So what happened to the pump rifle?

By the way, California won't let pump version AR15s into the state either, because they have the dreaded pistol grip and other AR features.

Not the case -- the pistol grip as a prohibited 'evil' feature is specific to semiautomatic centerfire longarms (for now).

You can have one on a manually-operated centerfire or semiauto rimfire, with one exception. The one specific non-semiauto weirdness in the CA Penal Code Section 12275-12278 is that any shotgun with "a revolving cylinder" (i.e. Cobray Streetsweeper, etc.) are banned.

https://law.justia.com/codes/california/2005/pen/12275-12278.html

You only need to be familiar with this nonsense when you live here :-(
 
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Autoloaders are harder to make work in shotguns because of such a difference in gas pressure between different types of rounds. A 2 3/4" trap load is a completely different animal from a 3" 00 buckshot yet both are expected to cycle in the same auto-loader, hence, manual actions are a little more common with shotguns since they have more of a reputation for "just working". For me I won't touch a cheap auto-loading shotgun as from my experience they are nothing but trouble. Cheap pumps - they usually work fine.

Also, for hunting uses (where bolt actions still are the most common rifles), fast followup shots aren't as much as a thing as with most of the type of hunting done with shotguns. As such the speed at which you can reload it just doesn't come into play as much. The fact that a pump handles a little faster than a bolt action just isn't a big deal.

Now, I like some of the older pump action rifles (I really want a Remington 760 in .300 Savage), but mostly for nostalgia factor. For a go-to get work done rifle I still would want the extreme accuracy of a bolt action because hit or miss I'm likely only taking one shot at the animal anyways.

Honestly - its a day I hope we never see, but I think if we ever saw a more widespread ban on semi-auto rifles you'll likely see a lot more engineering and development into various types of manual actions like pumps.
It is not the seminauto's they are after, it is all of them.
 
Not the case -- the pistol grip as a prohibited 'evil' feature is specific to semiautomatic centerfire longarms (for now).

You can have one on a manually-operated centerfire or semiauto rimfire, with one exception. The one specific non-semiauto weirdness in the CA Penal Code Section 12275-12278 is that any shotgun with "a revolving cylinder" (i.e. Cobray Streetsweeper, etc.) are banned.

https://law.justia.com/codes/california/2005/pen/12275-12278.html

You only need to be familiar with this nonsense when you live here :-(

Ahh! I stand corrected. I don't try much to keep up with laws in the PRC. They seem to change very rapidly.
 
i do have other rifles to use, but for me in the woods i mostly use a remington pump in 3006, with 165 gr nos bt and 55grs of imr 4350 it will come close to 3 shot groups at a inch and a some times a little better. try this woods hunting test, at a local qurrey we shoot at 14 inch tires with cardboard inserted into the tire and believe me its rolling pretty quick and you have about 50-60 yards(its only insight that long) to hit the cardboard. i win quite a few beers with my rem pump.
 

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i do have other rifles to use, but for me in the woods i mostly use a remington pump in 3006, with 165 gr nos bt and 55grs of imr 4350 it will come close to 3 shot groups at a inch and a some times a little better. try this woods hunting test, at a local qurrey we shoot at 14 inch tires with cardboard inserted into the tire and believe me its rolling pretty quick and you have about 50-60 yards(its only insight that long) to hit the cardboard. i win quite a few beers with my rem pump.

Sounds like a pretty fun game. Reminds me of a story I read in an old Gun Digest. The game was two whiskey bottles tied by the neck on either end of a length of rope. Then the rope was draped over a limb a distance above a river somewhere back east, I forget where exactly. The game was to shoot one bottle and then hit the other bottle before it got to the water. The pecking order for that was the semis, followed closely by the pumps and levers. Bolt guns weren't up to it. Apparently, they all drank a lot for the purpose of target production.......
 
I use a Taurus Thunderbolt (copy of Colt Lightning) in cowboy matches. It works quite well. Taurus got a bad reputation with them, but mine was a good one and I've been using it for about 10 years in the matches. It shoots fairly fast. It is made without a disconnector so it will slam fire if you hold the trigger back as you cycle the action. The downside is, mine is finicky with ammo. I have the best luck with starline brass and you have to use flat tipped bullets. Mine is in 45 Colt and has a tendency to spit gas back at you, so safety glasses are a must.

Because of the reputation, you can usually find them for about 500.00 or less. They are currently out of production.

My best friend has one. It functions quite well. We once had the Sheriffs office called on us while shooting in my backyard. (acreage with well constructed berm in unincorporated area) We were “rapid firing” the rifle such that to an unfamiliar person would sound like automatic rifle fire. The Deputy knew me and we had a good laugh.

To solve the “blow by” you have to SLIGHTLY increase the powder charges above those considered safe in a Colt SAA Original. I was loading the Lee 255gr RFN over 8.3gr of Universal. Max is listed at 7.6. This generates enough gas VOLUME (not pressure) to maintain case obturation till pressure drops from bullet exit. My Winchester M1894 Legacy w/24” bbl does the same thing, as does my S&W Model 625 4”. Pressures are still well within safe levels for the more fragile actions.

Funny thing about the 24” .45Colt is that an armadillo hit makes a louder “WHOPP” than the gun going “bang”...

$500 ? Guess again! Cheapest on gunbroker. .
https://www.gunbroker.com/item/955335366
 
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I picked up a Remington pump in .32R this last year........swapped a buddy a Smith of equal age for the thing totally on a whim. While not a beater it sure had it's problems, missing some small parts and the consequences of over half a century of neglect.......bore: something like a crusty coal mine entrance......externally tho it didn't look too bad with about 90%of the original finish. Turned out it'd been re-bld by Remington early in the 1940's. Whoever the fool was he apparently started using that old corrosive ammo and his regimen of 'don't clean' came into play, hence the crappy bore. Lotta soaking and cleaning at least gave me a bore that will do the job, just takes one hulluva lotta re-cleaning after running cast thru it! Ammo of course is unobtanium thru normal channels and due the unique ctg forming more is nearly out of the question. Any how, after restoring the working characteristics of the action and finding brass at Graf's the bullet issue remained.........321 & .323's in round nose configuration are nearly as unobtainable as the original ammo.......Arsenal sold me a .321 170 mould that fit the bill very well.........(if you ignore the lead buildup in that cratered bore)......and to my surprise it holds teacup sized groups at 100..........using 3031 and reducing the charge in deference to the gun's age.

Dunno why I decided on that gun as a project, it's most certainly been an interesting venture, but in all I wound up with an interesting piece of history that would doubtless still drop a deer as quickly as it would've in 1918! Likely it's academic, but that .32 R is no slouch, easily as good as any .30WCF. The action is without any doubt the slickest and fastest of any manual sort I have ever handled in my 70 odd years of shooting. Too, if one wished it may also be run dry by simply holding the trigger while cycling..........sure would make a snappy woods gun for jump shooting.

Far as speed of handling, fella's there ain't no bolt gun living that could keep up with that Remington. Truly the next best thing to a self loader. My reading indicates that the design was very popular in Pa. and other areas that forbade semi's........I can see why. Kinda amused me when I read one comment from a Pennsylvania hunter that called those pump guns "Amish machine guns"!!


Meant to mention that 8mm .323 RN work well.......can't find those either.....salvaged a bunch from some scrap ammo gifted me!
 
There's a flip side here, too. At the beginning of the 20th century, when most of the designs were all, very roughly, equal, the differences were largely in the cost to produce. Which affected the cost down at the hardware store general store, or outfitter.

Then, as now, the selling price often would outweigh any sort of other concerns.

Versus a nice simple bolt action--or a single-shot--that pump would be some amount more expensive. How much? Probably only a trifle, but enough to have people buy some other firearm instead. Eventually, the lack of market demand would affect factory production.

Once they were not available to buy, the 'habit' of buying them also "went away" too.

And, the practical side, as noted above, matters, too. They can be finicky to run. They are not hugely tolerant of changes in ammo presentation, but need some "slop" just to function. And, the "how much" matters. Too loose, and the buyers go "too cheap for me"; too tight, and the thing binds up, or needs to be racked "just right" (and 'no sale' on that one, either).

Our "gun community" can be fickle in so many ways.

Shoot Annie Oakley used to rock the world with a slide-action .22--and that was not enough for them to "catch on."
 
The pump deer rifle (aka Remington 760/7600) is still fairly popular with older hunters in many Eastern states, and extremely popular with all ages in Pennsylvania.
It’s interesting that it is regional, I supposed tradition has a lot to do with things we don’t think of.

There's a flip side here, too. At the beginning of the 20th century, when most of the designs were all, very roughly, equal, the differences were largely in the cost to produce. Which affected the cost down at the hardware store general store, or outfitter.

Then, as now, the selling price often would outweigh any sort of other concerns.
Yeah, I’ve wondered just how well the design holds up to long term use with a high pressure rifle caliber, as compared to a shotgun. I would tend to think it wouldn’t be a lot different, however if it did need to be beefed up that would impact cost.
 
I've got an old (from the 50's, doesn't have a serial number) Remington 572 that my dad bought used "for my mom" before they were married.

The stock had broken at the wrist and my dad fixed it and the broken buttplate was replaced by a piece of 3/16" copper plate; also by my dad.

It was given to me when I was 12 years old and put "a million" rounds through it growing up.

Old man Louis at the edge of town used to let neighbor folks dump their trash (plenty of bottles, a water heater maybe a washing machine or refrigerator) in a gully on his property.

Once or twice a year he'd set it on fire and to make room for more dumping.

At 12 years old, I would sling my rifle on the handlebars of my bicycle, ride through town to the local hardware store and buy a couple boxes of .22's (yeah, they'd sell em to me) then head to Louis' dump, find a tree stump in a safe spot high up on the edge and shoot the hundreds of rats fleeing the fire!

Can you imagine what would happen if kids would try to do something like that these days!! (And I didn't turn into a serial killer either)

Today, it sits in my rifle rack all used up; the locking recess in the aluminum receiver is hogged out and it won't lock up at all.

That pump was a huge part of my childhood and I'd love to get it fixed but, even if it could be, I don't think it's a run of the mill repair and would certainly be more than the rifle is worth.
 
I learned to shoot with an old Winchester pump 22 rifle. I have several old and some newer pump action rifles in my collection now just because they are fun to shoot. Rats at the dump were always great moving targets in the "good old days." Since the EPA mandated "landfills" and rifles became a bad word rather than something to master I doubt that most folks younger than 50 have had that experience.
 
Here are cpl of my pumps: Both Winchesters and both are .22's. I could afford neither in my youth, nor the Marlin 39 Mountie I really wanted. Later in my 20's to 40's, I found these two in almost new condition.

The model 61 on top is sighted with a vintage Redfield 3/4" .22 scope. The gun's exceptionally accurate for a field grade .22. It'll do 3/8" at 32 yds off my porch rail with Federal Auto Match, CCI Mini-Mags and SV, as well as a cpl other brands. As a squirrel rifle, it has few equals and at ~4-1/2 lbs., it's a joy to carry in the field.

The lower is also a Winchester...a model 62 that I've added a Marbles tang peep and a white 1/16" bead for accuracy. Truth be told, I prefer it to the model 61 above as I like the hammer more than the 61's safety. Both are easy to carry and lots of fun for new or old shooters. And either will readily pick off charcoal briquettes from the fence rail 30 yds from our back porch.

Best regards, Rod

M61-and-M62.jpg
 
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my older rem pump is a 141 made in 1940 in 35 remington and with factory 200 gr remington round nose at 75 yards shoots into a quater. and my winchester 61 also wears a redfield 3/4" tube 4x scope and does dimes at 30 yards.
 

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You guys got my curiosity up now.

Two old friends and I still got to a couple of gun show every year, well, it's more of an excuse to go get a good breakfast and catch up and keep in touch :D

Next time we go I'm gonna make it a point to see what's out there in the way of pump rifles and the prices they're fetching.

Not buying (probably) but I honestly don't remember ever looking at pumps before.
 
To solve the “blow by” you have to SLIGHTLY increase the powder charges above those considered safe in a Colt SAA Original. I was loading the Lee 255gr RFN over 8.3gr of Universal. Max is listed at 7.6. This generates enough gas VOLUME (not pressure) to maintain case obturation till pressure drops from bullet exit. My Winchester M1894 Legacy w/24” bbl does the same thing, as does my S&W Model 625 4”. Pressures are still well within safe levels for the more fragile actions.

$500 ? Guess again! Cheapest on gunbroker. .
https://www.gunbroker.com/item/955335366

Appreciate the tip. I use the Thunder bolt in cowboy matches. Where the targets are close and you are on the clock. The idea is to hit the various steel targets in the right order with the quickest time. Heavy recoiling loads are not needed and can cost time getting back on target. The original LIghtning was never in 45 Colt but in 44-40. That cartridge has a slight bottleneck and seemed to seal the breach better.

I would look for one at a LGS rather than on gunbroker.
 
At 12 years old, I would sling my rifle on the handlebars of my bicycle, ride through town to the local hardware store and buy a couple boxes of .22's (yeah, they'd sell em to me) then head to Louis' dump, find a tree stump in a safe spot high up on the edge and shoot the hundreds of rats fleeing the fire!
My experience as well. Learned to stalk and shoot on the edge of town...dairy country south of Buffalo NY, and I got 50 cents for each woodchuck tail I presented at the farmer's door. Shells were 50 cents a box for LR hp's and I tried hard to make each shot count. Rainy weather always made the chucks less spooky and I did some good work then...soaked to the skin and loving every moment of it. Rod
 
my rem pumps are not going any where soon, fingers never leaving the trigger area, sight picture retained and accurret enough for a 300 yard shot if needed.
If you had to buy a pump action rifle today new or used, for hunting medium to large game what would it be?
 
My experience as well. Learned to stalk and shoot on the edge of town...dairy country south of Buffalo NY, and I got 50 cents for each woodchuck tail I presented at the farmer's door. Shells were 50 cents a box for LR hp's and I tried hard to make each shot count. Rainy weather always made the chucks less spooky and I did some good work then...soaked to the skin and loving every moment of it. Rod

Couple of buddies and I used to go around to local farms and ask if we could take care of any groundhogs for them.

They were always more than happy to "avail themselves of our services".

Mot time they'd point out prime locations and give a little advice on safe shooting "lanes".

We never asked for or were offered a "bounty" though, we were just happy for the opportunity!

Ahh, the good old days.
 
Most of my deer have been taken with a Remington 760 30-06 or my Remington 870 12 ga. Both pumps. 54 grains of Winchester 760 and a Remington 165 gr. Cor-Lokt shoots 1" groups at a hundred yards, if I do my part, which I do most of the time.
 
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