Skilled with Various Platforms?

[David E]

Why do people get so upset when someone posts what they would consider to be a reasonable standards of proficiency with a weapon? Why do any of you care if David E thinks you're proficient or not? I run multiple handgun competitions each month in which people are ranked by their proficiency. If you're happy shooting in the lowest classification or that's all you're capable of, more power to you!







Why do you believe that he thinks everyone should meet it? He's proposing a standard that in HIS opinion people should be able to meet or exceed TO CONSIDER themselves "proficient" (an EXTREMELY low standard in my opinion).



If you don't agree with his standard or can't meet it, so what? No big deal, why do you care whether he considers you proficient or not? He doesn't care, I don't care, even nobody on the internet cares. It's merely HIS standard offered as a benchmark of minimum competency. If yours is different, tell us about it. Why do you think he's trying to FORCE you to meet his?







He's not telling you how fast you SHOULD be able to accomplish any particular feats of handgunnery. He's telling you what he would consider a reasonable display of proficiency with a single action. If your opinions differ, feel free to enlighten us with your standards.







I laughed when I read that, I could see the same thing coming based on your attempts at measuring performance on other threads. I believe it's because the vast majority of shooters (who are not competitors) like to "feel" like they are good or competent shooters, but are careful not to measure themselves against anything that could dispel their beliefs!

Exactly!

The whole premise of the thread was asking if folks think it's a good idea to be proficient with various types of handguns.

Some do, some do not. Others prefer instead to take issue with my proposed/suggested/thoughts on time frames. How they derive anything else from that is....interesting.

(By the way, CraigC, one meaning for "submit" is 'to suggest or propose'...which is exactly what I did.)

I don't care if folks accept or can meet my SUGGESTED standards, but I do hope it made them ponder about their own abilities a little.

 

[Zaydok Allen]

I think that most of us can grab any firearm and make it run in short order.

Agreed. I was talking more expertise really. But I think in this community of people, you're absolutely right. THR has a plethora of capable folks.

I like to think that any of us would have a better than average chance against the typical thug.

also agreed

 

[CraigC]

Like I said, I'm not offended by standards in general or these in particular. I just wanted to know how they were derived. It's not baiting. It's not a loaded question.

We probably have an issue here with terminology. I never said I refused to learn another platform. I said I refuse to spend as much time with others as I do SA's. That does not mean that they are the only handguns I'm familiar, capable or even proficient with. The SA is simply the only platform I've tried to master. I think it is the rare gunfight that requires complete mastery of the chosen equipment. Situational awareness and the determination to do whatever is necessary to survive will have a far greater effect on the outcome.

 

[huntsman]

The whole premise of the thread was asking if folks think it's a good idea to be proficient with various types of handguns.

The guns you own, yep. Zen Master of the pistol? whatever.

 

[David E]

The guns you own, yep. Zen Master of the pistol? whatever.

Post #1 mentioned my BIL owning two gun types he doesn't feel compelled to become proficient with, even tho one is kept loaded for defense.

Also mentioned was how many people on YouTube are posting "Heres how you shoot this kind of gun..." Then they prove they don't know how to shoot that kind of gun.

I own the common gun types and want to be proficient with each one. I'm thinking about doing an intentional rotation thru them to build/maintain my skills, but that's just me.

 

[CraigC]

There are a lot of people doing videos on YouTube who really shouldn't be. On every subject imaginable.

Still waiting for an answer to my very basic question.

 

[David E]

Still waiting for an answer to my very basic question.

Why does it matter?

You already said:

I don't have a problem with these standards in particular.

Really? Then what's the problem? Since you don't have a problem with it as you claim, that confirms my SUGGESTED time frames are reasonable. I appreciate your endorsement!

As I've pointed out several times, if YOU have a different idea for the time frame, say that so we can discuss it. Otherwise, it seems like you're indulging your penchant for pursuing inconsequential tangents.

 

[CraigC]

I don't have a problem with them, I just wanted to know here they came from. By what means were they derived? Were they gleaned from competition? Were they suggested by a well known expert? Did they come from a book? Did you come up with them on your own? Did they come from personal experience? Are they personal averages?

I would have no idea what to suggest on actual times. Like we've discussed before, I don't own a timer, I've never shot on the clock, I would have no experience to base it on. No frame of reference in that regard. You do, that's why I'm asking.

Like I also said, it's not a loaded question. For the sake of a productive discussion, how did you come up with those numbers?

 

[David E]

Experience.

 

[Ed Ames]

I think that most of us can grab any firearm and make it run in short order.

I actually don't think that's true.

I recently watched someone who owns at least one revolver struggle - ane fail - to open the cylinder of a brand new stainless steel revolver. 1

I personally once spent 30 seconds figuring out how to work the slide on a semi-auto pistol (though at the time I owned over 10). 2

I have seen several cases where handing a friend a pistol that has worked flawlessly for me for many hundreds of rounds results in a failure within the first magazine.

Think the 30 seconds to work a slide is bad? I, and a gun store employee, together spent about 10 minutes figuring out how to close the cylinder crane on a revolver they were trying to sell, without it jamming. Once I figured out the trick I could do it in a fraction of a second. 3

I have seen posts here on THR that went, "I just got a ______ single shot, how do I open the action?!?!"

I could go on. E.g. the fact that I have no idea how one loads a belt-fed gun, or the way people unfamiliar with Blackhawks get them to jam when reinstalling the cylinder.


1. Taurus with front and back cylinder releases.
2. Tokarev that needed to be on half-cock or cocked to move slide.
3. NAA Sidewinder.