The Movie 'Shooter'...Offhand in Rowboat Stunt

[telecaster1981]

Hello all,

After reading the following post on THR a while back, I was inspired to test myself and see what I could do to confirm or debunk the 'Sniper poppin' noggins from a rowboat @ 200 yards with a .22lr' myth. So, check out the original thread first:

http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=362943


The test:

Try to shoot a head-sized target at 200 yards with a .22lr from the offhand position while on a moving platform (simulated rowboat).


The Equipment:



Ruger 10/22-Green Mountain .920" barrel, heavy laminate target stock, Tasco 8-32x scope.

Beatup old gooseneck trailer (rowboat)

Remington Bulk Pack 'Golden Bullet' .22lr--sorry, no picture...you all already know what this looks like!

The Process:


I started off by zeroing my 10/22 at 150 yards off of a bench, and added a few clicks to put me on at 200. Five shot groups were 1.5-2 inches excluding some fliers. Next, I loaded 10 rounds and climbed to the upper platform on the gooseneck trailer. Using a hasty sling, offhand position, I fired 5 rounds in fairly rapid succession (maybe 4 seconds between shots on average), rested and fired 5 more rounds in a similar fashion. One thing to consider is that it was rather windy today (~15mph with gusts exceeding that) and the trailer was rocking like you'd expect a rowboat would. I picked that platform and a windy day on purpose since I didn't feel like putting my rowboat in a kiddie-pool on my range.


The Results:

Groups were in the 6" range, but not in the center of the target. So, either my dope was off (low and left...I was fighting the wind from 10 o'clock) or I shanked 4 shots off the cardboard. Either way, I wasn't displeased...I feel like could have done better, but this is how I shot today!

After I shot for a group size, I wanted to see what kind of effect one could expect from a .22lr at 200yds so I set up a piece of OSB particle board and ripped off a magazine. All ten shots made it through the OSB, the cardboard box behind it, and about 2-3 inches into the berm.

So, in conclusion, I think it is feasible that an expert marksman could indeed pull off the shot in question and possibly even kill at that distance with the .22lr. The 'shooter' in the movie was supposed to be the best in the world. I'm not even the best shot at my address, so if my sorry butt can make hits with this scenario, I'm saying it's not impossible for sure!

I may try again soon with better ammunition. My 10/22 really likes Remington Sub-Sonic HP...and is really marginal with the Remington Bulk Pack. Unfortunately, I was out of the Sub-Sonic, so use what you got, eh?

 

[mio]

im sure i could do it although i would probably use cci stingers out of my marlin mod 60. however i dont know how many shots it would take me.

 

[PTK]

Amazing that so many people dismissed that scene as fiction when they've never tried shooting for distance with a .22lr.

 

[telecaster1981]

Amazing that so many people dismissed that scene as fiction when they've never tried shooting for distance with a .22lr.

Agreed. Victims to small thinking!

 

[General Geoff]

if I had a 200 yard range nearby, I'd definitely try to replicate this with my Marlin bolt gun.

 

[telecaster1981]

Geoff,

I was thinking about using my marlin 81 for this test as I'm much better shooting offhand with it than I am with the 10/22. Problem is, it has iron sights and I wanted it to be as close to the movie scenario as possible.

 

[Jasonbu]

Shooter

The real "Hollywood" scene was the intro. Shooting head shots on 30mph movers at around nine hundred yards using mils as hold overs. I don't think anyone could do the math in their head to pull that one off (the drop on an excelerating target running away from you at 30mph, every second would be several inches of drop, ever increasing at a variable rate depending on the distance). And that's just the drop, now calculate wind drift (the real hard part) on the same moving target. I enjoyed the movie anyways, but it was definately a product of Hollywood.

JB

 

[MachIVshooter]

Amazing that so many people dismissed that scene as fiction when they've never tried shooting for distance with a .22lr.

I never dismissed him making the shots. It's the lethality of a .22 LR at that range that I hold in question, having watched praire dogs run off after hits at similar ranges. The .22 LR just doesn't have much pizazz left that far out, and the human skull is pretty tough.

When we were kids, we built zipguns in our garages. One day, tradgedy struck, as my friend dropped his while loading it. He'd had it pointing vertically, and when it fell, the firing pin handle impacted the plywood table and it discharged. The bullet struck him about 1" below his left eye and traveled through his brain, lodging at the rear of his skull to the right of center. He stood up, took a few steps back and fell down. I called 911 then went back out to tend him. He was in a great deal of pain, but very much conscious. I talked to him, trying to calm him down during the ~20 minutes waiting for EMS. The doctors induced a coma to minimize brain swelling and he spent about 2 weeks in ICU and another 3 months recovering, but today is a fully functional human being with just a lapse in short term memory at times.

The human brain is fragile, but it's not a balloon. A small perforation does not necessarily render it non functional, and a .22 LR simply cannot be counted on to do enough damage.

 

[M60]

In the movie the ammo must have been sub-sonic, because it was very quiet. You should try it again with low/standard velocity ammo. Just to see the differance, if any.

-Mark.

 

[Monkeyleg]

I was talking to a custom long-range rifle builder the other day. His name is Vaughn Beals, and he operates White Tail Gun Shop in Jersey Shore, PA. He specializes in building 1000 yard rifles.

Just for the heck of it, I asked him if he'd seen the movie "Shooter." He had, and he'd read the book as well. He said that the author had obviously done a lot of research because everything in the book/movie was accurate when it came to guns, extreme long distance shooting, etc.

Vaughn knows his stuff, so I believe him.

 

[Atla]

Stephen Hunter knows a fair amount about guns and shooting.

And he was shooting a .22 rifle with a pop-bottle on it as a silencer.

 

[telecaster1981]

I never dismissed him making the shots. It's the lethality of a .22 LR at that range that I hold in question, having watched praire dogs run off after hits at similar ranges. The .22 LR just doesn't have much pizazz left that far out, and the human skull is pretty tough.

When we were kids, we built zipguns in our garages. One day, tradgedy struck, as my friend dropped his while loading it. He'd had it pointing vertically, and when it fell, the firing pin handle impacted the plywood table and it discharged. The bullet struck him about 1" below his left eye and traveled through his brain, lodging at the rear of his skull to the right of center. He stood up, took a few steps back and fell down. I called 911 then went back out to tend him. He was in a great deal of pain, but very much conscious. I talked to him, trying to calm him down during the ~20 minutes waiting for EMS. The doctors induced a coma to minimize brain swelling and he spent about 2 weeks in ICU and another 3 months recovering, but today is a fully functional human being with just a lapse in short term memory at times.

The human brain is fragile, but it's not a balloon. A small perforation does not necessarily render it non functional, and a .22 LR simply cannot be counted on to do enough damage.

Heard a similar story about someone shot in the head with a .38 special. I'd say living through a head shot (from any caliber) in which a bullet enters the brain is a fluke. Your friend is lucky!
__________________

 

[Jasonbu]

shooter

One other thing that bugs me about the opening scene. I believe his optic to be a Unertl fixed 10 power tactical scope. The mils are not even close to accurate in relation to the distance in question. I'm not a mil-rad guy, I use MOA, but I believe 1 mil equals about 3.5 MOA, the mil-dots are way too tiny in relation to the target. Also, at 10 power, those guys would be tiny at 900 yards. The Mils would cover the head completely, and half of the guy to boot.

As a whole, the movie is 10 times more accurate than most "Hollywood" films, I shouldn't complain. But Danny freakin Glover is in the film, enough said....

JB

 

[qajaq59]

I watched King Sullivan's Mines last night and the guy fired 9 rounds out of a 30-06 lever action. Now that's credible, right?

Ahhh, good old Hollywood. :banghead:

 

[Joe Cool]

I agree with telecaster!

Just to show my daughter, we took out my Dad's old Winchester 67 (22), with iron sights, single shot bolt action and standing up, no practice allowed she did 4 inch groups at 25 yards. My question to her was if that's what a newcomer can do with no practice, what do you think and expert can do? She agreed with me that the rowboat scene is possible! We then moved over to the long range and I did a few smaller groups with a scoped 30-06 at 100 yards, and I am just an amateur. We both like watching 'Mythbusters' and she agreed the whole was plausible.

PS - telecaster, if that's your axe kudos to you, I have an old strat I still play once in a while.

 

[telecaster1981]

Joe,

The Telecaster is indeed my axe! It's not a 1981 model though...I was the one made in 1981! Got a few guitars, but my Tele that I built from Warmoth parts is still my 'go-to.'

 

[ilcylic]

Now get someone to drive the trailer past the target at 5 mph or so and see what you can do.

 

[06]

Several years ago my "red headed stepson" came back for a visit from Charleston, SC. He was telling me about shooting deer with his 22. Well, got my laughs handed back to me. Now my 22s are sighted in at 100yds and I can shoot 4" groups from the offhand. He was knocking Pine cones off @ 80 yds out and asked if I wanted to shoot it(an ugly-real ugly-old beat up Glenfield with camo tape). I held over about two inchs and hit the limb. Next time I was knocking them off also. I have shot squirrels in the head from youth but never believed how accurate they are out a ways. wc