Safe trouble round 2

[ttownrider]

One thing the locksmith told me about mechanicals is that they can be somewhat delicate inside so do not spin the dial, especially quickly, when closing and locking the safe as that can wear some parts out making the combination "walk" a few numbers either way.

That's correct, but it takes a lot of abuse to get to that point. I serviced bank vaults that had the original locks that we're decades old. Those were opened daily and not treated very nice. They get some drift, but still opened. The only advantage electronic offers is speed, and that can be fixed by entering the first 1 or 2 numbers on a mechanical as leaving it.

 

[edwardware]

I have a few safes and my Cannon was given to me because the relocker fired during transport. . .

I have repeatedly looked at a safe I was loading, and wondered. . . what's the chances a frangible relocker link is about to spoil my week?

My solution had been to strap the door closed, boltwork unlocked for transport.

 

[ttownrider]

I have repeatedly looked at a safe I was loading, and wondered. . . what's the chances a frangible relocker link is about to spoil my week?

My solution had been to strap the door closed, boltwork unlocked for transport.

Actually glass relockers aren't as common as you think. Most are a spring loaded pin that fires when the lock is messed with. The bouncing of the truck tripped it locking it up. I always tell people to transport a safe with the door open and the safe locked, and then check it a few times before ever closing the door. No way at all to lock yourself out that way. If it locks up you can access the door and fix it yourself, otherwise your have to call for help or just give it away. I got a very nice 40 gun safe for the cost of a little paint and about 20 minutes of my time

 

[edwardware]

Actually glass relockers aren't as common as you think. . . I got a very nice 40 gun safe for the cost of a little paint and about 20 minutes of my time

I've never moved one without pulling the door cover to be sure, and never found a glass plate. None the less, the spring pins and low-temp alloy frangible links make me nervous.

I have found, recovered, or been given several smaller containers left locked shut. . . it turns out manipulation isn't that hard (just slow) and fortunately I never had to drill a door.

 

[whisler]

My buddy is a locksmith and when I told him I wanted a safe he specifically said "don't gt an electronic lock". I didn't!

 

[Elkins45]

In every safe I've owned or worked on, and every lock I've seen. . . the electronic lock footprint is exactly the same as the mechanical footprint. The only exceptions I know of are the store-brand level sheet metal shoeboxes.

A complete used S&G or Kaba mechanical lock can be had for $50 or so on ebay, or $100 for a new lock kit. Installing really isn't hard. . . if you wrench your own cars it's easy.

Drop that electronic in the trash and install a mechanical this week. Check carefully for operation and binding.

A new complete S&G kit is $79 on Amazon. That seems like a bargain.

 

[WestKentucky]

Cannon seems to be taking care of me by supplying replacement parts. I guess that will suffice for now and hopefully soon I can buy another safe with a dial lock and kick this one out to the garage for project guns and reloading stuff.

 

[doubleh]

I'm going through a similar issue with my LaGard mechanical combination lock. I specifically went that route because I assumed a mechanical lock would be more reliable, but lately it's been taking 3-4 tries to open. Yesterday I gave up after about 15 attempts so it must be time to buy a replacement.

Try taking it out of the safe and oiling it. My mechanical lock was giving me problems after many years of use and I took it out to lube it to see if it would help. My wife asked me if machine oil would work. Considering how much use her machine gets and has no problems I used the machine oil on my lock. It still has a problem. It works so easily I have to be careful or I will over run my combination and have to start over. I guess the problem is really me instead of the lock now. Joking aside, the lock works with less effort now than when brand new.

 

[Stubert]

I just had a mechanical lock installed on my safe, My door has exterior hinges, so I took off the door, brought it to a locksmith and had the electric lock replaced with an S&G dial lock. Cost was $200.00 total. If I had him do it at my house, it would have been another $50.00 for a service call. Still WAY less than a new safe.

 

[Reloadron]

When I got my safe one thing I was OCD about was I wanted a mechanical tumbler and nothing electronic. I guess it's been maybe 8-9 years ago and never an issue. A retired EE and I simply never did trust the electronic locking systems. Just my own thinking but too many things to go wrong.

Ron

 

[mnrivrat]

I have heard to many stories of electronic safe issues. I purchased a double door document safe from the 1930's or 40's for $100 . Fire proof with a cement I think and a little over 1,000 pounds. Works for me.

 

[daniel craig]

This is why I stay away from electronic safes.

 

[DustyGmt]

I feel your pain. Although I have the fail key but requires the electronic key pad to be removed. The batteries leaked all over and corroded the terminals so it's toast. I have contacted StackOn six different times over the course of two years about a replacement battery compartment and not one customer service rep has replied to my inquiry.

Aside from the battery leak I've had the safe for years, for one of the more budget friendly options it's been a good safe. No malfunctions. It's one of StackOns better options I believe, nice thick steel. Not one of the flimsy lockers for which they are known for. My uncle has a liberty, massive. Awesome safe.

 

[bassjam]

Try taking it out of the safe and try oiling it. My mechanical lock was giving me problems after many years of use and I took it out to lube it to see if it would help. My wife asked me if machine oil would work. Considering how much use her machine gets and has no problems I used the machine oil on my lock. It still has a problem. It works so easily I have to be careful or I will over run my combination and have to start over. I guess the problem is really me instead of the lock now. Joking aside, the lock works with less effort now than when brand new.

My problem got significantly worse when I stuck the oil straw through the crack at the back of the dial and gave it a couple drops of Eezox. Before the dial was sticking and squeaking, after I oiled it spun freely but not it might take several tries to get open. I've since then done some research and found that many locksmiths recommend a dry lube like graphite for mechanical combination locks, they claim oil can gum up the mechanism and cause the exact problem I'm having right now. I need to take it out and see if I can clear out the oil and use a dry lube instead. If not, a new lock isn't that expensive.

 

[WestKentucky]

I just got an email from Cannon saying that replacement parts are on order for me. That will get the safe back into operation but I still don’t like electronic lock. I think a new safe is in order at some point this year. They tend to go on sale around thanksgiving.

 

[doubleh]

My problem got significantly worse when I stuck the oil straw through the crack at the back of the dial and gave it a couple drops of Eezox. Before the dial was sticking and squeaking, after I oiled it spun freely but not it might take several tries to get open. I've since then done some research and found that many locksmiths recommend a dry lube like graphite for mechanical combination locks, they claim oil can gum up the mechanism and cause the exact problem I'm having right now. I need to take it out and see if I can clear out the oil and use a dry lube instead. If not, a new lock isn't that expensive.

Mine was dry inside. If it eventually gums up it's not exactly rocket science to remove the lock, spray it out with carb cleaner and re-lube it. I had never messed with a safe lock before and it took me all of thirty minutes to remove, oil, and re-install the lock without ever having seen one before.

 

[Thunderchicken]

Mine was dry inside. If it eventually gums up it's not exactly rocket science to remove the lock, spray it out with carb cleaner and re-lube it. I had never messed with a safe lock before and it took me all of thirty minutes to remove, oil, and re-install the lock without ever having seen one before.

Did you have to do anything to make sure the combination didn’t change or isn’t that a concern? I’m hoping mine will go a long time before I need to lubricate it. I am a huge opponent of electronic locks. The worst, of course, are the “biometric” snake-oil specials. It’s surprising how often the electronic ones can be hacked, even ignoring how often they lock out the owner.

I expect a rash of internet-connected gun safe locks in the next few years (haven’t seen one yet but marketers are marketers), since people have shown they’re willing to buy them for their houses... it’s bad enough someone can walk up and open my door with a brick or a bump key, but having ten million people in their mother’s basement in Belgium attacking it is even less desirable.

 

[doubleh]

I didn't do anything but remove the lock from the door, apply oil, and replace it. There was no change in the combination although I did try the lock with the door open and before I replaced the inside door cover just to make sure everything was going to work like before.

 

[random_guy]

Just replaced my electronic lock on my liberty for the mechanical S&G lock on Amazon for $80. Only problem I ran into was the 1/4-20 screws to hold the mechanical lock to the safe were too long. Went to fastenal and for less then $2 got the correct ones. Learned a lot about how locks work from the little project. On the S&G lock you need to use the special key to change the combo, its easy to do and came with the lock I got from Amazon.

 

[WestKentucky]

Just replaced my electronic lock on my liberty for the mechanical S&G lock on Amazon for $80. Only problem I ran into was the 1/4-20 screws to hold the mechanical lock to the safe were too long. Went to fastenal and for less then $2 got the correct ones. Learned a lot about how locks work from the little project. On the S&G lock you need to use the special key to change the combo, its easy to do and came with the lock I got from Amazon.

If you could share a link or product number or something of the sort I would appreciate the info.

 

[PWC]

23 yrs as ele technician for the USAF, and remembering the movie "Failsafe" where there is an equipment failure, and Dom Delouise, as the ele repair tech, that replaces the defective plug-in module. Therein is the crux of the whole story.

Electronics are great, today's lifestyles would be impossible without them, but my experience is they are, in many applications, fragile.

 

[FAS1]

If you could share a link or product number or something of the sort I would appreciate the info.

This might help you.

 

[WestKentucky]

That does help, and I think my safe is setup to take that lock without any modification. I will probably be ordering one in the very near future, after I pull off my inner door to verify that it is set up in a way that will work.

 

[bassjam]

Mine was dry inside. If it eventually gums up it's not exactly rocket science to remove the lock, spray it out with carb cleaner and re-lube it. I had never messed with a safe lock before and it took me all of thirty minutes to remove, oil, and re-install the lock without ever having seen one before.

I finally took the inside panel off my safe and opened up the back panel of the lock this afternoon. There was graphite powder all over the inside, so I believe the oil I had sprayed from the other side just hit the "axle" of the dial and never made it into the combination mechanism.

Anyway, I reset my combination and that seems to have fixed it so it didn't appear to be a lube related problem at all. One or two of the numbers must have drifted over time. I bought this safe used so who knows what kind of likfe it had, and I know a couple of my kids have had fun spinning the dial as well before I caught them and put a stop to it. But I just unlocked it 20 times in a row without a problem; before today it was rare to open it twice in a row and it normally took 4 or so attempts.

 

[doubleh]

Glad to hear you have it working again and it didn't cost you anything but some time.