S&W40VE / S&W9VE tips

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oneslowgun

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Ok, BEFORE you all start in on me, hear me out.

I convinced a friend at work to exercise his RKBA. (long story) He agreed that he needed to learn to shoot a pistol, and to be able to defend himself and his family.

Now, he said he would buy a pistol, and have me teach him to use it.. only if I bought a pistol "just like his." (When you think about this, what better reason can you think of to buy a new gun? Another shooter/voter on our side, and you have to add to your own collection!)

So off to the gunshop we go. After picking up and looking at a LOT of pistols (no range to try them out at the shop), he decides he really likes a S&W9VE. The dealer has only one. Remember I agreed that I would buy "The same gun as his." No big thing, I ask the dealer to order me up another S&W9VE. He says he can get another in 5-7 days. Great. My friend while excited about his new purchase, wants to wait untill mine shows up to go to the range. Fine.

A week goes by, and no pistol. BUT my friend points out that there is a S&W40VE in the case. His logic is they are the same size and weight, and if I get the .40, he gets to try out the same pistol in 9mm, and .40. So as per our agreement, I buy the .40.

Now..... Both of these pistols have about the WORST trigger I have ever felt, short of a Davis Derringer. The sights are WAY too fine for defencive work, and the mag base plates (for carry, that is the next step for him) are just...bad.

In my opinion, these pistols need a melt job (at least at the front end,) a trigger job (to at least 4.5# to 5#.) The sights either "opened up", or replaced (if replace, night sights with a similar countour.) New mag base plates, or a grinder taken to them.

NOW.... Any help you all can offer? Remember, HE thought the S&W9VE fit HIS hand the best of his choices, and in order for HIM to make his FIRST handgun purchase, I had to buy " One like his".

The deal is done, and now I need help in making these (9mm & .40 S&W's) into shooters.

Long post... But I thought if you all had the whole story, we could avoid all the "toss it and buy something else" kinda thing.
 
Now..... Both of these pistols have about the WORST trigger I have ever felt, short of a Davis Derringer.
Click to expand...

Try an AMT Backup .45. The Sigma has a hair trigger by comparison. :neener:

OK, supposedly these is a Wolff striker spring available that will take some of the weight off the pull. I don't have it on my Sigma, mainly b/c I went into the purchase expecting a lawyer-proof trigger. It can be mastered but takes a little more work than your average Glock or 1911. There are a couple of 'smiths offering trigger jobs for these guns, but it is extremely expensive (figure I see most often is $150), so I chose to avoid this option.

Checkout www.cdnninvestments.com for good deals on night sights. This modification is on my list for my Sigma. Should be around $60 or so. I don't know who makes them. Meprolights are my absolute favorite.

I've seen pictures of instances where people have taken dremels to Sigma mag bases and came away with good results. The can be smoothed out quite nicely. Definitely want to order a few extra plates to "play" with as a backup for slips. The other thing about the bases is that there were 2 different one. The earlier baseplates for both .40 and 9mm were excessively thick (they actually added 1 round to the mag capacity). Later S&W redesigned the baseplates for a much lower profile but they still have that squared off Sigma look.

I, personally, am happy with my Sigma 9VE. IMO it's a pretty good gun for the money.
 
Great info SouthpawShootr, thank you.

I personally would'nt have picked either of these pistols for SD/HD, but I'm glad you like and have had good luck with yours.

The thing to keep in mind, is that my friend (a first time handgun buyer) felt that this firearm fit him well, and who am I to say different?

The money I spent on buying a like pistol (in .40) seemed fair to me, to add another to our ranks.

Now I just want to make these two pistols into the "best" shooters they can be.
 
Shoot them!!
The trigger will fire smooth out.
It is set, at the factory, at about 8-10 pounds, although, I think mine is a bit heavier.
I have an original, pre ban SW40F.
Yeah, the trigger was heavy!!! :eek:
But, it smoothed out after a couple boxes of ammo!!
Besides, you don't know what a heavy trigger is until you have squeezed off a double action shot out of a Walther PPK!!!!! :evil: They are set at about 20lbs!!

After a few rounds, your trigger finger aches for that Sigma!! ;)
 
A little gun grease in the right spots will help the trigger pull to be smoother and a little lighter.If you take it apart for cleaning and look into the frame,work the trigger back and forth and you'll see where to put a very little grease.Buy lots of ammo and shoot it,the trigger will get better with time.
 
Sigma 40F

I too have a pre 1994 Sigma 40F,and I don't know how much they changed the newer ones,but the 9Fand 40F models would take a Glock striker spring. You can get a 4lb wolf spring from Brownells and get the pull down around 5 -6 lbs.
I also got a lot of improvement by polishing and deburing all the surfaces in the trigger linkage. I grease everything with graphite grease for lube.

For the $$ they are a good buy, the trigger is no worse than many DA revolvers I have shot. You just have to get used to it. My Sigma 40F is as accurate as any Glock 22. It is easy to transition from a 1911 as for me, it points the same.

In fact my 40F is going to the S&W IDPA Inv. Match this coming week, I don't have a problem with using it as a "game" gun either.

BTW- the 40F barrel works great in my Glock 22, when I want to shoot lead in it. :)

It's also how I got my name :rolleyes:

Sigma40sw
 
I recently purchased a Sigma in 9mm and the trigger was stiff (around 9.5 pounds) but I did a "Poor man's trigger job" and it works great. To do this just remove the striker spring and clip off about 5-6 coils and reinstall it. This will bring the trigger down to about 5 to 5.5 pounds and still strike the primer hard enough to fire rounds, even the hard primers that can be found in foriegn ammo. Be carefull not to clip to much off though!

Wolff Springs also makes a striker spring that will do the same thing, but I found that although it lightens the trigger to a very nice pull, the strikes on primers were lighter than I liked.

NOTE: I cant be held responsible for any damage that may be done to your gun as a result off bad amatuer gunsmithing. Do so at your own discretion.
 
Take them out to the range with 500 rds of ammo (each), shoot the dog out of them, take them home and clean. I have 2 of the Sigma 40's and the trigger starts to smooth out aroud 300 rds or so. The grease is a good idea also. I'll have to check into that.
 
This crap about the Sigma gets old, to me anyway.

The ergos beat the Glock to death.
S&W service beats the snot out of Glock.
The sights are far superior to the Glock.
The magazines are better built than the Glock.
The "trigger safety" is a much more comfortable design than the Glock.
The price puts the Glock to shame.

The trigger is heavy (who has not heard this or tried out the pistol before buying?) But they are certainly no heavier than a DA wheelie.

IMO.
 
If you need to do all of those things to the pistol, then you need a different pistol (and to be honest to your friend). Sigma ergos are nice (suckered me too) and the trigger pulls are heavy; that's life.

If this is going to be a carry pistol, then going crazy cutting springs is not a good idea. Reliability is important also. A reduced power striker spring helps some, but a reliable 5 pound trigger probably isn't going to happen. The thing glocks have over the sigma is trigger adjustability (and I'm not a big glock fan). I did the dry-fire thing (2K-3K times at least) and it helped somewhat with smoothness, but it was still a heavy trigger.

The happiest day with my sigma (sw9ve) was the day I sold it.

If you do decide to get something different, I'd look very hard at the new M&P. S&W got that one right.
 
I took my 40VE out after months in the safe since I bought my M&P40. The biggest thing I found that irked me compared to my M&P is the lack of grip on the Sigma. It was slippery compared to the M&P, and it beat up my hand a bit more than the M&P (which is something that irked me before but I forgot). The 9mm probably isn't a problem because of the lesser recoil, but I have actually considered having my 40 textured some to increase grip. That's just a thought. The trigger wears in some, and you don't really notice it after a while, cause your finger gets stronger. Then you start slapping the triggers on your others guns because you're used to the loooooooong pull.
 
I think it is hilarious that everyone beats up on how heavy the Sigma trigger appears to be for them.

If that is the biggest complaint, then they failed to understand the purpose of the gun.

When I first bought and sho tmine, I went low and left, and my groups were about 8 inches at 75 feet.

I walked in closer to 21 feet, and practiced a ssteady slow pull and came in to about 3 inches, still low and left.

I then looked at my ammo choices from 180, 165, and 155 gr. I found the heavier bullets went low and left, and the middle weight 165gr came in the middle. The 155gr went high.

I lube it, clean it, and I shoot the devil out of it. I like it.

How many $300 guns can offer the function and feature of the VE series? A lot of people will point out used stuff, foreign stuff, and plain old wishful-thinking stuff.

I also learned the trick of the trigger is to use the tip of the finger pad only. Most people jerk the trigger, and they joint-pull the trigger.

Yes, the M&P is a better gun, with nicer features and lighter trigger; for another $125-150.

I have a few of these VEs, and they are like BICs.
 
The Sigma is a great defensive weapon. It is glock like, with a few improvements. Yes the trigger is heavy..its suppose to be, and not a bad idea for a defensive weapon. If your looking for a target pistol get one and skip the Sigma. However if your looking for a defensive pistol, the Sigma is an excellent choice. Did I mention the deal S&W has going on right now? You get 2 free mags, or a $30 rebate.
 
Are you kidding?

My dad and I each bought one of the the S&W's 9 and 40 VE series. They a nothing but a piece of junk being blown out at gun shows in my area for under $300. I so want to walk up to the obvious first time purchaser considering the gun and tel him to put it down and buy anything else.

The trigger is not just bad. It is Horrific. I can't think of a word despicable enough to describe it. The recoil is very poorly controlled do to the bore axis vs. grip differential. I was lucky to unload mine on someone for what I paid and never looked back.

I am not a Glock fan by ANY measure having owned an early model in '92, but to compare a Glock to the S&W crap is not even in the realm of sanity. The only person who could defend these guns is someone who bought one and can't find a sucker to sell it to.

I have 2 dozen handguns in my safe and I have shot S&W autos since the late '70's. These guns are an embarassment to S&W.

The only melt job they need is in a smelting vat. I will go against anybody with one of these guns any time with anything in my safe including my Ruger .22 target. Get real. If you bought one you got suckered and any attempt to defend this piece of cr*p as a usable weapon is a plaintive justification of a decision made for economic reasons under the influence of some mind altering substance. So in purchasing one you committed a felony by lying about the drugs you take.

These are the Yugos of the pistol world. If you are old enough to undersand that.
 
I've got a 40VE for my primary carry. Love it. Hi-cap, well-made, inexpensive, and dependable. 1600+ rds thru it so far. I'd buy it again in a heartbeat.
 
I have a 9mm Sigma. The trigger was very rough out of the box, but after a few trips to the range, it really worked itself out. I am a big fan of the slightly heavier trigger pull merely for safety reasons and despite the heavier pull, I can put the rounds where I want them to go. That's the important thing!
 
+1 to Glockensig, lol You took words right out of my fingers.

I have the Sigma in 9mm and for me it shoots great. Either I am getting more used to the trigger pull is it has softened up.

I see no problem with the sights for that matter either.

For me the pistol shoots straight and eats ammo. I would recommend it in a heartbeat.

For the record I could have bought about whatever pistol I wanted and after looking around a lot I got what I wanted.
 
Have a Sigma 40E that I bought used about three years ago. Since then, I have fired untold amounts of rounds (both factory in any & every brand I could find in any weight bullet on sale, and all kinds of reloads) & it has never once failed to fire! For the price, it is one hell of a gun, with a great warranty backed by a company that honors that warranty without any grief. The trigger can be mastered with dry firing and range time, and once it is mastered, you will notice that, due to the heavy trigger pull on the Sigma, you will shoot your other pistols more accurately. No regrets on its purchase; it was money well spent!
 
ElectraGlide,

what is the matter, not strong enough to pull a revolver weight trigger?

Did yours kaboom? Doubt it.

Don't like the better sights and stronger mags? (mags that always function by the way.)

Not enough non human hand stinking finger grooves?

Don't like a pistol that was meant to be shot with the .40?

If it is not for you, fine.

But to label others as you did for seeing the plusses in the gun, and the value says more about you than them.
 
Well TexasShooter,

Maybe I was a bit (just) harsh. I can pull a revolver (last time I checked), but why torture myself when a much decent pull can be had for only slightly more $.

The gun (both calibers) doesn't handle recoil well. I know I am setting my self up for a flame, but I regularly shoot a DE in .50 AE. So I can handle recoil. Yea, I know...I can hear it comming... The 9mm recoil is so out of proportion with other guns that after first firing it you have a question mark on your face. Checking the ammo, did I get it back together correctly?

Point in fact though, S&W is having a hard time giving these things away and to hear people slather over them is nauseating.

Whoops, there I go again having a viceral reaction...it's just guns, motorcycles, wiskey and women get me going...If you all like go ahead and shoot 'em. The novelty will wear off after the first KB (yup I did have one).
 
Point in fact though, S&W is having a hard time giving these things away and to hear people slather over them is nauseating.
You are aware that the Sigma is S&W best selling pistol? They have also shiped tens of thousands overseas for our allies in the war on terror. The Sigma VE is a solid design.
 
CarbineKid,

I can't find any contemporary information to substantiate your claim the Sigma is a best seller. Just because S&W is "dumping" them over seas doesn't qualify as a best seller.

The M&P line is Smith's answer to the Smegma (sp?) M&P has improved trigger and much safer takedown i.e. not having dry fire to take down.

The M&P were overpriced when introduced and failed to take off as S&W had hoped. Price reductions and Law Enforcement endorsements have made the M&P a viable, fairly priced product eclipsing the Sigma domestically.

When I can buy a used Sigma from a desperate soul at a gun show for under $200 (ammo thrown in) it makes you go hmmmmm.

No offense to all, but after the Glock lawsuit Smith had to blow these out and come up with a new product to market to Law.

I personally have never seen a Sigma on any LEO hip...

Just dry fire that Sigma and listen to the sound....boing, clank, sproink...(Is that a word?) Sorry just not quality.
 
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