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Selling & sending a high cap. pistol to FFL in banned State?

Discussion in 'Legal' started by JT-AR-MG42, Jun 2, 2020.

  1. JT-AR-MG42

    JT-AR-MG42 Member

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    Just wondering how to post sale ads for handguns with high capacity magazines.
    I see many ads where dealers just say 'no sales to --- or ---' where mag. restrictions are in place
    with no proviso about just selling the gun with no mags.

    I know I can send the handgun itself to a dealer in a banned State, but do not know if the magazines can be included.

    To be clear, I would have no intentions to ship the magazines separately to a "pal' in a non-ban State.

    Hope this question is understandable,

    JT
     
  2. 1942bull
    • Contributing Member

    1942bull Contributing Member

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    I do not think that you can get a definitive and reliable response to the question here became the situation is governed by states’ laws. I know that some of those laws forbid the importation of banned items, and a gun or magazine, or both sold across state lines is imported into the state where it is received. Some states may not have the importation provisions. The only way to know is to examine each state law. Probably the best thing to do is refer to the online sellers policies. If a large seller will not ship the gun or magazine you have to sell, the you are best off not the banned materials to a person in a state that has banned them. Also, you will have to ship to an FFL who might just not make the transfer because there might be state liability in doing so. Try calling an FFL in the state to get the info you want because they ought to know.
     
  3. Jessesky

    Jessesky Member

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    My understanding is a type 07 could receive it. Because they have the ability to ‘manufacture’ the firearm into compliancy, or pin mags.
     
  4. Frank Ettin

    Frank Ettin Moderator Staff Member

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    Cite legal authority (statutes/case law) supporting your “understanding.”
     
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  5. Jessesky

    Jessesky Member

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    I will have to dig around. I am going off of when I had a main residence in a ban state and I ordered non compliant guns out of state via Gunbroker. My type 07 would receive them with ‘standard capacity’ mags, and then rivet or mag block them to 10 rounds. I’ve approached other FFLs in my area to do this and their response was “we cannot, we don’t have a license to manufacture”

    I will have to dig around for the legal documentation this evening
     
  6. bearcreek

    bearcreek Member

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    Just post the add. If someone from a ban state contacts you, figure it out (chances are it won't be worth the hassle, IMO). No way it makes sense to try to list all of the hoops, loops and various bull**** for every ban/extra restrictive state in the add.
     
  7. dogtown tom

    dogtown tom Member

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    <------01FFL
    No 07FFL is required to rivet or block magazines, mostly because they are MAGAZINES AND NOT FIREARMS.
    Further, no FFL license of any type is required to manufacture magazines, much less modify or "block" them.
    I wouldn't bother digging around for documentation because it doesn't exist.
    ***and the other FFL's in your area? Ignorant at best, complete and total buffons at worst.
     
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  8. dogtown tom

    dogtown tom Member

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    How do you know this? I know there are certain firearms (no magazine) that even as a licensed dealer I cannot ship to certain states.
     
  9. Jessesky

    Jessesky Member

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    I wasn’t saying they were required to modify the magazines. I was saying they would. And even though a magazine is not a firearm, a normal civilian cannot receive what the state recognizes as a high capacity magazine which is non-compliant.

    When I was speaking in regards to the 07, I was speaking more to modifying the firearm to be compliant.
     
  10. Frank Ettin

    Frank Ettin Moderator Staff Member

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    The OP's question has nothing to do with any modification to the firearm.
     
  11. JT-AR-MG42

    JT-AR-MG42 Member

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    Thank you all for the replies.

    To be clear (I was not before), I was simply asking about selling conventional semi-automatic pistols - Glock , Beretta, & Sig. Not the so called
    pistol version of some carbine.
    Guess I was just naive enough to hope I could offer a person living in a banned (high cap.) State a chance to bid
    -even though that person could not receive the magazines. Without becoming a lawyer as to that person's State laws that is.

    I reckon you're right. Starting to understand why the herd of sellers just say 'I will not sell to any banned State'.

    It was just that I've read posts on here with members from different banned (magazine capacity) States and was sympathizing with them,
    thats all.

    Thanks again,

    JT
     
  12. dogtown tom

    dogtown tom Member

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    Well, JUST the pistol, no magazine may be prohibited in California. California has a "roster" of handguns permitted for purchase/transfer to their residents. That state requires manufacturers to submit samples of new models for testing and they don't get them back. Some manufacturers choose not to put up with such nonsense.
    For example: No Glock Gen 4, Gen 5 or any USA manufactured Glock.




    This is why its important to know which states the pistol is legal, but its magazine is not.
     
  13. JT-AR-MG42

    JT-AR-MG42 Member

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    I should have stated that California was not on my list from the get go, as my shipping dealer is not set up with them.
    I'll try checking on-line about some of the other States - CO, NY, and Connecticut and such.
    Thanks again,

    JT
     
  14. bearcreek

    bearcreek Member

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    My primary point wasn't that it'd be a hassle (that's why that part was in parentheses ;)). My point was that you don't need to worry about that when posting the add. Chances are very high that your buyer will be in a state where you can simply put the magazine in a box and mail it to them, just like any other piece of plastic or metal. If you happen to be contacted by someone in the minority of states where you can't legally do that, worry about it then. You certainly don't need to be posting any of that in the add itself.
     
  15. danez71

    danez71 Member

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    Glock 4 and 5 cannot meet the roster requirements. It really has nothing to do with them choosing not to.

    They submitted statement support to the lawsuit against the roster essentially saying the requirements are not pragmatically achievable. (It's basically the micro stamping requirement thats the problem)


    OP, the CA FFL will stop your FFL from shipping a off roster gun unless it's a LEO customer.

    In regards to the mags, just have your FFL ask the receiving FFL. You can check places like Brownells websites too if you want to get an idea.
     
  16. bearcreek

    bearcreek Member

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    Why would he have "his" FFL do that? In most states, shipping mags is no different legally than shipping toothbrushes. (Actually, correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure there are no states that restrict the shipment of mags out of the state)

    Edit: Apparently this needs more clarification. I'm not suggesting that the OP try to get away with anything illegal. I'm not aware of any legal reason for an FFL to be involved in the private interstate transfer or sale of magazines, which means that (barring some semi-unrelated circumstance like the buyer being an FFL or the mags being shipped with a firearm) there would be no "your FFL" or "receiving FFL" to ask or answer these questions. Even if there were, as we've seen many times on this site, the fact that they're FFL's is no guarantee that the answer is accurate.
     
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2020
  17. danez71

    danez71 Member

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    To your point, CA actually states you can ship the mags out of state.

    However, his concern is about shipping mags to ban states. CA, for example, has gone after out of state sellers selling into CA.

    My understanding is that sellers FFL often or always calls the out of state buyers FFL.

    That FFL has a vested interest in knowing who can receive the mags in their state.
     
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  18. Frank Ettin

    Frank Ettin Moderator Staff Member

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    But there are States that prohibit the shipment of certain magazine (e. g., those holding more than some specified number of rounds) into the State.

    And this thread is not about getting away with committing a crime. It's about doing things legally.

    Stay focused on that or the thread will be closed.
     
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