AMBASSADOR
Member
Whose got pictures of scoped or Red Dot handguns?Would appreciate pictures.
Scoped Handguns
- Thread starter AMBASSADOR
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MT GUNNY
Member
Id like to see a S&W 460XVR /scope.
Steve in PA
Member
Ruger Super Redhawk .44magnum.
Don357
Member
Stevie-Ray
Member
Ruger Redhawk, Burris 2X
Acera
Member
That is something else RyanM. How many permits (tax stamps) does it require, and what kind? Did you get it from a dealer or mfg. it yourself?
RyanM,
What's your thinking with those sights? I don't intend to sound like an
about that choice, but I would have stuck with some iron night sights myself...
I'm always curious when people choose differently than I do, it keeps me learning.
Thanks
What's your thinking with those sights? I don't intend to sound like an
about that choice, but I would have stuck with some iron night sights myself... I'm always curious when people choose differently than I do, it keeps me learning.
Thanks
Floppy_D
Member In Memoriam
Why did you photograph those in the refrigerator? ***? 
My Ruger SBH Hunter is scoped part of the time, I'll dig out pics. To eyebrows' dismay, I won't be photographing them in major appliances.
My Ruger SBH Hunter is scoped part of the time, I'll dig out pics. To eyebrows' dismay, I won't be photographing them in major appliances.
Magnum.35744
Member
- Joined
- Jun 30, 2007
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- 149
Haha Floppy D...
To each, his own...
To each, his own...
gbran
Member
.38 Special
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- Joined
- Sep 15, 2006
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- 7,367
I don't think that's the whole story. I believe the bore is too large to allow classification as a handgun.
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Until RyanM chimes back in, I guess we won't know for sure, but I think the NFA exempts it if it's rifled and shoots a shotgun shell.
http://www.atf.gov/pub/fire-explo_pub/nfa.htm
Okiecruffler
Member
Seems like I have a couple around here somewhere.
Acera
Member
Jimmie, if rifled you might be correct. But with the vertical pivoting foregrip attached that would not be legal if he did not have a stamp.
I also just don't know what kind of increase in accuracy you can expect from the scope, hopefully RyanM will chime in and let us know more about this unique gun.
I also just don't know what kind of increase in accuracy you can expect from the scope, hopefully RyanM will chime in and let us know more about this unique gun.
Can't yall tell it's a serbu shorty with a pachmayr grip and scope? This must not be where the shotgun crowd browses...
It's a $5 tax because Serbu gets their 590 receivers made (from the factory) as 'pistol' receivers, meant for PGO. Also, it's very accurate and recoil isn't too bad with the new grip.
It's a $5 tax because Serbu gets their 590 receivers made (from the factory) as 'pistol' receivers, meant for PGO. Also, it's very accurate and recoil isn't too bad with the new grip.
MCgunner
Member
Acera
Member
CZ 42 I would have to agree with you. I think it is an AOW, as stated on their website.
But, the RyanM said:
I think we all figured it was his gun, and he might know what he is talking about.
But, the RyanM said:
I think we all figured it was his gun, and he might know what he is talking about.
I should've posted pictures of that here instead of the shotgun forum to begin with!
Anyway, in order...
It's a plain old Super-Shorty, made by Serbu Firearms in FL. It's an AOW, so it requires a $5 transfer tax. Still $200 to register if you make one yourself, but an AOW doesn't require any paperwork to move across state lines, so there are still some benefits.
--------------
On title II "smoothbore pistol" vs. title I regular pistol, I actually had a discussion with Mark Serbu on that many moons ago. He said that, by his interpretation of the law anyway, a shotgun shipped from the factory with PGO and fitted with a shortened rifled barrel would indeed be a standard title I pistol, with no tax stamps or anything necessary at all. Sort of like the infamous .600 NE T-C Contender, firearms over .50 cal chambered in a "sporting purpose" caliber, like 12 gauge or an elephant hunting caliber, are exempt from large-bore DD classification.
However, the Super-Shorty uses a fold-down vertical foregrip, making it an AOW twice. So you'd need to do a 12" barrel, or a custom made horizontal foregrip, to have a rifled shottie be a normal pistol.
Also, given that the ATF decided to classify "street sweeper" shotguns, the USAS-12, etc., as destructive devices, you'd want to have a notarized copy of an ATF technical whatever letter on hand before you try making something like that.
Anyway, I referred to it as a "handgun," with quotes, because both AOW classifications are handgun-based. It's a smoothbore pistol, and a pistol with more than one grip.
---------------
Recoil isn't that bad. With the factory grip, it felt about like shooting .454 Casull with a very uncomfortable wood grip, when using slugs. With the Pachmayr grip, it feels more like heavy bullet .44 magnum handloads through a gun with soft cushy rubber grips. Shooting Remington 125 gr .357 magnum SJHPs through a Ruger SP-101 hurt my hand a lot more!
---------------
Mostly, I was thinking "I could either attempt to drill a hole in the barrel, with nothing but a hand drill and c-clamps at my disposal, in order to fit a front sight, or I can take out these 4 little screws, attach a Picatinny rail, and slap on a Red Dot scope."
Normal sights would probably be much more practical, and a lot of times I have to play "find the dot" with the scope, but it was much easier to install, and about the same cost as a set of sights.
-------------------
What kind of accuracy was I expecting? Very little! But what kind of accuracy did I get?
7 yards. I shot the target with 3 birdshot shells, then just for fun loaded up 3 slugs. I just shot one from the hip, then used the red dot to aim for the bullet hole. 2 more holes appeared about a foot away from the first, and I went "well, I wasn't expecting anything great, but this sucks!" Then I took a closer look. None of the other new holes had lead "rings" around them, so they must've just been the wadding, and the center hole is irregularly shaped, like all 3 went through there.
It wasn't a fluke. I've done similar, 1-2" groups at 7-10 yards with it since then, which is about what I normally shoot with handguns. But 3 through one hole at 7 yards is what the gun and scope are capable of.
Anyone who says short barrels are inherently inaccurate is talking out of their butt.
Anyway, in order...
It's a plain old Super-Shorty, made by Serbu Firearms in FL. It's an AOW, so it requires a $5 transfer tax. Still $200 to register if you make one yourself, but an AOW doesn't require any paperwork to move across state lines, so there are still some benefits.
--------------
On title II "smoothbore pistol" vs. title I regular pistol, I actually had a discussion with Mark Serbu on that many moons ago. He said that, by his interpretation of the law anyway, a shotgun shipped from the factory with PGO and fitted with a shortened rifled barrel would indeed be a standard title I pistol, with no tax stamps or anything necessary at all. Sort of like the infamous .600 NE T-C Contender, firearms over .50 cal chambered in a "sporting purpose" caliber, like 12 gauge or an elephant hunting caliber, are exempt from large-bore DD classification.
However, the Super-Shorty uses a fold-down vertical foregrip, making it an AOW twice. So you'd need to do a 12" barrel, or a custom made horizontal foregrip, to have a rifled shottie be a normal pistol.
Also, given that the ATF decided to classify "street sweeper" shotguns, the USAS-12, etc., as destructive devices, you'd want to have a notarized copy of an ATF technical whatever letter on hand before you try making something like that.
Anyway, I referred to it as a "handgun," with quotes, because both AOW classifications are handgun-based. It's a smoothbore pistol, and a pistol with more than one grip.
---------------
Recoil isn't that bad. With the factory grip, it felt about like shooting .454 Casull with a very uncomfortable wood grip, when using slugs. With the Pachmayr grip, it feels more like heavy bullet .44 magnum handloads through a gun with soft cushy rubber grips. Shooting Remington 125 gr .357 magnum SJHPs through a Ruger SP-101 hurt my hand a lot more!
---------------
Mostly, I was thinking "I could either attempt to drill a hole in the barrel, with nothing but a hand drill and c-clamps at my disposal, in order to fit a front sight, or I can take out these 4 little screws, attach a Picatinny rail, and slap on a Red Dot scope."
Normal sights would probably be much more practical, and a lot of times I have to play "find the dot" with the scope, but it was much easier to install, and about the same cost as a set of sights.
-------------------
What kind of accuracy was I expecting? Very little! But what kind of accuracy did I get?
7 yards. I shot the target with 3 birdshot shells, then just for fun loaded up 3 slugs. I just shot one from the hip, then used the red dot to aim for the bullet hole. 2 more holes appeared about a foot away from the first, and I went "well, I wasn't expecting anything great, but this sucks!" Then I took a closer look. None of the other new holes had lead "rings" around them, so they must've just been the wadding, and the center hole is irregularly shaped, like all 3 went through there.
It wasn't a fluke. I've done similar, 1-2" groups at 7-10 yards with it since then, which is about what I normally shoot with handguns. But 3 through one hole at 7 yards is what the gun and scope are capable of.
Anyone who says short barrels are inherently inaccurate is talking out of their butt.
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