Stupid question about folding stocks

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Geckgo

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What are the legal implications of putting a folding stock on a rifle, or a pistol grip for that matter? Every time I start shopping for folding stocks for my 10/22 this question pops up into my mind. I know lots of people have folding rifles and pistol grip shotguns, but for some reason it seems to me that some dingo along the line would have classified these as an NFA item. I live in Louisiana if that matters, we pretty much just follow the federal laws here with some exceptions.

Maybe I'm just nervous about the legality cause I grew up in Illinois.
 
If you mean taking a stock off and ONLY having a pistol grip, I believe for shotguns it has to be made from factory in that form, and has to be over 28 inches in length. You can't (To the best of my knowledge) take any old shotgun and just put ONLY a pistol grip on it.

As far as folding stocks, the gun still has to meet the requirements of rifle 16inch+ barrel, 26inch overall length, and it's measured (by federal law, localities may vary) with the stock in an open fully extended configuration. Shotguns I believe are the same deal, but for some reason I want to say that their lengths are 18inch barrel, 28inch overall length.

IANAL, and I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong, or fill in any details I've missed.
 
Federally, there are NO implications about adding a folding stock and/or pistol grip to any shotgun or rifle.

The federal limit for compactness is no less than 26" overall for any shotgun or rifle, measured with the folding (or collapsable) stock fully extended. (The barrel lengths are 16" for rifles, 18" for shotguns.)

Adding a "PGO" (pistol-grip-only) doesn't change anything, legally, unless that makes the entire package fall below 26".
 
If you mean taking a stock off and ONLY having a pistol grip, I believe for shotguns it has to be made from factory in that form,
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There are some legal differences (advantages, generally) to having a shotgun that was sold origianlly as a PGO. Mainly in that it is NOT, federally speaking, a shotgun, but an "other firearm" (it was not designed or redesigned to be fired from the shouler, so it ISN'T a "shotgun"). That means that it is exempt from the 18" barrel rule.

But it isn't exempt from the 26" overall rule. There's a little window of flexibility between those two such that certain PGO shotguns with specific combinations of grips and receiver length could actually be legally assembled with barrels under 18".


and has to be over 28 inches in length.
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26" actually.

You can't (To the best of my knowledge) take any old shotgun and just put ONLY a pistol grip on it.
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Yup, sure can! Just don't go below 26" overall, and check your local laws first.
 
If you mean taking a stock off and ONLY having a pistol grip, I believe for shotguns it has to be made from factory in that form, and has to be over 28 inches in length. You can't (To the best of my knowledge) take any old shotgun and just put ONLY a pistol grip on it.

As far as folding stocks, the gun still has to meet the requirements of rifle 16inch+ barrel, 26inch overall length, and it's measured (by federal law, localities may vary) with the stock in an open fully extended configuration. Shotguns I believe are the same deal, but for some reason I want to say that their lengths are 18inch barrel, 28inch overall length.
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As far as putting a pistol grip onto a shotgun you already own, that's your business. It does not have to be PGO from the factory. (if that WERE the law, I'm sure the end plates of the PGO shotguns would be different from the end plates of the stocked shotguns to prevent the conversion)

The only regs I've found about PGO shotguns is they can't be transferred to anyone under 21 because it is no longer a "shotgun" as defined by the NFA/GCA because it is not designed to be fired from the shoulder.

Rifle minimum barrel length is 16" and min OAL of 26"
Shotgun minimum barrel length is 18" but the min OAL is still 26" I believe

I'm not a lawyer either so this could be wrong, but it is what I've heard to be true.



Back to the OP:
Back in the good old days of the Assault Weapons ban, it was illegal to have too many of those "evil" features on a gun, one of which was a folding stock. But now that we've let that law sunset, folding stocks are perfectly legal as long as you don't turn the rifle into a SBR (keep your barrel and OAL lengths just a hair over the min and you'll be fine.)

There are some places that instituted state wide AWBs after the sunset of the Fed law, but Louisiana is not one of them.
 
The only regs I've found about PGO shotguns is they can't be transferred to anyone under 21 because it is no longer a "shotgun" as defined by the NFA/GCA because it is not designed to be fired from the shoulder.
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Almost. It can be transferred to someone under 21 as a gift or private sale. It can't be sold to someone under 21 by an FFL dealer. Same rules as a handgun.

Also, that only counts IF, and UNLESS, there has never been a shoulder-stock installed.

Once a shoulder stock is bolted on (one time, just for a moment) the gun is now "designed or redesigned" to be fired from the shoulder, and it is legally just a shotgun.
 
okay, I read some googled results and wiki stuff, but I trust this site more when it comes to this kind of stuff. Luckily in LA we have a website with all our our state laws and statutes, but it can be messy to sift through.

Some states have further restrictions that it must be measured closed/collapsed? I read this in some other information.
 
Yes, there are a few states with strange rules that are significantly more restrictive than the 16"/18"/26" federal minimums.

And, of course, there are places where folding stocks are understood to make a gun incredibly lethal to the population at large, and are thus frowned on.
 
The only regs I've found about PGO shotguns is they can't be transferred to anyone under 21 because it is no longer a "shotgun" as defined by the NFA/GCA because it is not designed to be fired from the shoulder.
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Correct. Pistol Grip Only shotgun-like-things are legally defined as simply "firearms".

If you take a shotgun, one with a full length shoulder stock, and you put a pistol grip only on the thing, and the overall length is now less than 26 inches, you have made an NFA firearm, a "weapon made from a shotgun".

2.1.2 Weapon made from a shotgun. A weapon made from a shotgun is a shotgun type weapon that has an overall length of less than 26 inches or a barrel or barrels of less than 18 inches in length.
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(6) The term "short-barreled shot- gun" means a shotgun having one or more barrels less than eighteen inches in length and any weapon made from a shotgun (whether by alteration, modifi- cation, or otherwise) if such weapon as modified has an overall length of less than twenty-six inches.
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http://www.atf.gov/publications/download/p/atf-p-5320-8/atf-p-5320-8-chapter-2.pdf

For Title 1 weapons, shotgun receivers having NEVER had a shoulder stock on them can be made and sold as PGO "things". They are not shotguns because the definition of shotgun requires shoulder fired.

They are simply, from a legal standpoint, "firearms", which is why they can't be sold by dealers to anyone under 21. Other things that fall into the "just firearm" category are things like semi auto Browning 1919's. They are not designed or intended to be fired from the shoulder (unless you have an A6 I think it was, that had a buttstock). So odd as it may sound you cannot buy a semi auto 1919 from a dealer unless you are at least 21 because they are not rifles.

http://www.atf.gov/publications/download/p/atf-p-5300-4.pdf

So yes it is legal to put a pistol grip only on a shotgun you own as long as the overall length is 26" or more, and the barrel is 18" or more.
 
Pistol grip shotgun from the factory (18" or longer barrel, 26" or longer overall, never had a buttstock) is a Title I (68GCA) Other Weapon, which becomes a conventional Title I shotgun when you install a buttstock. A Title II AOW Any Other Weapon may be a shotgun from the factory with a pistol grip and barrel shorter than 18" and/or overall less than 26".

A conventional Title I shotgun stays a conventional shotgun if you install a pistol grip as long as overall length is over 26" under federal law (designed or redesigned to be fired from the shoulder, even if it now has a pistol grip). And you can swap out the buttsock if you like. Once you put a buttstock on a factory PGO shotgun, it becomes redesigned as a shoulder weapon.

At least one state defines "pistol" as a concealable weapon under 28" but the federal limit observed by most states is 26" for "long gun" versus concealable weapon (handgun or Any Other Weapon).

For federal purposes, ATF measures overall length of a folding stock firearm with the stock unfolded in firing position. Thus my M1A1 carbine is legal (even though when folded it is less than 26") although some state laws might regard it as illegally short or treat it as a "pistol".
 
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