SHTF stuff

[chas_martel]

Well, I know it has been said before.

But, try and change your perception.

For some firearms, 10K is not much ammo at all.

Just think, let's say you have an NFA toy that shoot
900 rounds a min.

That means that 10,000 rounds will last you about 11 mins.
See when you look at it that way 10K rounds ain't all that much.

Or perhaps you wish to become proficient with your pistol. Admirable
if you plan to carry it. Some people believe it takes 3000 repetitions
to gain muscle memory. You can do that much in a month with no sweat.
Now, you should put 200 - 500 per month down range with your
carry weapon to stay proficient.

I think it is easier to comprehend the numbers we are talking about
when you consider just how much you "should" be shooting.

Otherwise, 100 rounds sounds like a lot. Heck, 100 rounds is just
4 medium Uzi mags worth of ammo. See, to my way of thinking
100 rounds is about 2 mins, or less, worth of shooting.

Don't try and "think" about it too much, get out and get "proficient"
and pretty soon 10K rounds will seem about the normal amount to have on hand, even in a nonSHTF scenario.

 

[SteelyDan]

I can't get this cartoon image out of my head. Guy finally gets 10,000 rounds for his SHTF weapon of choice, and the S actually does HTF. Guy shoots one warning round to scare off marauding zombies, and his extractor (or whatever) breaks. Guess what the cartoon bubble says...

Along the same line, and more realistically, the same guy runs out of potable water on day 3, or food on day 6, or dozens of other things along the way, because of his focus on acquiring 10,000 rounds, and he hasn't yet been threatened by anyone.

My point, of course, is that the guns and ammo are only a very small part of what you will want and need if bad things start to happen.

 

[Valkman]

Need 7.62x39?

 

[TCD]

to echo what stevelyn said

There is only one road which connects the Kenai to Anchorage. A few winters ago there was a bad stretch in which we got something like 14 avalanches within a day or two along this road essentially cutting off all road traffic for a week. We had to fly in our food etc.

Some people were trapped inbetween avalanches and were chartering helicopters to fly em out.



Alaska is a great place

 

[PAshooter]

Reference the article on the previous page about Lovell Wheeler:

For those who lost track of the case, after being held without bond for God knows how long (the initial $2 million bond was subsequently revoked) he finally had his day in court... having gotten decent representation. He pleaded guilty to a misdemeanor charge of reckless endangerment and received probation plus time served. Still sucks, but it could have been a lot worse. The man's a bit of a crackpot, and has some pretty unpopular beliefs, but that's no excuse for the way he was treated... the way his rights were trampled. He was back in the news this week - apparently he's suing the government for some millions of dollars for violation of his civil rights. Unfortunately it's 1) tough to fight city hall, and 2) he's representing himself. And you know what they say about being your own lawyer... something about having a fool for a client.

How many of us have what the media would sensationally describe as "an arsenal" like they portrayed this man's collection? Never forget that we're all dangerous crackpots as far as the sheeple are concerned. In some quarters what we believe and what we possess make us enemies of the state. Something to think about...

 

[The Real Hawkeye]

"Well it gets worse actually...

A guy at work, his son is a Maryland State Cop. So his second hand version of the events were like this.

This Mr Wheeler was in fact an old redneck who built black powder rifles and reloaded. He also said some racist things now and then where he lived in black is beautiful Baltimore. A neighbor didn't like him, told all this crap on him and then low and behold Mr Wheeler is off in jail after a raid of his house, shown on TV, (I saw it).

Now the tale is that the cops took his wifes Identification, so she could not get into the jail to visit him. They kept Mr. Wheeler in the jail house for 6 months, without a trial, on the charge of having too much powder... Some do gooder lawyer heard of it and got him out. Now as we understand it Mr. Wheeler is under house arrest in Baltimore, and has NO firearms to protect himself with down in that jungle."

The above quote was cut from another poster at a different site, and are not my words.

 

[Heraclitus]

Question is, not what situation would require a 10K stockpile, but rather if you will be around long enough, after the shooting begins, to actually exhaust it. Going through all 200 boxes of 50-count 9MM/.45/.30-06 could possibly mean:

A) I am fending off one or a few veeeeery tenacious adversaries over a relatively long period of time (What do they want that they can't get sooner and with less trouble from someone who DOESN'T have 10K rounds in a SHTF situation?)

B) I am fending off a large contingent over a relatively short period of time (I know it's hopeless, but I still get goosebumps when I think of Davy Crockett)

or

C) I am fending off different adversaries in brief, intermittent skirmishes over many days, weeks, or months (Shouldn't I have pulled up stakes and hauled a$$ when I still had 1 or 2K and a chance to go where they might last a bit longer?).

Just what you wanted: one more ANAL-ytical take on the subject.

 

[Joe Demko]

Accumulating ammunition is fine. 10k rounds doesn't take up too much space, and if you are talking about one of the cheaper surplus calibers, is going to come in at around only $1-1.5k. Even that expenditure can be spaced out by purchasing just a case or two at a time. My only caveat is to remember that there is much more to surviving TSHTF than having ammunition. Gun enthusiasts tend to get a little too wrapped up in the firearms part of the equation, hence my snarky comment re: TSHTF is all about shooting people.

 

[Heraclitus]

Gun enthusiasts tend to get a little too wrapped up in the firearms part of the equation

Totally agree.

Also gotta learn to eat bugs and siphon water from cacti; train to pull abscessed teeth and amputate gangrenous legs without anesthetics; and condition ourselves and those around us to fight mental stress and emotional breakdown... among other things too many to list.

 

[No Trespassing]

As for a SHTF scenario, you can never have too much ammo, food, water or shelter.

SHTF where I live could be a 8.0 earthquake that destroys freeway overpasses, undergraound water/gas mains, knocks out electricity, etc.

Enough freeways and streets get destroyed then trucks can't bring food into the city and distribute fast enough. Water supplies get cut off for days or weeks, people are gonna panic.

Ammo can be used for seld defense, offense, food gathering and barter.

Plus, I just don't like to run out of ammo. I buy when it's on sale or at shows. I can burn through 1K rounds of .223 and 7.62 in a weekend at Jawbone. I don't want to have to wait until the next show to buy another case.

 

[The Real Hawkeye]

Jeff Cooper is an advocate of the stockpiling of ammo. According to him, you cannot have enough, even of calibers you don't have guns for. His reasoning is that the excess, during an emergency, would become like gold on the open market, so you can trade a brick of .22 lr (or a box of .30-30), for example, for a crate of MREs, or a few jugs of drinkable water.

 

[fjolnirsson]

Am I dreaming?

I thought somebody had posted after Hawkeye. A newbie. I plead sleep deprivation due to the new baby.

Anyway, the more I read, the more woefully understocked I feel. I've only got about 1500 rounds on hand.
I Must buy a reloading press with my tax return.

 

[goon]

Simple...
More is better.

If you had pulled aside a Jewish guy in 1920 and told him that in a few years his government would be doing its best to murder him wholesale he would have probably told you that you were nuts.
I remember reading a book called "Night" about the holocaust. A guy from these peoples' village found out what was going on with the jews and tried to warn his village and no one believed him.

Just because something seems completely ridiculous now doesn't mean that it will seem completely ridiculous ten years from now.
And besides, when I open up a new case of ammo and smell all that brass and copper jacketed lead, I get this warm fuzzy feeling.

Just for the record, I don't have 10K of ammo, yet.
Anyone who wants to help can send me as much ammo as they can spare.
Trust me, I wouldn't complain.

 

[No4Mk1*]

A consumable product with a shelf life of 100 years is being sold for less than it costs to manufacture it- (Surplus ammo). Who here has 10,000 rounds of 7.5mm French or .303 British and is wondering what to do with all those cases of ammo? Anyone???

Our stable society is never more than a 15 minute SS-N-18 flight from complete chaos.

 

[gulogulo1970]

Well to figure out if you have enough TEOTWAWKI ammo ask this, "Do I have enough ammunition to last me the rest of my life?" Something huge happens say next week, asteriod or Yellowstone blows, there will be no new ammunition. Only what you have or reload. There will be no practice anymore, lots of dryfire exercises. You end up shooting to survive, shooting when you need to not just when you want to. Guns become just one of many important tools to keep you and you family alive.

 

[The Real Hawkeye]

Well to figure out if you have enough TEOTWAWKI ammo ask this, "Do I have enough ammunition to last me the rest of my life?" Something huge happens say next week, asteriod or Yellowstone blows, there will be no new ammunition. Only what you have or reload. There will be no practice anymore, lots of dryfire exercises. You end up shooting to survive, shooting when you need to not just when you want to. Guns become just one of many important tools to keep you and you family alive.

Yeah, think of the first Americans to travel west of the Mississippi. I'm sure they didn't go plinking for fun. Every round ball of lead was precious to them. It meant another deer to feed their families. I'm sure they tried their best to recover every one of them after a successful hunt. If the supply is cut, there will be no more range sessions where you shoot up 200 rounds for the fun of it.