Sub sonic .22 ammo

[Marshall]

Help me understand sub sonic ammo in .22 caliber.

I realize that sound travels at about 761 mph or about 1100 fps. I see .22 shorts listed at 670-700ish fps and advertised as sub sonic and quiet, quiet to the point of not really being noticeable by neighbors, etc.

I see shorts, longs and long rifles offered as subsonic. Are the shorts more quiet? Is it all based on fps? How quiet are these? Do they cycle a semi-auto 22 rifle? Basically, tell me about quiet .22 offerings please, help me understand.

Thanks!

 

[Biker]

Well, a lot of the sound made by a hyper-sonic bullet is the progectile breaking the sound barrier. Keep them below 1100 fps, and that problem is eliminated. 22 shorts are very quiet, but don't do a lot of damage on anything larger than a cat, and will also not cycle some semis. I have some sub-sonic 60 gr LRs made by Aguila that are very quiet but effective on close/medium range small game in a bolt action .22.
Hope this helps.
Biker

 

[Vern Humphrey]

Help me understand sub sonic ammo in .22 caliber.

I realize that sound travels at about 761 mph or about 1100 fps. I see .22 shorts listed at 670-700ish fps and advertised as sub sonic and quiet, quiet to the point of not really being noticeable by neighbors, etc.

I see shorts, longs and long rifles offered as subsonic. Are the shorts more quiet? Is it all based on fps? How quiet are these? Do they cycle a semi-auto 22 rifle? Basically, tell me about quiet .22 offerings please, help me understand.

Thanks!

There are really three kind of subsonics.

The first kind are also known as Standard Velocity ammunition and are primarily designed for target shooting. High Velocity .22 Long Rifle cartridges are supersonic, but barely so. At longer ranges (100 yards, which is common in small bore matches) they become subsonic on the way downrange. This "passing through the sound barrier backward" has a negative affect on accuracy.

Next come BB Caps and CB Caps. These are the old, orginal rimfire cartridges developed well before the Civil War. They were used for "pistol parlor" practice, and originally had no powder at all -- just the priming. They take their name from "Bulleted Breech Cap" -- meaning a modified percussion cap with a small shot for a projectile -- and Conical Bullet Cap. Nowadays you can get them in various configurations, including Long Rifle versions.

Finally there's the Anguila heavy bullet subsonics. These were developed when people got on the "subsonic means cool" kick a few years ago. The idea is to make up for reduced velocity with increased bullet mass. If your rifle or pistol will shoot them well, they are a pretty good round -- but because of their length, they need to be spun a bit faster than the standard 40-grain bullet and not all guns will shoot them well.

To answer your questions, Standard Velocity ammunition will generally cycle an automatic pistol or rifle -- if not, you can often get it to work by going to a lighter recoil spring. It's often more accurate than high velocity ammo, and usually more expensive

You can get CB Caps in various configurations, so the size of the case is pretty much meaningless -- a CB long rifle is about the same as a CB short. CB caps will not cycle automatics.

Anguilas are probably your best option if you are shooting pests and want a quiet round -- more effective than CB caps -- if your gun will shoot them accurately. On the other hand, if you want to shoot in your basement or garage without disturbing the neighbors, go with CB caps.

 

[Mizzle187]

For what its worth I have shot Remington .22 SubSonic mixed with Remington .22 Thunderbolts in the same clip and could not hear a difference.

 

[Husker1911]

The reason target .22 ammo is kept subsonic is that a supersonic bullet, as it's flying through the air, is buffeted as it breaks the sound barrier, and then again when it decelerates to the point that it again is buffeted as it goes subsonic. By keeping target ammo subsonic, it produces a more stable bullet path, with less yawing or disturbance.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

For what its worth I have shot Remington .22 SubSonic mixed with Remington .22 Thunderbolts in the same clip and could not hear a difference.

That's because you were behind the gun -- if you were off to one side several yards, you could tell. And if you were downrange (but off the bullet path of course) you could definitely tell.

 

[taliv]

quiet is a relative.

i shoot subsonic ammo out of lots of guns and it's still uncomfortable enough that i need hearing protection.

 

[444]

Just a side note that is sort of related to this question:
It is written on this board frequently (by people who don't actually know), that using a suppressor on a weapon that fires supersonic ammo is a waste of time because there is still a sonic boom from the bullet.
So now we are discussing firing a .22 LR cartridge at subsonic velocity. One guy says he can't hear the difference. Another guy says he still feels the need to wear hearing protection. Yet, the sound they are hearing is the sound that would be greatly diminished by a suppressor and not the sonic boom.

 

[Marshall]

Thanks all! I do appreciate it.

444, I would think, though I have never used one, that a suppressor/silencer would greatly reduce the sound of a supersonic bullet, why else would they be used? Are they not used on 223's, 308's, 30-06's and 300 Win mags by snipers? Guess I am agreeing with you but, I don't actually know first hand.

Has anyone shot any .22 ammo that is indeed quiet to the point of shooting varmints around your house without having next door neighbors becoming upset? I know sound is relative but I think you all know what I'm trying to determine. Is there anything in .22 that I can shoot in my backyard without alarming folks? Vern says CB caps will work. Anything else?

 

[Biker]

Yes Marshall, the 22 Shorts and the 60gr Aguilas are, I've heard , adequately quiet, assuming you don't live in an apt. complex.
Biker

 

[MikeK]

I live in the burbs - houses on about 1/2 acre lots. The only thing I've found that's quiet in .22 are the Aguila colibri's. No powder, just primer. Shot out of a bolt action rifle (won't cycle a semi) they are like a pfft. They are ~ 400 fps with a 29 (?) grain bullet. They will kill a chipmunk with one shot. I have no idea about anything larger. I tried subsonic .22 and as someone else said it sounded as loud as regular ammo.

 

[taliv]

hey, i'm not just another guy. i am teh taliv!

houses in my neighborhood (inside city limits) are brick and well-insulated about about 100' apart. i doubt anyone inside would hear a cb cap and be able to identify it as a rifle-shot, if i just popped a squirrel or something.

if i was shooting hundreds of them, i'd probably annoy the neighbors.


444, it depends on what you mean by 'waste of time'. that is, it depends on what your expectations are. if your expectation is to fire a .308 silently in town without anyone hearing, then spending $700 for a can, and $200 on a stamp is indeed a waste of time, because it's still going to make a good bit of noise.

otoh, if your expectation is high-volume target practice on your 5 ac. rural plot without annoying the neighbors a few hundred feet in either direction, then it's definitely not a waste of time, since as you say, it does reduce the noise substantially, and probably below the threashold required for good neighbor relations.

 

[Marshall]

Yes Marshall, the 22 Shorts and the 60gr Aguilas are, I've heard , adequately quiet, assuming you don't live in an apt. complex.
Biker

Well, unfortunately I am in an apartment now. However, the reason I am asking is because my folks have some pest around the house that need cleaning out. I have a Benjamin Blue Streak that shoots 5mm pellets that can do a pretty darn good job on squirrels and the like. I was curious as to what .22 options were available for me to use though.

Thanks Gents!

 

[Vern Humphrey]

Thanks all! I do appreciate it.

444, I would think, though I have never used one, that a suppressor/silencer would greatly reduce the sound of a supersonic bullet, why else would they be used?

If you've been under fire, you hear crack! crack! crack! all around you -- it seems like the enemy is everywhere. What you're hearing is the shock wave of the supersonic bullet. The sound seems to come from the closest point of approach of the bullet -- so you hear it from your right, your left, above you and so on.

We train troops to be alerted by the crack! and listen for the thump! - which is the sound of the gas escaping from the muzzle. That will tell you where the shooter is.

When we tested suppressed M16s, the suppressors did not suppress the crack! But they did suppress the thump! depriving the enemy of a vital clue in locating us. That was the theory, and in practice it did seem to confuse them. But the volume of fire in a fire-fight quickly degrades the suppressors, so it only worked for the first few minutes.

 

[Lou629]

I used to fire what were called "mini-caps" back in the mid-seventies...made by cci if memory serves. Fired them from a bolt action rifle into several "big city" yellow pages taped back-to-back inside my apartment, and no one, including myself, ever heard a thing, other than a slight "phhht" type sound. Don't know if these are still available of not, or if this is the same ammo you're referring to, but back in the day these worked well for indoor practice without noise. BTW, these rounds made it all the way through the first phone book and half way through the second, which surprised the hell out of me at the time, so, do be careful while you're having fun!

 

[Vern Humphrey]

I used to fire what were called "mini-caps" back in the mid-seventies...made by cci if memory serves. Fired them from a bolt action rifle into several "big city" yellow pages taped back-to-back inside my apartment, and no one, including myself, ever heard a thing, other than a slight "phhht" type sound. Don't know if these are still available of not, or if this is the same ammo you're referring to, but back in the day these worked well for indoor practice without noise. BTW, these rounds made it all the way through the first phone book and half way through the second, which surprised the hell out of me at the time, so, do be careful while you're having fun!

CCI still makes CB caps -- apparently they sell a lot of them. Just google on "CB cap."

 

[444]

Vern, supperessors have improved greatly over the years. There are suppressors out now that can be fired almost indefinitely on a belt fed machine gun.

And FWIW, a .22 suppressed .22 is quieter than your Benjamn pellet gun. That whole supersonic bullet thing is pretty much just internet BS but, shooting CB caps out of a .22 rifle is probably quieter than a suppressed .22 pistol. I have a Remington 541X with a fairly long barrel and it will fire a .22 LR about as loud as a suppressed .22 pistol. A suppressed .22 rifle is actually quieter than running the action on the empty gun.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

Vern, supperessors have improved greatly over the years. There are suppressors out now that can be fired almost indefinitely on a belt fed machine gun.

That's the problem with getting old. The world passes us by.

And FWIW, a .22 suppressed .22 is quieter than your Benjamn pellet gun. That whole supersonic bullet thing is pretty much just internet BS but, shooting CB caps out of a .22 rifle is probably quieter than a suppressed .22 pistol. I have a Remington 541X with a fairly long barrel and it will fire a .22 LR about as loud as a suppressed .22 pistol. A suppressed .22 rifle is actually quieter than running the action on the empty gun.

Our suppressed .22s were pretty quiet. I know someone who was trying to take a prisoner on the Ho Chi Minh trail. He picked on tail-end Charlie in a column, and shot him in the back with a silenced Colt Woodsman. Charlie slapped his back, like he thought bugs were biting him and kept on walking.

So my friend tried again. Same thing. Tried again. Same thing.

When he finally had to reload, he dropped the magazine, Charlie heard that, turned around, figured out what was going on and dropped dead.

 

[Marshall]

Thanks again. I'll experiment.

 

[ANGUSLINCOLN]

Aguila makes 2 types of "quiet" ammunition, "Colibri" and "Super Colibri". 350'/sec and 550 ft'/sec. respectively. They recommend that you only use them in a pistol as their low velocities may not be enough energy to push the bullet through a longer rifle barrel, especially if when there is the potential for an occasional squib. I shoot them out of a New England Firearms Sportster single shot as well as a Marlin 981 boltie and have never had a problem. I shoot them most often from my Ruger New Model Single Six. They work fairly well on red squirrels but if you don't manage a head shot you might have to use 2 shots unless your dog is like mine and catches them before they hit the ground

 

[Optical Serenity]

Aguila ammo stinks though, literally. It smells terrible...Just like Colibri and Super colibri. Am I the only one that has had bad smelling ammo from them?

 

[fourays2]

Aguila makes 2 types of "quiet" ammunition, "Colibri" and "Super Colibri". 350'/sec and 550 ft'/sec. respectively. They recommend that you only use them in a pistol as their low velocities may not be enough energy to push the bullet through a longer rifle barrel, especially if when there is the potential for an occasional squib. I shoot them out of a New England Firearms Sportster single shot as well as a Marlin 981 boltie and have never had a problem. I shoot them most often from my Ruger New Model Single Six. They work fairly well on red squirrels but if you don't manage a head shot you might have to use 2 shots unless your dog is like mine and catches them before they hit the ground

I'm getting about 10% FTF with Colibri ammo, usually you can get them to fire on a second strike if you rotate the cartridge in the chamber. I'm using a stevens model 15 22" bbl length and the accuracy is good at 20ft.

 

[deadin]

Folks, I think that what is being discussed here is not "I don't want to disturb the neighbors" it's really "I don't want the neighbors to call the cops".
It doesn't matter how quiet it is, it's still illegal to discharge a firearm in most suburban areas. And it's not the "noise factor" that causes these laws to exist. If it is not illegal in your area, your neighbors have nothing to stand on if they don't like it. I've yet to see a jurisdiction that has a "noise ordinance" and not having a "discharging a firearm ordinance".
I guess this all falls under the prevailing attitude of "It's allright to do (i.e. speed, run red lights, steal from employer, etc.) as long as you don't get caught." Wonderful thing to teach our kids.

Dean

 

[TallPine]

otoh, if your expectation is high-volume target practice on your 5 ac. rural plot without annoying the neighbors a few hundred feet in either direction, then it's definitely not a waste of time, since as you say, it does reduce the noise substantially, and probably below the threashold required for good neighbor relations.

Or for less than $900 you could build one of those free standing suppressors out of old tires that you just shoot through

Out here where I am right now it doesn't matter though - can shoot anything I want.

 

[Mizzle187]

Vern, supperessors have improved greatly over the years. There are suppressors out now that can be fired almost indefinitely on a belt fed machine gun.

And FWIW, a .22 suppressed .22 is quieter than your Benjamn pellet gun. That whole supersonic bullet thing is pretty much just internet BS but, shooting CB caps out of a .22 rifle is probably quieter than a suppressed .22 pistol. I have a Remington 541X with a fairly long barrel and it will fire a .22 LR about as loud as a suppressed .22 pistol. A suppressed .22 rifle is actually quieter than running the action on the empty gun.

Thank you!