Standard grade AR15s..really a difference?

[telewinz]

I have several AR15's that range from pre-ban to post ban, carbine to H-Bar configuration. All are different makers AND have different market values and were purchased at random over a long period of time. Reading a great many posts here and elsewhere I find that in performance and quality one AR is pretty much the same as another, so much so that in a serious situation I could very easily choose the least expensive/quality AR rather than the "best". This of course seems to conflict with the majority of posts that would relate that brand X is a "super gun", heads and shoulders above the rest and therefore worth hundreds of more dollars!. Are their others out their who have owned several different brands of AR15's who have come to the same conclusion? Competition AR's don't apply, at least I don't think they do.

 

[AR-10]

It is very rare for the old axiom "You get what you pay for" to be proven wrong.

My experience with various brands of ARs is very limited. I was cleaning a Bushmaster upper and a "mongrel" upper last night and noticed a couple of differences.

Bushmaster puts some kind of slick coating inside their uppers that is very durable. My upper has several thousand rounds through it and shows absolutely no wear on the interior of the upper receiver. The bolt carrier shows a little shine here and there, but all the contact edges are sharp and the assembly looks like new. The pivot pin has a smooth shine wearing onto it, but it is also good as new. Same with the bolt.

My "mongrel" upper was built by some vendor. A DPMS upper reciever with parts from various manufacturers. It has less than 500 rounds through it. The upper receiver looks good, except there is wear showing where the ejection port cover detent contacts the receiver. There is a groove showing there already. The interior of the receiver looks good, but it is not as smooth as the Bushmaster, and it tells when you cycle the bolt carrier back and forth.

The bolt carrier, which I was told was provided by DPMS but do not know for certain, looks pathetic. The glide rails are poorly formed and showing much wear already. The pivot pin shows wear and obvious stress gouges that make me think one day it will split in half. I replaced the firing pin already because it was poorly made.

I know this is not a true apples to apples comparison. Just saying not all "parts is parts".

 

[Dave T]

...I could very easily choose the least expensive/quality AR...

"Quality" is the opperative word in your comments. Most any make of "quality" AR is going to function well if you maintain it properly. It's the cobbed together "parts" guns that give the AR the bad reputation it sometimes has.

Much the same thing applies to 1911s. Buy a decent gun, use good magazines and good ammunition and the internet's legendary functioning probelms with the 1911 go away.

 

[curt]

I concur telewinz, with the caviats that there are some manufacturers i would stay away from and before i used any weapon in self defense i'd want a 1000 or so rounds through it trouble free first.

 

[telewinz]

None of the ARs I own our "parts" guns not that they couldn't exceed anything a manufacturer puts out if the builder is determined to do it right. Without exception, all poor fitting ARs troublesome I have handled were mismatched poorly assembled project guns. I have NEVER handled a brand new AR (production version) that had a sloppy fit, I wonder if these do-it-yourself projects are what gives certain brands an unearned poor reputation, who knows for certain the origin of the used AR you bought, some vendors cannot be trusted (duh..). Is there a manufacturer whose guns are proven to have a longer or shorter lifespan than brand 'X'? If so is it in writing? Although all my factory AR15's have just about the same trigger pull and feel, the hundreds of dollars in price seems to be the only tangible difference. How many bad mouth the cast receiver yet don't realize it has little to no effect because of how the bolt locks-up on the AR15 design. Seems to me that product prestige and customer mis-information have more influence than a proven, unbiased consumer test.

Being into purchasing as part of my job, I have found price to be only a VERY, VERY broad judge as to value and quality. A product going for 20% less can easily be the superior product, it just takes proper research and knowing more than the salesman. Happens everyday, its called being a wise consumer rather than just being a "purchaser".

 

[AR-10]

The "mongrel" upper I refer to is (was) a brand new unit I bought at a gunshow. The vendor said it was assembled with parts purchased from DPMS. I cannot verify that the bolt and carrier came from DPMS. Not that it matters, because DPMS does not manufacture those parts themselves.

I am not trying to make a case for Bushmaster, or against DPMS. I am just stating my observations from last evening. The upper I am grousing about certainly is a "parts" unit, which is why I bought it. No manufacturer offers the configuration as I bought it. I could resolve my issues with this particular upper easily by replacing the bolt carrier now before it has truly mated to the upper.

The essence of my posts is that not all parts are equal.

If the makers of six hundred dollar ARs were consistently offering quality product and service at the same level as the makers of eight hundred dollar ARs, why would the more expensive producers ( who in this case are delivering rifles at mid-range price) thrive?

 

[telewinz]

In my experience putting out a quality product does not mean you will survive. Case in point is IAR's Grizzly magnum pistol, unsurpassed in quality yet they had to quit making them due to the high production costs and competition from a well advertised but inferior pistol. You have answered my question/observation with a question, I'll answer you with one of many possible answers, intense advertising, name recognition, and unquestioned "facts" provided by word of mouth. Its advertising 101 and a part of the way of life in America. If I can sell my $600 gun for $800 I will, that doesn't mean that my $600 gun suddenly "obtained" $200 in additional quality. What do you want to bet that if I take a DPMS lower and stamp COLT's markings on it it will all of a sudden become a "fine example of Colt workmanship". With a large enough advertising budget, in 6 months I can make the Oly "plinker" one of the most desirable AR15's out there and I'll have plenty of paid expert advice to back me up and lots of exposure in the gun rags. That $600 gun will suddenly be worth $800 and be hard to get at your vendor. Hell, a lifetime warranty is a TANGIBLE reason for paying more and yes it's in writing.