"Self defense is a Myth"

[callgood]

Self defense IS a myth. For some people. But not for me.

I avoid places where self defense is more likely to be necessary, try to keep aware in places where it should not be necessary and am willing to defend myself if necessary.

I refuse to sink to the level of the lowest common denominator where my life is concerned.

If these boobs really believe that, maybe I could make a fast buck selling tshirts and sweats with that philosophy imprinted.

 

[RoadkingLarry]

I can't help but wonder if the dolt meant that the RIGHT to self defense was a myth...
I think that is an area we need to focus on, that we as human beings have a fundamental RIGHT to self defense and that for the vast majority of people a firearm is the most effextive means of being able to exercise that right.

 

[Kitchen_Duty]

I'll army crawl just far enough to tip over some concealment/cover and draw out my carry pistol. Write your senators, we need CC on campus

 

[Duramaximum]

"Army crawl out of the building!?!?!" Why do I get the feeling this hoser has never been in the Army, or the Corp, or the Navy, or the Air Force?

Army crawl so that you can be a slow target with a large center of mass instead of booking it out of there! Brilliant! :banghead:

What will they think of next? Put your finger in the tip of barrel so they can't shoot you like Bugs Bunny.

 

[FieroCDSP]

Folks, you have to remember that these people are under the belief that the average joe can't handle the truth. It's the same idea the government was pushing about nukes back in the 50's. "Duck and Cover." For some reason they left out the part about kissing your a** goodbye.
It's the same thing with dealing with a shooter in a crowd. Get down and crawl away, so you don't see the bullet coming. It'll hurt more if you see it coming. :banghead:

The truth that we know is that it's better to stop the shooter by any means than to cower and wait for death to claim you. It's better to be armed than unarmed.
Some people would rather cower in a hole than face real-life decisions in the moment. I'm sure some pshrink would explain that it's caused by a lack of self worth and confidence.

 

[safetyjoe]

A friend and I were discussing the VT shooting at lunch yesterday and he said that he had read somewhere that the guy (Cho) had practiced shooting at targets lying on the ground. The conversation went on to me saying that he killed 32 people with what 3 handguns(?) but if there had been 3 people who e had a CCW then the initial 2 or 3 that were shot might have been all that were killed/wounded. Campus CCW might or might not work, but if it saves one person isn't it worth trying? I'll get my tongue out of my cheek now.
I made my mind up long ago, that if ever confronted with a situation like that, the BG is going to shoot me in my backside as I am running out, if I am going to die in my own waste, it's going to be after my muscles let go, not after I wet/soil myself waiting for the guy to come after me. Call it macho, call it whatever anyone wants, I'm 50 yo, not in the greatest shape, and am sure no hero, but I believe that I will do whatever I can to save myself and others that are willing to try.

 

[Larryect]

You can't prove anyone wrong if they are unwilling to listen to argument, facts and statistics. When they are basing their argument on "feelings" of course you can't prove them wrong. Much like wrestling with a pig in the mud - you get dirty and frustrated while the pig is having fun.

 

[BlackBearME]

What would Joe Schmoe from this center do if you handed him a loaded 45 and then brought in 5 gang bangers to ravage, rape and beat his wife ?

Would he still believe self defense is a myth ?

Would he use the 45 to stop the attack on his wife ?

I hate to be pedantic, but technically this wouldn't be self defense. I know what you're trying to say, though. The worst part is that good ol' Joe probably wouldn't even touch the gun.

 

[coloradokevin]

Right...

(to paraphrase Col Grossman):

And, fires are a 'myth' too. Yet, our schools have fire extinguishers, sprinklers, alarms, fire escapes, etc.

Remind me again, how many people have been killed by fires in schools in the past couple of years?

But, suggest that we prepare to defend ourselves from violence, and we must be a bunch of fanatics!

I've never had a fire at my house, yet I have fresh batteries in my smoke detector. Is it any more strange for someone to keep a gun for defense, despite having not yet been attacked?

 

[MachIVshooter]

maybe I could make a fast buck selling tshirts and sweats with that philosophy imprinted.

Don't forget the bullseye on the back.

 

[ZeSpectre]

MachIVshooter
So we're talking "hit or myth"?

 

[glocker82]

Yeah army crawl out of the building and then get capped in the buns.

 

[PvtPyle]

Maybe because they dont see article or stories on selfdefense. I mean after all, here are two stories on the VT shooting and they clearly illustrated the points the anti's are making.

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/crime/2008/04/14/intv.goddard.vt.survivor.cnn

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/2008/04/15/vo.wi.grocery.shootout.wisn


I posted this on my blog, and I think it ties right in with what the anti's are saying.



There are a few things that jump out at me that sadden me greatly about the whole thing. The first thing is that these people all laid down and allowed themselves to be killed like pigs at the slaughter. How pathetic. Where were their parents when the children were learning about the sanctity of life? Where were the lessons about God helps those who help themselves?


The other thing is, the victims lives had ZERO value. Not to their parents who loved them dearly. Not to their friends who grieve the loss of these people. THEY decided their lives had no value. Anything worth something is worth fighting for. THEY decided that their lives were not worth fighting to save. ONE madman with killer intent kept dozens of people at bay because NONE of them had the will to survive. How pathetic is your life when you do not have the will to survive at all costs. In cases like these, where a madman has the intent and desire to kill you, you have nothing to loose. Why not take the chance and DO SOMETHING! The heros of Flight 92 knew they were going to die. THEY decided to do something about it so that others would not perish as well. THEY at least tried to save themselves and others. They died doing it, but how many lives did they save? If one person at Virginia Tech had know that their life was worth fighting for, maybe they could have saved others.


We are a nation of servants, sheep and pansies. The hippies say violence isn’t the answer, and they may be right. But sometimes violence is the SOLUTION! Madmen can only be dealt with thru violence of action. They must be stopped with force. Students here, at Columbine and other shooting have all been documented begging for their lives. Did it work?


Maybe if they thought their lives had value and were worth fighting for the outcome would have been different.

 

[Ltlabner]

In the "what if you gave an anti a gun and let the gangbangers go after his wife" scenario, I am confident that they would, in fact, lay the gun down and try to reason with the evil-doers.

They wouldn't want to "enrage" the BG's by threatening them.

They are confident that by the woman yelling "stop" really loud and doing some ti-bo moves the BG's will go away.

They swear the police are right there to swoop in and prevent injustace.

No matter what, it's not fair that these gangbangers didn't have a nice school and a chance at a job, so really it's the man & his wife's fault they are out being rufians in the first place.

These are the sorts of people who are so arogent they actually believe they can "negotiate" with terrorists. That's right. You want to fly an airplane into a building? No prob, lets have a frapachino and try to hash things out. So I have no doubt these arrogent fools think they could talk to the BG's and convicnce them to take their evil deeds elsewhere.

 

[Henry Bowman]

PvtPyle: There are several accounts of VT students and staff who did fight back using the only tools available to them (desks, tables, doors,...). Some of them likely saved their own life or the lives of others by buying enough time for escape. At least one prof died trying. I expect there were some who did not have the necessary mindset and lay down like sheep as well. Others in other classrooms who would have done each of the above.

It's a bit broad brush to suggest that none of them valued their lives or acted in a way consistent with the same.

 

[SuperNaut]

If self-defense is a myth so is self-determination, self-improvement, self-control, and self-ownership. Since you cannot give away what you do not own, that eliminates self-lessness too.

I don't believe in hell, but a world devoid of will, devoid of deliberate action, that would pretty much be hell.

 

[James T Thomas]

Blindness and Deefness in Dogpatch

The acessment by LtlAbner is correct; arrogance.
These elitists have taken on the King of the Hill assumption, and absolutely nothing you can say, logical or not, will be considered, or certainly will not be aknowledged.

After all, they have their crown to loose.

These types have been around for ages.
"Eyes to see, but cannot see, and ears to hear, but cannot hear."

That comes from God's Holy Word; written in the twelfth chapter of Ezekiel.
The cause for such an affliction is stated as because of rebellion towards God himself. A spiritual matter that almost cannot be changed by human efforts.

LtlAbner: Please say hello to Daisy Mae or her cousin Ellie Mae; Donna Douglas. Or Miss Daisy Duke, or...

 

[PvtPyle]

I would be interested in seeing those reports. So far I have seen people locking the doors and such, but not using deadly force to stop this madman. But I am talking about the ones that laid down and died because they had no value on their lives or will to live. I thought that was clear, but I will try better next time to be specific.

 

[jakemccoy]

The speakers' statements are immoral. Students at Virginia Tech did exactly what the other sheep taught them. They huddled under desks in the backs of rooms. Those students experienced a firing squad when all they wanted to do was listen to a lecture. Now, the sheep are teaching a revised version of an army crawl. What's next after that obviously won't work? The speakers here are immorally experimenting with people's lives.

 

[geekWithA.45]

There are guys that will tell you the sky is green, if it suits their ideological purpose.

 

[Wheeler]

Most of the folks that I have talked to that are "anti gun" are actually scared of the responsibility that the ownership and use of a firearm entails. I get comments like "I could never kill, shoot, hurt anyone." or "Guns are scary, dangerous." Or my personal favorite, "What do you need that thing for?"

Simply put, these folks are scared of guns, can't stand the thought of someone else not being scared like they are, so feel that you have to drop down to their denominator so they don't feel inferior.

A lot of the foot soldiers for Brady, MMM, etc. are young, idealistic kids that have been peer pressured into joining, then essentially brainwashed into working the drudgery. They are not true believers per se, just young, idealistic, enthusuastic kids taht have been fed a line that they want to believe in.

Wheeler

 

[Zoogster]

There are guys that will tell you the sky is green, if it suits their ideological purpose.

It is! You just have to open your eyes (and put on the special glasses I tell you)!

Self defense is a myth.
So is people putting out thier own fires with fire extinguishers!
Administering various first aid or CPR to people and saving thier life is yet another myth!

In fact anything that includes a proactive response and does not simply include calling a professional and waiting until they arrive has never been proven to save anyone and is simply a myth that puts more people in more danger.

There is professionals for all of those things, and any tools which encourage such actions by non experts put people in more danger than them doing nothing and always waiting for the professionals.

(sarcasm off)

 

[Travis Lee]

I disagree with Pvtpyle that the victims at VT didn't value their own lives.

I think they had just been indoctrinated all their lives that, "violence never solves anything", and that any problems can be talked out, bargained, or negotiated away. Our culture over the last 60 years has managed to convince itself that evil doesn't really exist, or that it always strikes someone else, somewhere else.

When faced with a murderous lunatic, a lot of his victims simply had no programming available which would help them survive.

Life can get dangerous, and any parent who does not teach his children that fact, from an early age, invites catastrophe.

--Travis--

 

[DougDubya]

See, if they "army crawl" they'll die more easily, thus giving them more corpses to wag in front of TV cameras in order to convince John Q. Public that it's inert objects and useless laws that are the problem and solution, not the capability for a person to stand up and kill someone trying to murder dozens.

 

[HK G3]

The whole notion of self defense is a myth

I guess I must not be living in reality, since the home invaders I scared off with my rifle must have been all a really bad dream if that's true.

People that can actually say things like this with a straight face just piss me off. It takes a special kind of smug, arrogant, to disseminate such blatant lies.