Striker fire carriers.

[Fine Figure of a Man]

I carry at 8-9 o’clock (left hand) nearly always a striker without a manual safety and always use a high quality holster and belt. I holster my gun without pointing it at any part of my anatomy.
No one thinks they will have a ND/AD. If I do the bullet will not hit my boys or my femoral artery.

 

[Old Dog]

So I'm gonna chime in now. Lots of "experts" talking about manual safeties, lack thereof, or deficient Kydex holsters.

What I can tell you is that over the past ten or twelve years, I've seen at least a dozen or so law enforcement safety bulletins promulgated ... with the topic of what can migrate into one's holster. Now that polymer/kydex, whatever, is the new LE standard, folks need to take a look at their clothing. Specifically those waistband drawstrings (many inside those nylon shell parkas or hoodies) with those little plastic thingamabobs or the zippers with the little plastic thingies to aid grasping ... That's the stuff that's been falling into holsters, getting inside trigger guards, and pulling triggers as pistols are inserted into rigid holsters. Gun goes bang. I have personally witnessed this occurrence.

So yeah, beyond, that ... I think appendix carry is stupid. Not just way slower to draw and get on target ... but especially where the muzzle is pointed.

 

[bassjam]

So yeah, beyond, that ... I think appendix carry is stupid. Not just way slower to draw and get on target ...

Disagree 100%. With appendix carry I don't have to reach my weak hand around to the 4 o'clock position to pull up my shirt or jacket, so drawing is actually faster. The difference is even more noticeable if my shirt is tucked in. Not to mention the advantage of appendix carry when seated.

 

[Mike J]

Okay, so I have a kind of stupid question. Am I the only one that puts the holster on or takes it off with the gun already in it? To me it seems like this does away with the possibility of something getting caught in the trigger guard while holstering. I think the less time the pistol spends out of the holster the less chance there is of me having a accidental or negligent discharge.

Edited to add: Maybe it is more difficult to do this if one carries appendix inside waist band. I usually carry owb at 3:30 although I do occasionally carry IWB at 3:30.

 

[fordtrucks]

Just the possibility of this happening is why I don’t carry my glock 26 appendix anymore. Owb or iwb 3 o’clock. Lcr or lc9s (external safety) appendix ok. Not the Glock.

Doesn’t appendix carry technically break one of the basic rules on guns-never point your gun at something you’re not willing to destroy

Yes it’s safe, until it’s not. Best left to someone more expert than I.

I try to make personal carry systems with safety redundancy built in. Too much at stake for me to have a negligent discharge.

 

[fordtrucks]

Plus, can you imagine a negligent discharge into your gonads or pelvis?

Go to the ER in excruciating pain, wake up with a colostomy, impotent, chronic indwelling catheter, maybe missing parts and pieces, only to end up on youtube like this poor guy.

I really feel sorry for him. Looks like he generally took care of himself and tried to do right.

Unfortunately bad things just sometimes happen.

I do my best to at least take what I believe reasonable care to avoid possible bad things. Sometimes life just intervenes, but I’ll do my best to make a system setup to avoid what I can. If it happens, it happens. At least I did my best not to contribute to it.

In other words, I don’t appendix carry a Glock.

Stay safe.

 

[Spats McGee]

Good morning or afternoon depending on where you're from! Question for all you striker fired carriers out there. . . . . Anyways maybe I read to much about the idiots who shoot themselves in the leg with a striker fired gun. I know more often than not these are ND instead of AD, most likely due to the booger hook.

I know it's all about trigger and trigger guard safety and keeping it clear from any obstruction. I've even tried to purposefully trip the trigger with keys and other things in my pocket, gun unloaded of course. Haven't had an AD trying that so that does help put me at ease. How safe do you feel while carrying your striker? Does it ever cross your mind?

I feel as safe carrying my striker-fired pistols as I did any of the others that I CC'd. Do NDs cross my mind? Every time I handle a loaded pistol. I follow many of the same rules that others have outlined in this thread. Never put anything else in the same pocket with a pistol. Use a holster that fully covers the trigger guard. Minimize your handling of the gun. Watch for things that get into the holster, like shirt tails, or drawstrings.

 

[JTQ]

Am I the only one that puts the holster on or takes it off with the gun already in it?

This is easier to do if you carry a small, lightweight pistol (I don't know that you do or don't), and use a single clip IWB holster or OWB paddle holster. Threading a heavy holstered gun onto your belt is not as easy.

Edited to add: Maybe it is more difficult to do this if one carries appendix inside waist band. I usually carry owb at 3:30 although I do occasionally carry IWB at 3:30.

Doing this AIWB is probably easier, as it's right in front of you with very little twisting required, and most of those holsters are small profile with either a single clip or closely spaced double loop.

 

[JR24]

Just the possibility of this happening is why I don’t carry my glock 26 appendix anymore. Owb or iwb 3 o’clock. Lcr or lc9s (external safety) appendix ok. Not the Glock.

Doesn’t appendix carry technically break one of the basic rules on guns-never point your gun at something you’re not willing to destroy

Yes it’s safe, until it’s not. Best left to someone more expert than I.

I try to make personal carry systems with safety redundancy built in. Too much at stake for me to have a negligent discharge.

Come now, nearly every concealed carry position points at a part of you or the world you dont want to destroy, especially if you consider the various contortions you go through daily.

Heck, I see a ton of guys with forward cant 4 or 5 o'clock holsters that point at the base of the spine. I'd take one less ball over being a paraplegic any day. Heck, pocket carry points at you more and shoulder points at THE WHOLE WORLD all day.

I appendix carried for a bit and, frankly, with the bigger (Glock 19, ultra carry) guns the holster sat on my junk most of the time with the business end mostly just pointing at the ground. Maybe the tip. I just didnt find it as comfortable as a more 2 o'clock location, which works for me.

Okay, so I have a kind of stupid question. Am I the only one that puts the holster on or takes it off with the gun already in it? To me it seems like this does away with the possibility of something getting caught in the trigger guard while holstering. I think the less time the pistol spends out of the holster the less chance there is of me having a accidental or negligent discharge.

Edited to add: Maybe it is more difficult to do this if one carries appendix inside waist band. I usually carry owb at 3:30 although I do occasionally carry IWB at 3:30.

Pretty much what I always do.

 

[mrmike7189]

I heard about an officer in my department who shot himself in the lower leg with a Sig P229 DAK 40 caliber. The Adjuster thingy on his nylon raincoat got caught in the trigger he was re'holstering his gun on his hip. And to think those DAK's have a 12lb. first pull weight, so forget about a light striker fired trigger ...it can happen with any gun! Be careful out there folks!

 

[JTQ]

And to think those DAK's have a 12lb. first pull weight, so forget about a light striker fired trigger ...it can happen with any gun!

The advantage a hammer fired gun has is you can block the hammer with your thumb as you reholster. If something gets caught on the trigger, you'll feel it at the hammer. Striker guns don't have that advantage. The first indication that something is pulling the trigger on a striker fired gun, is usually a loud bang, unless you get one of those SCD's.

 

[sakata8242]

Good morning or afternoon depending on where you're from! Question for all you striker fired carriers out there. I currently carry either a sp101 or Glock 27 appendix style. Probably 8 out of 10 times I pick the sp due to the DA trigger. I like the Glock and the capacity and even how it fits my hand, I know weird right . Anyways maybe I read to much about the idiots who shoot themselves in the leg with a striker fired gun. I know more often than not these are ND instead of AD, most likely due to the booger hook.

I know it's all about trigger and trigger guard safety and keeping it clear from any obstruction. I've even tried to purposefully trip the trigger with keys and other things in my pocket, gun unloaded of course. Haven't had an AD trying that so that does help put me at ease. How safe do you feel while carrying your striker? Does it ever cross your mind?

I used to carry a Glock 19 appendix, but decided several years ago I will no longer carry a striker fired pistol in the appendix position. Strong side OWB, sure, all day long. Many unintentional discharges occur with administrative handling of the pistol - loading, unloading, drawing, reholstering, etc, and having that happen at the appendix position poses a substantially greater risk of severe injury than at other carry positions. The risk is amplified when you start training extensively, particularly with simulated stressful situations, when the pistol is going in and out of the holster for many, many repetitions like in a multi day class.

On a hammer fired traditional DAO, DA/SA pistol, or SA w/ safety, this is less of an issue as you have both visual and tactile (e.g. thumb on hammer when reholstering) confirmation of the status of the hammer (or safety on a SA only) when administratively handling the pistol. For example, if upon reholstering, I see and/or feel the hammer starting to come back on a DAO or DA/SA pistol (or I feel the safety is down on a 1911), that is immediate feedback indicating something isn't right and I need to stop my current action. Aftermarket devices nonwithstanding, you do not get this tactile or visual feedback with any striker fired pistol. There is the argument that forgetting to decock a DA/SA hammer pistol and holstering is an unsafe possibility...which it is...but when you think about it it's not any less safe than holstering a chambered/cocked striker pistol -- especially some of the newer ones that have very short, light triggers -- or accidentally holstering an unsafed 1911.

I also think many gun owners don't really understand how striker fired pistols actually work. If you ask any of these people whether they would carry a Series 80 1911 cocked and unlocked with a round in the chamber, they would look at you like you're crazy. But a chambered, striker fired pistol with a fully cocked or near fully cocked striker, ~5lb trigger, and no safety? Most of them won't have a problem with that.

While vigilance and appropriate training are important, people also make mistakes. If we didn't, we wouldn't have car wrecks, plane crashes, or medical errors. Having an additional layer of hardware safety to backup the software is not necessarily a bad thing - especially when the cost of making a mistake can be extremely high.

 

[Jeb Stuart]

So I'm gonna chime in now. Lots of "experts" talking about manual safeties, lack thereof, or deficient Kydex holsters.

What I can tell you is that over the past ten or twelve years, I've seen at least a dozen or so law enforcement safety bulletins promulgated ... with the topic of what can migrate into one's holster. Now that polymer/kydex, whatever, is the new LE standard, folks need to take a look at their clothing. Specifically those waistband drawstrings (many inside those nylon shell parkas or hoodies) with those little plastic thingamabobs or the zippers with the little plastic thingies to aid grasping ... That's the stuff that's been falling into holsters, getting inside trigger guards, and pulling triggers as pistols are inserted into rigid holsters. Gun goes bang. I have personally witnessed this occurrence.

So yeah, beyond, that ... I think appendix carry is stupid. Not just way slower to draw and get on target ... but especially where the muzzle is pointed.

Like you said, "A lot of Experts". I like Apex carry, and use a double action. Yes, stupid with the wrong gun maybe,. I will not judge. As far as slower? BS, I have timed both and can do very well apex. A lot of drawing will depend you your amount of training you put into it. And for the record, people have shot themselves with holsters on the side of the body as well. You need to speak for yourself. And Most of us are not cops. If I was a cop, I would not carry APEX either. And would not worry about concealment.
I agree with you, awareness of clothing, snag designs, etc. I like a pistol with as many snag free designs as possible and a good double action only or DA/SA. No problem with APEX.

 

[Jeb Stuart]

Interesting range day. Took my new 642 to the indoor range, As I was leaving, a old friend called out to me. He is a former range officer there, now retired from the military as a armorer and works at this LGS. He is big fan of Glocks, has told me so many times. His favorite is the Glock 19.

When he greeted me, I asked him "Where have you been, haven't seen you in quite a while?" He gave me a big smile and said, Well, I shot myself. I thought he was joking, but asked what was he talking about.

Seems he was headed to the range and somehow dropped the Glock when putting it into his car. Somehow it caught on something and went off. He showed me the Xray. The Hollow point traveled down his leg and nicked his hip bone, but made it past the hip and missed his femoral artery by 2".

We talked a few minutes and I mentioned to him that I was done with light striker fired pistols and now shooting double actions. He told, me that he has made that decision as well. Kind of strange hearing that from him.

Regardless, it was nice to see him alive. Seems he recovered pretty good. Still limping.

PS, It was about around 6 months ago, when I asked him if he knew of the guy in the local Paper that shot himself in the leg at this same range. He told me it was some guy, holstering a Glock.

I am not trying to bash Glocks, I have two Rugers that are just as light if not lighter, just stating a few facts of recent shooting that I know of personally from ND or Accidental discharge.

 

[Godsgunman]

Jeb Stuart,
Thanks for sharing. These are my exact fears and worries. No doubt your friend has been around guns the majority of his life and even teaches gun safety as a range officer. Very glad he is OK, very scary. As I've said I unfortunately have seen these scenarios to many times in my line of work. Not all Striker fired but all ADs I've seen have been striker fired. NDs the occasional hammer fired, again mainly striker.
With an initial 8-10 lbs DA pull it's just innately harder to have an unintentional fire, not impossible though.

 

[Jeb Stuart]

Jeb Stuart,
Thanks for sharing. These are my exact fears and worries. No doubt your friend has been around guns the majority of his life and even teaches gun safety as a range officer. Very glad he is OK, very scary. As I've said I unfortunately have seen these scenarios to many times in my line of work. Not all Striker fired but all ADs I've seen have been striker fired. NDs the occasional hammer fired, again mainly striker.
With an initial 8-10 lbs DA pull it's just innately harder to have an unintentional fire, not impossible though.

Yes, he was the last person I thought would have had a AD, ND. And never thought he would be the one to say he was getting away from Glocks and going double action. By the way, he is the same guy that I posted about some months ago when I saw him wearing a "vest" when he was range master due to all the rift raff that had started to come into the range. He had a score board marked at the sign in with chalk and it was at the Number 12. Told me this was the amount of times he had a gun at the range pointed at himself in the recent past month. At the time, I remember joking about the number 13 coming up.
Nest time, I go I will try and get the pic of the Xray hollow point traveling down his let. You could, from the XRAY see the expansion of the bullet, which had indeed done it's job.

 

[tarosean]

View attachment 810306

must be for the younger gen's?

 

[Old Dog]

For those of you who still indulge in appendix carry ... and for those who still stick pistols in waistbands either forward of their front belt loops or use "Mexican carry" ... I wish you only the best, and hope you don't end up on YouTube.

 

[Jeb Stuart]

No comment

 

[Jeb Stuart]

As long as the gun is in a holster that covers the trigger I have no issue with a Glock or similar striker fired pistol with no safety. On the other hand there are some manufacturers that offer striker fired guns with a safety and I like the option of having one. There are times when I want to have a round chambered, and not have the gun in a holster. That said, my go-to pistols are all Glocks. I just think having a safety on them would make them better.

I'm quite fond of my Ruger SR-9 Compact and LC-9S. They are about the same size as the G26 and G43, but both have a 1911 style safety. S&W offers their M&P line of striker fired pistols with, and without a safety as well. The military version of the Sig320 has a safety and I'm hoping to see that option on the civilian version soon. If they do I'll buy one.

I never cared for the "backwards" safety that came on most DA/SA pistols. But the 1911 style safety isn't considered a handicap on a 1911. I don't see where it would be a handicap on a striker fired gun that typically comes with almost exactly the same trigger pull weight.

Agree, I have the SR9C and LC9S with the safety, personally would have never owned one if it did not. And I have trained with Safety's since I was young. However, even with a safety, I just felt too uncomfortable with EDC. Triggers just too light and quick. That very light pull and then that sudden bang without any direct feeling on the gun until it quickly goes bang. They are nice guns, but at this point would like to sell them, but not worth much money on the used market. Maybe with the extra mags and nice Mitch Rosen holster I can get something for them. We shall see. I have a number of gun I need to sell and hopfully put the money toward a Kimber K6.

 

[Godsgunman]

For those of you who still indulge in appendix carry ... and for those who still stick pistols in waistbands either forward of their front belt loops or use "Mexican carry" ... I wish you only the best, and hope you don't end up on YouTube.

For some people appendix carry is more natural and comfortable, like myself. I'm tallish and slender so it naturally hides well in the 1 o clock position. I have seen plenty of accidents from non appendix carriers in the trauma room and YouTube.

 

[Jeb Stuart]

For some people appendix carry is more natural and comfortable, like myself. I'm tallish and slender so it naturally hides well in the 1 o clock position. I have seen plenty of accidents from non appendix carriers in the trauma room and YouTube.

I would bet a dollar to a doughnut that those that carry a good double Action, SA//DA apex style have a far lessor number of accidents if any, than those that carry striker fired in OWB holsters.And as far as striker fired guns, I see nothing wrong with a holster that you have to take out of your pants to re-holster. We are not police and will NOT be reholstering on a frequent basis. Certainly is no trouble to do so.

 

[jeff-10]

I have a Glock 23. Love it. Reliable and accurate for what it is. I would feel 100% safe carrying and have LEO acquaintances who do carry one almost all the time. That being said, I always think of that video of the back flipping FBI Agent and his ND. If he had a P226, P229 or the their old standard issue the 1076, I doubt he would have shot that guy in the ankle.