The realities of the street

[SouthernBoy]

Saw this link on another gun website and thought it was very worthwhile to post here. While there seems to be a couple of things the writer messed up, his advice is cogent, solid, and what I have long believed to be real.

Enjoy and please offer your comments, especially for those of you who have been in law enforcement and have served time on the streets.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_1_5/1285487_.html

 

[V-fib]

good read thanks.

v-fib

 

[km101]

BurnedOutLEO just distilled about a weeks worth of Self Defense training courses down to a page! His experiences are much more violent than mine, but I saw enough in my 8 years as a LEO to know that what he says is very valid and true.

Read and Heed! He is telling it like it is!

 

[On An Island]

I've bookmarked that post and have sent links to it to my friends. Thanks for sharing.

 

[CopperFouling]

Interesting perspective that was quite informative. Thanks for sharing.

 

[gspn]

Good read, thanks for sharing.

 

[Kayaker 1960]

Great read

Great read, I'll make sure my wife, daughter and son read it also.

 

[Lantern]

Outstanding post in that thread. Thank you for bring it to my attention. I will be sending it to several friends.

 

[Bopleo]

Very good read.

 

[MedWheeler]

Awesome read. I'm pretty sure it was posted here a few years back, and definitely worth this re-post (should almost be a sticky.)

 

[CCS3]

I plan on incorporating this post into my next training class. Thanks for the link.

 

[gym]

These are things I have mentioned here many times, learn to shoot with one hand, either hand, and if you get your gun back, "if you survive" , don't be surprised if it is totally scratched to crap with case numbers all over it, if it even comes back. Also why I have gotten in so many discussions about what to carry. You need as many rounds as you can get in your gun, "good reason not to carry anything less than a 9mm, and a 8 to 10 round capacity. More is better all the time. If you want a 380 get a 15 round berretta. 6 rounds of 380 is just not enough even if you are a good shot, under pressure and moving you will miss as much as you hit. The guy has obviously been there. In that story the young man was very lucky to still be alive and not have either himself or his girlfriend wounded or dead.

 

[SouthernBoy]

Posted by gym
These are things I have mentioned here many times, learn to shoot with one hand, either hand, and if you get your gun back, "if you survive" , don't be surprised if it is totally scratched to crap with case numbers all over it, if it even comes back. Also why I have gotten in so many discussions about what to carry. You need as many rounds as you can get in your gun, "good reason not to carry anything less than a 9mm, and a 8 to 10 round capacity. More is better all the time. If you want a 380 get a 15 round berretta. 6 rounds of 380 is just not enough even if you are a good shot, under pressure and moving you will miss as much as you hit. The guy has obviously been there. In that story the young man was very lucky to still be alive and not have either himself or his girlfriend wounded or dead.

I hit the range every two weeks with a neighbor friend and we go through a series of drills that we change on a frequent basis. We never use convention targets but rather several different sizes of paper plates, index cards, and copy paper on which we draw and number shapes. We have the targets at differing distances (basically attack distances) and have them flip from edge to face and back at varying timed intervals. We do draw and fire exercises with tactical and full reloads, strong hand/weak hand drills, multiple taps and multiple targets, and a number of other taxing drills. It not only makes it very interesting (much better that just punching paper), but is also very good at improving our skills. I am a much better shooter for this and we have been at it for over two years. We do miss some trips due to other things going on in our lives, but we have been pretty darned good at making those two week jaunts.

 

[Spats McGee]

An outstanding piece. Thanks for bringing it to light.

 

[Odd Job]

That post was good!

 

[freyasman]

Yeah, I love passing that one to people, especially some anti-gun folks I debate with on the political boards.

 

[230RN]

I keep promising myself to practice left-handed shooting.

On the "No!" at the approach phase the author commented on, I learned a long time ago to say "I have nothing for you" in my command voice.

One guy said he just wanted to know what time it was.

Hell. there was one of those street clocks on a pole about twenty feet away with about an 18" dial.

"I have nothing for you."

"But you've got a watch."

I had to point out the street clock to him and he went away muttering.

On the author's "watching your six comments", store and car windows are your friends. Next time you walk down the street, check the reflections, and you'll see what I mean.

So are shadows, late in the afteroon and early in the morning.

I'm not a cop, this is just from daily experiences for 16 years on the streets of Denver... walking to and fro somewhat distant parking lots to work and poking around in small antique and junque shops away from the mall-type areas and the like. I seem to "look like" an easy victim for some reason. Maybe it's my ponytail. Maybe it's my hobbling around on my cane. Who knows?

But, since I ain't a cop, obviously I'm unqualified to comment. So forget it.

Terry, 230RN

 

[Trunk Monkey]

Interestingly I read this a few years back when it first came out and I thought it was BS. Reading it now I find myself in almost total agreement. I’m just not sure about that not calling the cops thing I guess it would depend on if there were any other witnesses

 

[SouthernBoy]

Posted by Trunk Monkey
Interestingly I read this a few years back when it first came out and I thought it was BS. Reading it now I find myself in almost total agreement. I’m just not sure about that not calling the cops thing I guess it would depend on if there were any other witnesses

I agree with your "not calling police" comments. I have taken three lecture seminars on Virginia law and the use of deadly force and one course geared to experienced carriers and such cases, we were advised to be the first to call 911 and explain what just took place. The opinion was that you do not want the perps to be the first to call.

However, the writer of this piece does make a very good point that the chance of some perps calling the police is most likely negligible at best. Guess it's a judgement call. For me, I would call. It might just save some other person from an attack.

 

[gym]

One of the oldest robbery lines is hey do you know the time or do you know where this address is? Don't think put your hand on the gun and be ready to pull it.

 

[NavyLCDR]

One of the oldest robbery lines is hey do you know the time or do you know where this address is? Don't think put your hand on the gun and be ready to pull it.

So, if you are carrying concealed, do you expose your gun in order to put your hand on it just because someone asks what time it is or for directions?

 

[Rock185]

I enjoyed reading the narrative. I believe it would be an especially good read, and I would think very thought provoking, for decent people who have not been exposed to this world. So many genuinely nice, intelligent people seem to have the attitude that, "I'm a nice person, why would anybody hurt me?" They don't understand that predators don't care that you're nice, not carrying a lot of money, not wearing expensive jewelry, etc,etc. Unfortunately, I doubt most of those nice folks spend much/any time on this, or any other gun board where information like this might be presented...ymmv

I'm not saying that every stranger that may ask you a question means you harm, but asking the potential victim a question to distract, and get closer, is a very common tactic....

 

[Phaedrus/69]

Great story! The one thing I disagree with though is the advice to carry an inexpensive gun. Frankly the last thing I'm worried about is not getting my sidearm back! I want to survive the engagement, and I'll worry about the gun later. Obviously you wouldn't want to tote something with great sentimental value (eg. given to you by your departed father) but you want to carry the very best gun you can get your hands on.

I would hate to lose a $1000 HK but it's a lot better than losing my life.

 

[USAF_Vet]

I shared the Arfcom OP on my Facebook account. Hopefully people who normally wouldn't give set defense a seconds thought will read it.

 

[SouthernBoy]

Posted by Phaedrus/69
Great story! The one thing I disagree with though is the advice to carry an inexpensive gun. Frankly the last thing I'm worried about is not getting my sidearm back! I want to survive the engagement, and I'll worry about the gun later. Obviously you wouldn't want to tote something with great sentimental value (eg. given to you by your departed father) but you want to carry the very best gun you can get your hands on.

I would hate to lose a $1000 HK but it's a lot better than losing my life.

In his piece he mentioned a few guns and later on mentions that he carries a Glock 19. I take it from this that guns in the $400 to $600 range are not expensive in his mind. It is a good idea to have a backup gun of the same model and configuration as your primary carry gun in case you do have to use it and it gets taken for evidence. That way you can rearm with a gun that is functionally the same as the one taken. This is what I have done.

The single most important criteria of a carry gun is reliability. If it doesn't go bang when it is suppose to, everything else is a moot point. Buy quality and proven reliability and then prove it to yourself that your sidearm works. That's my take on this.