S&W Internal Lock...

[Werewolf]

OKAY...
For years I've been reading about and hearing guys complain about the internal lock on S&W revolvers. Not owning one I never really gave it much thought - in fact when I bothered to think about it at all it really kinda ticked me off a bit because I considered that lock a bit of a sell out by S&W to the antis.

Now I actually own a S&W Revolver - a 686. Now I've actually seen and operated the lock and - well - I'm at a loss now trying to understand what exactly the big deal is. The thing is very unobtrusive, easy to use and it works without having to attach one of those big ugly trigger locks that fit inside the trigger guard (which is why I never used one even when one came with a gun I bought - Sig P220 for example).

I guess I've switched sides because I kinda like the thing. It is at first look a very utilitarian feature added to the weapon. If the thing ever gets stolen I imagine that lock would render the weapon useless to your average crack head or gang banger. They wouldn't have the smarts to take the weapon apart and disable the lock and if they tried to force the lock I believe the weapon would be rendered useless.

That internal lock seems like a pretty good idea to me now that I've actually used one.

 

[Hypnogator]

I'm with you on this one, Werewolf. I have a Taurus PT-145 Millennium Pro with an integral lock. It works fine, doesn't put itself on, and would enable me to securely lock the weapon without having to unload it on the rare occasions I might have to leave it where children (or untrained adults) might have access to it. It doesn't interfere with my shooting or with the usability of the pistol one bit. It hasn't been engaged since I tested it when I first bought the pistol, but it certainly isn't hurting anything.

 

[carpettbaggerr]

You like it? Fine. I don't want or need it -- and it ruins the lines of the gun. Make it an option, and I've got no problems with it. I won't buy a gun that has one.

 

[Bullet]

I agree with carpettbagger. I bought 4 Smiths within the last month. I usually buy new guns but because of the locks I bought used this time. One good thing about used they didn't cost as much as new and no lock.

 

[CGofMP]

I won't go into my feelings on Smith and the 'sell out'.

I will say this hoever. I do not want ANYHTING added to any weapon I mihgt use for serious work. For every extra part you bolt on, you get an extra chance for a mechanical failure.

Keep it simple, keep it reliable, and keep it from being politically correct.

I'll be smacked if I am gonna trust my life to something I do not trust... and I do not trust intergral locks.

my opinion only..


Charles

 

[jdkelly]

I like Smiths but....

I like S&Ws, I own four or five PC guns and a couple of others. I'm not anti-Smith, and I don't have a problem with those who want to be, though I do get tired of the whining.

That said, I just can't seem to warm up to the LOCK. I just don't like it for purely visual reasons and it has killed several purchases for me. Gun buying, for me, includes being enticed by a firearms "beauty", and that LOCK is an ugly wart, that draws my eye right to it. I suppose at some point in time that I'll get over it, but not for a while.


Respectfully,

jdkelly

 

[juggler]

I'm with Werewolf on this one. The J-frame I recently acquired has an internal lock, and at first I was suspicious of it. What if I loose the key? I would end up with an expensive paperweight until I can get another one from S&W.......which may take awhile considering I ordered one for my 625 awhile back and haven't seen it yet :banghead:

On the other hand my Airweight came with two keys, so I have a spare. I also find that it is easier to use the internal lock than to deal with the trigger locks, and it sure makes storage easier for those times when I have to secure it. I don't leave it loaded when locked though, personal preference.

 

[SnWnMe]

No biggie to me. I don't even know where I put the keys to my two "lockable" Smiths. I have vintage Smiths if I want to enjoy the classic looks. The recent production Smitties are too utilitarian in appearance for me to harp about "lines" anyway.

If I were worried about complexity, I wouldn't use a SW revolver for HD/SD.

If I were to object to the principle of the matter, well, pretty soon I won't be able to buy new guns. Everybody's putting/going to be putting locks on their products.

 

[OH25shooter]

It's no biggie to me either. I don't even know it's there until I wipe over it after a cleaning. I've found gunowners (including myself) are strange fellows. Some like long barrels, short barrels, rubber grips, wood grips, stainless, blue, light triggers, scoped only, or made in America. Others could care less as long as a bullet fires when the trigger is pulled. Yes, we are strange.

 

[Majic]

Being mechanical it's prone to failure. One day we may hear of someone who came to harm because the lock somehow failed and they couldn't use the handgun at the time it was needed most. Mr Murphy is still alive and well and I have no use for the lock.

 

[HSMITH]

I can't comprehend the need for the lock. Are people storing guns in shoeboxes? Not maintaining positive control of the guns? It is redundant at best and outwardly stupid.

What the heck would ever make someone think that a criminal won't call S&W and order a key? It's just rediculous.

There will be no locks on guns I buy, I choose to use my BRAIN instead of rely on some misguided cheesy mechanical device that was forced on me as a result of a sell out. If they offered it as an option I would be OK with it, but since they don't I won't.

 

[Hemicuda]

My new (ish) Smitty 637 has an integral lock... I don't like it a whole lot, 'cause it makes this ugly little dot on the side of the frame...

but it doesn't seem to bother function, as I have yet (in the 5 or 6 monthes that I have had the smitty) to engage the lock... the keys are in the blue box, and stashed soemwhere in the back of a walk-in closet...

I MIGHT be able to access the keys in something just short of an hour, but it'd take some real incentive to do so...

BTW, the original smith cable lock and keys are also still in the plastic bag, inside the blue plastic box...

since I have NO need for a cable lock OR an integral lock, I just don't use them... now to hide that unsightly blemish on the left side of the frame...

 

[Alfadog]

I don't own and have never owned any firearms with internal locks. I've gotten through the last 20 years without integral locks, so I don't see the need for them. They increase the mechanical complexity of the weapon, and therefore inherently make them less reliable. Ever wonder why Remington doesn't put their integral locks in their police versions of the 700 and 870? That's why!

If I were to object to the principle of the matter, well, pretty soon I won't be able to buy new guns. Everybody's putting/going to be putting locks on their products.

I do object to the principle of the matter. Whenever I see a firearm with an integral lock, I feel like the manufacturer is insulting my intelligence. I am damn sure not buying any firearm with an internal lock. If all of the manufacturers start putting in non-removable locks, there are literally millions of nice used guns out there.

If the manufacturers see that guns with integral locks are sitting on the shelves while similar guns without them are moving, we won't be seeing many more integral locks. Vote with your dollars!

 

[Pappy John]

AAIIGHHHH!!!

 

[flatdog]

Hello,

I've got two questions.

1.) Does anyone know of a lock failure that has tied up the gun?

2.) Is the modified thumb piece available for use on Smiths without the internal lock.

Thanks

flatdog.

 

[Daniel T]

Yeah, that's ugly. Too bad S&W didn't go with the Taurus lock if they felt the need to absolutely have one.

 

[jpIII]

I vote against the internal lock!!! but I still like S&W.

REASON: I daily carry a S&W 642. (stainless J frame revolver for those not farmiliar)

Its a great gun, very light, easy to conceal etc.

The internal lock part where you put the key is RUSTING very badly!

I have nothing against the internal lock itsefl, but they could have made it with a better material:banghead:

 

[JNewell]

I hate the locks, too...

...because they're ugly

...because they may make idiots (of whom there are a lot) think, falsely, that the lock somehow absolves them from treating the guns as what it is, a useful but potentially lethal tool

...because some are poorly designed (original Remington; Taurus?)

But if we keep boycotting this and boycotting that, pretty soon the grabbers won't have to try to put the gunmakers out of busines...

...we will do it ourselves.

As far as the ugly S&W wart goes, I have not seen a single report of an inadvertent lockup. The original Remington design did do this, as did the Taurus, IIRC (could be mis-remembering on Taurus).

 

[gulogulo1970]

They don't bother me much. But I'm with Daniel T, why didn't they put it on the hammer like Taurus did you would not even notice it then.

What is up with that 629? I have a 329 and the lock's hole is barely noticed, it looks like they even changed the profile of the frame on the 629. I have not seen that before.

 

[BryanP]

As far as the ugly S&W wart goes, I have not seen a single report of an inadvertent lockup. The original Remington design did do this, as did the Taurus, IIRC (could be mis-remembering on Taurus).

As far as I can find there has never been a reported case of a Taurus intergral lock malfunctioning. I own 3 Taurus revolvers. One has the intergral lock, the other two are older models that do not. I have never had any indication of a problem with the one that does. And yes, the S&W lock is located in a rather unfortunate location. Taurus put it in a place (just below the hammer) that it doesn't uglify the revolver.

 

[J Miller]

Alfadog said it better than I ever could. It's the principle of the thing. I won't be insulted and treated like the company thinks I'm an idiot.

And I do vote with my dollars. I have refused to purchase any gun, made by any manufacturer that has such a built in lock. Period. There are lots of used guns out there for me to choose from.

If these lock equiped guns don't sell, the companies will not go out of business, this is just a scam comment put out by those who can't stand the idea of their favorite gun makers being wrong.
If the lock equiped guns don't sell, they will simply quit making them.

There is NO LAW requiring these idiotic locks, other than what is in the S&W Agreement. The agreement requires them. And S&W IS holding to the agreement. Look it up in the NRA site, or check on this forum, it's been linked to and posted several times. Read it and understand what it says. And no, it has not been abrogated and done away with. Just swept under the rug. It will be there when the next Democrat administration wants to use it to blackmail the gun manufacturers.

Not one gun with a key lock will ever see my ownership. Period.


Joe

 

[Pappy John]

gulogulo

I took some liberties with that image by distorting the lock size. My lock's really no bigger than the one on your 329. I guess if you have to explain a joke it isn't very funny in the first place. Sorry.

 

[Standing Wolf]

Not in my holster!

 

[gulogulo1970]

Pappy John,

Duh, I feel stupid.

Well, at least they really don't look like that. Whew!

 

[flatdog]

Pappy John,

Uh, I guess that means you Photo Shopped the thumb piece too. I should have picked up on that shaded keyhole.

flatdog.