Shell failure: permanetly jammed bolt

[cabinetman]

Yep. Stoeger. Benelli owns them lock, stock & barrel, now. Diffilcult to deal with at this point.

I feel really good about my discussion with the ammo manufacturer, however. I was depressed about this for the past three days thinking I had turned my shotgun into a paddle and didn't have any recourse but to toss it out. Now, however, maybe I'll be made whole. I'm not a gold digger and am not asking or expecting anything other than that as I'm sure most of you would be. This wasn't a custom shotgun, after all, but was an excellent shooter and I really liked it.


Rome

 

[cabinetman]

WooHOO!

Hi all.

I just wanted to bring you up to speed with the final disposition of what caused this damage. You'll find it interesting.

I just spoke to the manufacturer. He said that as soon as he saw the photo and then examined the shotgun, he immediately knew what happened and it was the shell that was to blame. He called it a shell that "was slow to peak" . He said it was kind of like a firecracker that just fizzed instead of went "bang". The primer did ignite the charge and the charge did build pressure but it was much too slow and took too long. That allowed the shotgun to unlock prematurely and with a lot of gas still behind the shot. That slammed the bolt back severely and produced the resulting destruction of the shell itself.

He said that this will occur with very old shells that have had the powder contaminated or a failed individual shell. For some reason, the powder just didn't burn correctly, causing this failure.

In consideration of that, since the shell did cause the problem, I'm being compensated and they are sending me one of their top-of-the-line semi-auto shotguns, worth easily twice the cost of my Stoeger.

I'm extremely pleased with the professionalism and promptness of the the maker. I'm sure you can determine who it is from the color of the hull. All I can say is that I'll stick with US made shotguns from here on out. Trying to deal with the foreign makers was a real pain.

So, keep your ammo dry and clean to avoid this type of problem.

Thus ends this saga.

Rome

 

[P95Carry]

Cabinetman .... great to hear the news and get feedback ....... sounds like you have been dealt with most professionally and the result seemingly could not be better.

Most pleased for you ....... this has been an enlightening thread!

 

[HSMITH]

Good to hear Rome. We were close with some our "computer chair analysis".........

 

[sm]

I too am glad to hear this matter was handled promptly and with courtesy.
We all appreciate your sharing and keeping us informed, we all learned something.

Good Luck with the new SG, let us know when you get it. You don't have to have a problem to post you know ...we like to see new stuff too.

 

[cabinetman]

Thanks, SM.

I, too, was relieved that the shell was to blame. Realize this:

Remington could have easily said "Sorry sir, your shotgun was to blame as it opened too soon" or something like that. I'd have taken their word for it and just moved on. Instead, they took the responsibility for the premature unlocking and failed shell and for that, I'm extremely grateful. Did they win a new customer? Well, you bet. Unlike any other rifle or weapon I own (all military) a shotgun is a tool you use a lot if you hunt at all. So, having one that you know you can find parts for or have serviced has become more important to me than ever. Even if I'd decided to repair my old shotgun, I'd never be able to find parts for it.

Other firearm companies could take a good lesson from the way Remington handled this issue. And they did it all in record time, too.

Rome

 

[HSMITH]

They did step up and bless them for it, but the fact remains that they don't make many quality shotshells. Switch to Winchester for duck hunting PLEASE, next time it could be fingers or eyes or God forbid a hunting partner that are casualties. Winchester are sealed against moisture, and they are the only one that is confident enough in their process to advertise it as such.

For targets Federal is making some of the best bargain priced loads, the 100 packs at Walmart are good shells and nearly equal to most brand name high end target shells.

Remington makes STS and Premier target shells, that is ALL!!!! Anything else from them is a compromise at best.

Sorry if it seems like I am in a "huff" or something, but this is a subject that I and others have spent many many hundreds hours and thousands upon thousands of dollars on. There are very good reasons why most of us avoid Green shotshells for field use, and for most uses in general.

 

[sm]

HSMITH,
I agree 150 %

You are not a "huff" you just happen to be right.
Me? I'm an curmudgeon, and I'm right too.
We agree..again Sir...we just get called different names

 

[cabinetman]

A final Resolution!

Hi all.

I thought you all deserved a final update as to the resolution of my problem with a failed shell. All I can say is that Remington came though.

I heard the doorbell ring a few moments ago and found Tom, my UPS guy, smiling and holding a box for me. It was from Remington. When I opened it up, this is what was in there:

It's a Premier 11-87, still warm from the factory. It's beautiful and fits me like a glove.

To make this whole situation even sweeter, I found a box in the mail yesterday. It was from Remington, too, and when I opened it, it had a Mossy Oak cap with Remington embroidered on it and a letter. The letter reiterated all the things we had talked about and then there was a note from the author. He wrote that a check for $50 was being sent to me to cover the cost of new ammo!

So, guys and gals, I'm a happy camper. You can rest assured that I'm a fan of Remington , a good 'ol "Made in USA" company. This whole thing was handled so well that I could not imagine things going more smoothly. From December 7th, when I first posted about this, to today has been just over 4 weeks. That's excellent customer service. And, during that time, I received no fewer than two letters and two phone calls updating me. They even said that if the holidays hadn't interferred because of their shutdown, things would have progressed even quicker!

A lot of other firearms manufactureres could take a lesson from Remington about how to treat their customers.

Thanks to you all for your suggestions and support. I'm whole again....even ahead of the game, actually. I'll be in the field trying her out this weekend!

Rome

 

[kudu]

WOW

 

[Dave McCracken]

Glad to hear it! Good luck with the new one. A suggestion, break it in with lighter loads, it'll glitch a few times but then settle down....

 

[cabinetman]

I plan on doing just that. Sunday morning, I'll be in New Hampshire (Brrrrr...cold!) shooting a trap match. 100 trap shells through it will certainly help me get used to it and break it in a little.

Rome

 

[sm]

cabinetman,
Very pleased to hear things worked out so well for you.

 

[P95Carry]

Thx a lot for the update ..... SUPERB result .. and Kudos by the bucketfull to Rem' ... they really did excel here it seems.

All we need now is a pic .... showing your ear to ear grin.

Most pleased for you.

 

[farscott]

Very nice to see such superior customer service from Remington. That is the way to guarantee a customer for life. Makes the decision between a Nova and an 870 even easier. Also makes the decision between AA and STS easier.

 

[Ironbarr]

Rome...

Sounds like a real winner.

I have four SGs of varying make and age, but have recently been thinking about a "shorter" pump for HomDef... that's how I got to this thread. Your experience and the great replies have taught me another fact of life re firearms. And here I sit with some 10-year-old shot shells I must now feel dubious about.

Anyway, I'd been up to Remington (via Google) before I got here, looking for 870 facts (I'm no shotgun expert, for sure). Just went back there for another look-see but checked the 11-87. They have visual breakdowns in 3D there that might interest you (if you haven't already been there). Check this and other applicable links: http://www.remington.com/firearms/3d/1187

Again, folks, this has been a great thread, and - Rome - good skill with your new duck tool.

-Andy

 

[cabinetman]

I very much appreciate all your comments.

Remington did step up to the plate on this one, guys and gals. They had the chance to walk away but did the right thing. To me, this means more than a lot. It was almost a "test case" where they couldn't be criticized either way. But, the two gentlemen who worked with me, independently btw, came to the same conclusions and the same remedy.

While Remington may not be the sexiest SG on the market, they certainly are the most supportive of the users. I would highly recommend considering looking at what Remington sells AND services!

Rome

 

[Ironbarr]

I wonder what a barrage of Appreciation emails from THR folks would do for future relations. Seems an atta-boy might be useful.

I also wonder - was this a result of corporate policy, or a couple good guys doing the right job.

Wouldn't want to get someone in trouble.

Since you are closer to this, what say, Rome?

-Andy

 

[cabinetman]

Postscript......

Hi Andy.

It couldn't hurt. How many times do these companies get flammed compared to how many times do they get complimented? Certainly there's an inequity which is why I posted all of this here.

To answer your question I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that it's a corporate philosophy AND two good guys here. They acted unilaterally, independent of each other but both came up with similar solutions. That leads me to believe that Remington wants badly to increase their market share in light of so much foreign competition. Also, if it were just too good guys, there would have been a “let me check and see what I can do†approach. Nope. These guys wanted to resolve this and had the power to do so.

Let me also say that’s NOT the response I got from Benelli/Stoeger. I called and spoke to their “customer service†department and was so rudely handled that my jaw almost dropped. No kidding. That guy…..the guy who puts the voice and face of Benelli to the public, was just arrogant. There wasn’t any discussion, questions, or concerns…just “we don’t handle those shotguns†and he was ready to drop the phone. When I pointed out that Benelli had purchased Stoeger, lock stock and barrel, he fluffed it off and basically said…. “so whatâ€. It was mind blowing. Sure, my old shotgun wasn’t a $1500 model but that’s no way to handle ANY customer for any reason. I called Remington next and was prepared for basically the same thing. Wasn’t I pleasantly surprised? And, I did follow-up with a thank you letter to both the fellows who helped me and I send Tommy Millner, the CEO, a copy along with a short note, suggesting he give these guys a pat on their backs.

Let me close this by simply saying that it would be easy to figure that I’m a happy camper because I got a new shotgun. That’s certainly part of the equation but it’s not the only reason I’m happy. I’m truly happy because these two guys renewed my faith in knowing that there are some big companies who do provide good customer service and recognize how to treat us. And, they were honest about everything. So, it becomes a no-brainer for me: good product, good customer service, US made. Sure… I’m a Remington fan now. I’m sure the hell not a Benelli fan and will never put a foreign shotgun into the field again. When something breaks, and it does happen regardless of what brand you smoke, you want to be back in the field as quickly as possible. Shooting a Remington will make that really easy.

Rome