not sure of price because most of it would depend on how much prep is required on each piece. For a really deep blue a perfect surface is required, without the edges or shoulders rounded. Buffing wheels round the edges. They also remove most of any writing or engraving. If there's any dents or rust on the surface, you're talking about a lot of hand sanding, and that means time. I have had a couple of shotguns reblued. One had surface rust all over it. They must have a way to remove the rust with chemicals because I was only charged 160 for the barrel and receiver. But the same place charged me 175 for just the barrel on another gun, but it had a vent rib on it. You can buy everything from Brownells and try it on your own guns first. Good luck.
 
I really like the looks of rust bluing, that sort of smokey gray/blue appearance. I have an older Uberti 1860 that someone had rust blued in the past and it looks more vintage correct to my eyes. Also. I had a early 3rd generation Colt SAA that needed the backstrap/trigger guard refinished(don't ask why). Three different attempts at bluing--a local guy, then off to Colt, then off to Turnbull--all came back with a bright purple or plumb color that was way off. Finally another local guy rust blued it and I was satisfied. For any more refinishing jobs I believe that would be my first choice.
Jackrabbit1957 I hope you consider it. BTW, what other services do you offer?
.
 
Jackrabbit1957 said:
What would be a fair price for a revolver?
Click to expand...

I think the only fixed price would be for a customer prepp"d firearm or one that doesn't need preparation. Otherwise I think you would have to see each firearm to determine how much time you would need to invest in preparation. Defarbing and fixing gouges with a file takes a lot of time to bring back the original lines. Surface scratches that can be taken out with 320/400 grit sandpaper less. But each one would need to be evaluated.

Maybe you could offer a fixed price for a 320 grit finish with the caviat that scratches deeper than 320 would remain. At that point it is a matter of communicating with the customer what they will get back for the price quoted. So to spitball a price list, and these aren't based on what you want for your time but a starting point aimed at undercutting established services prices. Only you can determine what your time is worth.

Repro revolvers
Customer prepped/no prep required revolver - $75
320 grit finish revolver - $100
Deep scratches/ gouges revolver - $175
Defarb revolver - $200

If your sticking with repro revolvers, the soft steels that make up the barrels takes rust blue well and could take as few as 3 passes. Cylinders, and I have to assume receivers, take a few more passes but still color well. Modern barrel steels take a lot more passes and anything like nickel steel start to be problematic as far as how many passes and what color they come out. Hardened steels are flat out difficult to both prep and rust blue much like the nickel steel barrels.

Sticking with repro revolvers you might want to think of it as

Rust blue - Saturday and Sunday, not full time though
320 grit finish 4-8 hours
Defarb/deep scratches/gouges pretty much anything that requires a file - a full Saturday/Sunday minimum
Shipping - at cost

I think you would have to undercut the established services as far as price goes. So a repro revolver getting a 320 finish could be done on a Friday prep, Saturday/Sunday blue. And you would be able to do other work on Saturday/Sunday. How much is your time worth for that investment of time.
 
Captain kirk, not set up for doing barrel liners, may change in the future, mostly doing revolver tunes and repairs with the occasional lock repair thrown in.
 
If you don't charge at least 50$ a hour, you ain't making money. You're the one investing your money in equipment and time in learning how to do it. So you're being paid in part for what you know. If it was so easy, everyone could do it and you wouldn't be needed. :rofl:
 
Good point Paul, I have done plenty of rust blueing in the past, just not recently and I gotta determine if it's worthwhile with enough demand to gear up again. The time consuming part is the prep work as you know, rust blue ain't gonna hide anything so the metal has to look good before the process can be done. How do you folks feel about a bead blasted matte type finish?
 
I dug out my copy of Baker, 1933, and read his description of "hot blue" which is not the same as the factory dunk in a nitrate solution. It is what you might call a fast rust blue, maybe what some call a hot water blue.
Degrease, etch with HCl, rinse, boil, apply strong corrosive, boil, card, boil, rust, repeat. Baker said he could blue a gun in an hour and a half.

As to surface finish, I have a used gun that was rust blued. I told the gunsmith not to take a chance on wiping out the markings even if it left in some surface flaws. Which it did, but it is not bad looking.
 
Jackrabbit1957 said:
Good point Paul, I have done plenty of rust blueing in the past, just not recently and I gotta determine if it's worthwhile with enough demand to gear up again. The time consuming part is the prep work as you know, rust blue ain't gonna hide anything so the metal has to look good before the process can be done. How do you folks feel about a bead blasted matte type finish?
Click to expand...
I don’t have any use for that personally. But I can see how it would be desired for more modern or practical guns, hunting guns, etc.

you probably already have this handled but if you decide to start taking work on non-blackpowder guns you’ll need to get the proper FFL.
 
Jackrabbit,

are you talking traditional rust bluing or express rust bluing? Unlike most posters here, I find the preparation to take much less time than the actual process of wiping the blue on, boiling, and carding up to over a dozen times.
 
Guess it depends on what kind of final finish the customer wants, shiny mirror polish or a bead blast matte finish. I prefer a non gloss type finish myself. If I do this it would be the longer process, I think its a more durable finish in the long run.
 
I have a 1860 that I've had forever, much sentimental value, and would like to someday (when I could save up the pennies) give it the works as far as a full tune up and other mods. That would be a good time to give it a nice rust-blue. But again, interested yes, but it wouldn't be anytime soon. !!!! :) But I think it's a great idea.
 
Jackrabbit1957 said:
Guess it depends on what kind of final finish the customer wants, shiny mirror polish or a bead blast matte finish. I prefer a non gloss type finish myself. If I do this it would be the longer process, I think its a more durable finish in the long run.
Click to expand...

What makes you believe that rust bluing in a slow traditional process and a damp cabinet will be more durable and do you have any experience and data for comparison? In both techniques the bluing is applied in layers that have to individually wear. The matte versus gloss finish is not just depending on the initial surface preparation. The "teeth" from a 320 grit finish will give most likely better results than a 600 grit.
If you want to offer professional services for hire, you will have to have professional insider knowledge and will have to show samples of your work.

Liability insurance is also a good idea. I have seen more than one O/U shotgun being ruined by not having the chemicals properly neutralized and water remaining in small spaces.
 
First of all I have done quite a bit of rust blueing, I also have several of my own pistols that I have done, the rust blue takes holster wear better than hot salts blue. I don't like hot salts because it aggravates my skin greatly. Hot salts are basically done in a few hours with not a lot of time in the solution, it's a hot, dangerous environment that I have no desire to be in. You're response was a bit snarky and not appreciated. I threw out the idea of rust blue to offer a little more service to my customers, for the most part folks on this forum are really helpful. And no I am not doing any thing other than black powder revolvers or pistols, no fancy over under shotguns or model 12s or AR15 s. As a side note, the bead blasted finish prior to rusting the metal usually gives the rusting agent a good start and it generally comes out much more even in the final results.
 
You might find that a bit "snarky" but when you are dealing with customers and prospects, you will need to be strong in marketing, sales, and have references. You had not stated you level of experience very clearly, at least I have not seen the level expertise and professionalism displayed that would make me comfortable to send a firearm for rust bluing to you.

Why don't you show a few guns that you have done here and do a little test marketing with pricing stated?

I have done some rust bluing and would not want to do it for hire, it is perfect for the hobbyist, requiring low starting cost but being very labor intensive. I did this C96 in under three hours for my son.
Mauser-C96.jpg
Mauser-C96.jpg
 
One thing I have learned is you can't satisfy everyone. I too have a broomhandle mauser that I rust blued. Took me about a week to get it where I wanted it. I am a bit skeptical about doing that kind of a job in just a couple of hours. Everyone has their own perception as to what is a professional, if you don't think I am professional enough to meet your needs by all means go to someone else. I doubt you have anything I would work on, I stick to only black powder stuff, nothing cartridge unless it's an antique and even then I am very picky about it. By the way I have owned and operated several small businesses and have dealt with many a difficult customer. I stand behind my work and I hope my customers know this and that I will take care of them. That being said, have a nice day.
 
PzGren said:
I have done some rust bluing and would not want to do it for hire, it is perfect for the hobbyist, requiring low starting cost but being very labor intensive. I did this C96 in under three hours for my son.
Click to expand...

Rust blue a gun in three hours, sounds like the Baker process I read about. Everything else I saw in Baker or Dunlap talks in terms of days, most of that time spent quietly rusting without close attention. Dunlap said Neidner got in two coats a day, which seems fast, but half a dozen to a dozen coats required, depending on the steel.

The gunsmith who refurbished my smoked and hosed guns after The Incident rust blued the vent ribbed and O/U shotgun barrels to protect the solder.

He said he had a complete Oxynate setup in the attic, but found it easier to send that work to a large volume tank operation.

He has a technique for whole-gun bluing with Oxpho-Phos cold blue that made them look as good as new. I don't know how well it wears, these are what are called "range guns" and don't get rough handling or holster/saddle scabbard carry.

My FLG showed his own well used but only slightly worn shotgun that he had rust blued. Said the best thing about it was that his bottle of corrosive was lost in a move and he was not inclined to mix another. Too much work.
 
I kind of have to agree with @PzGren when it comes to the marketing. After all , I'm sending you my 1851 after having read reviews of your work (which market your services). Even though I already trust you because of other's word of mouth, I believe it may be a good idea to show at least one example of something you've rust blues. However, I think this only really applies if you're planning on actually offering this service.

I ,for one, would love to someday build a muzzleloader (like a Kentucky pistol). I have no idea how to blue aside from cold blue, and would more than likely send the metal bits to someone to blue them for me. There's a Gunsmith on Mesa who does blueing, but I'd honestly rather send it to someone elsewhere just because I like networking.

As for price, I suppose I could ask the two 'smiths in town how much they charge to give you an idea.
 
Asking questions on an internet forum and seeing what is meant as constructive criticism as snarky is really the way to go on the road to success. It is encouraging that you post a comment that you have done a C96 but I still see no photos that would encourage me, as a customer, to trust you and send my gun and money your way.

My question to Jim Watson, despite your impressive post count, have you done rust bluing yourself? Do you understand the difference in between traditional rust bluing and express blue?

With that I am out of this thread and wish Jackrabbit good luck with his business venture.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

P
  • Locked
1858 project: removing the blue
2
Replies
35
Views
3K
Dithsoer
D
B
  • Locked
Neglected Thompson Center Hawken
Replies
16
Views
2K
gwpercle
gwpercle
W
  • Locked
Colt Signature Series
Replies
14
Views
653
CHM
C
H
  • Locked
Belgian Blue or Rust Blue
Replies
5
Views
3K
hilltopper55
H
R
  • Locked
T/C Hawken in .45 cal. ....
Replies
10
Views
854
gotgcoalman
G
Back
Top