Safety

[JRH6856]

I am off downstairs for a Bacon Butty!
And with a nod to my adopted Country, Coffee, not Tea.

Well, that's something we can agree on. I just finished one.

 

[1911Tuner]

All I know for sure, the pistol was fully in the holster, trigger not seen.

Not doubtin' your word. I know it can happen...but not from sand on the magazine. There was something wrong with the pistol's internals. That's a spec/dimensional problem...not a design problem.

 

[herrwalther]

I don't play around with my 1911 often since the one I have is a prima donna safe queen. Seriously it has its own dehumidifier. But if some sand in the magazine would cause them to fire, there would be lots of missing big toes from WWII, Korea, and Vietnam vets. The few 1911 misfires I have seen were caused by the best thing about the 1911: that SA trigger. The popular Youtube gentleman (name escapes me at the moment) shot himself in the thigh with a 1911. Watching the video on slow motion shows his finger in the trigger. He also explained he was using a Thumbdrive holster. While I like the Thumbdrive, I think it is the worst holster to use for a 1911. It uses a thumb button release and on a 1911 they are really close to each other.

 

[RussellC]

As to the life and death situation and the poster who commented that if you were ready to fire and the safety was on, it would only take a second or two...

One one thousand, two one thousand....2 seconds. I recently saw a study that stated that the average person could close 7 yards and deliver a fatal stab wound in about a second and a half...

Love my Glock!
Russellc

 

[breakingcontact]

How in the world does sweeping a safety off take 2 seconds...or even 1?

 

[dmazur]

See post #99.

It takes me about 0.5 sec, during the presentation.

If you don't have time to get familiar with a safety, carry something else. But the fault is the apathy of the owner.

With practice, safeties are not a concern.

I read of one prospective 1911 owner who thought he'd save time by carrying in Condition 0 (cocked safety off). This is apples and oranges. If you want a Glock, get a Glock.

Regardless of your choice, you should understand it completely.

 

[1911Tuner]

Carrying a 1911 in Condition Zero is neither here nor there. The gun isn't going to fire unless the trigger is pulled, and as long as it's not held in a firing grip, the trigger can't be pulled...assuming a functioning grip safety.

The thumb safety wasn't added to the pistol for carrying cocked and locked. The first 8 prototypes that were submitted didn't even have a manual safety. The manual safety was the final modification.

 

[dmazur]

Yes, that is correct. And the protocol was to carry with hammer down (now called Condition 2), using that nice big spur hammer to ready the pistol. Soldiers were used to cocking SA revolvers and this was similar. At least, that's what I've read.

Condition 1 is most definitely modern. (Cooper?)

But so are bobbed hammers and the reluctance to carry in Condition 2.

I agree that a properly fitted grip safety protects the trigger, except for the rare operator errors like retention strap through trigger guard. And then multiple safeties pay off.

 

[Old Guy]

The reason I changed from 1911, in IPSC, to a Glock 17, missing the safety catch at a big USPSA match, many years ago. Never happened before. But once was quite enough.

Since moving to Orlando, Glock 19. Every day carry, also IDPA match pistol.
I know where this pistol shoots.

 

[Gun Runnerz]

Well there's two schools of thought. I can understand why someone would prefer not to have a manual safety. It is another step to accomplish before you're shooting, but if you've trained for it then it should be a big deal. I also see the validity in the redundant safeties argument.

 

[Life During Wartime]

A pistol on safety is not immediately shootable. Some people don't like this. And while it is true that they can just leave it off safety all the time, when you expect a pistol to go bang and maybe because it got caught on something and accidentally put on safe and it doesn't fire, that's not a good situation. That is most likely a fear however than a probabilistic event.

My obsrevation:
People that don't like safeties generally like Glock "Safe Action Pistols" while people that do generally like 1911's.

My preference:
I like having manual safeties.

The biggest advantage of having a magazine disconnect is in the event of a hand to hand fight over the gun, you drop the mag and make the gun inoperable until you can get it back. If you get the gun back, you load it with a spare mag and boom the bad dude is hopefully incapacitated.
The biggest disadvantage to it is, you have to have a mag to fire it. This is somewhat of a non-issue if you bought the gun new, but on some older mod.s that might not have available magazines, it can be problematic to find mags to shoot it. Magazine disconnects are also rather annoying when you are cleaning or training with your gun.

 

[justice06rr]

Mostly it is knee jerk reaction by people whose gun knowledge comes from the internet. I love guns with redundant safeties so I can choose to use them or not. Most of my guns have hammers and safeties. Many will say that it is possible that your safety can engage without you knowing it. It is also possible that Pam Anderson will marry me and we will honeymoon in my yacht in Monte Carlo. A lot of things are possible but unlikely.

Your brain may be the most important safety but unfortunately it is not the best. If it were we would not have so many safety devices in our lives and would not be reading about so many unintentional discharges. We are human and therefore subject to mental errors and those who cavalierly say keep your finger off the safety should check to see how telling someone to drive safe works.

^ I like this guy!

Safeties are there for a reason. Which is also why shotguns, AR15's, AK's, and many other firearms have safeties. Use it if you like, don't use it if you don't. But don't use it as a lame excuse that "I won't have a gun with an external safety". TRAINING IS KEY.

I hate wearing a seatbelt, but hey its a safety feature right?

I also hate wearing a helmet when I ride my motorcycle, but I do it anyway. I see plenty of other cruiser riders without one though...