This is back? "US Guns Litter 90% of Mexican Crime Scenes"

[swagner89]

http://www.newser.com/story/100011/us-guns-litter-90-of-mexican-crime-scenes.html

(NEWSER) – Most of the many thousands of people killed in Mexican drug cartel violence since 2006 have been killed with guns bought in US border states, according to a report based on data from the Bureau of Alcohol, Firearms and Tobacco. The report—prepared by the advocacy group Mayors Against Illegal Guns—found that 90% of guns traced from Mexican crime scenes came from the US, with 75% coming from Texas, Arizona, New Mexico, and California.

Texas alone supplied 40% of the guns involved in Mexican crime, ABC News notes. The report found that far fewer of the guns came from California, which has strict laws aimed at deterring illegal gun trafficking, than from the other three border states, which lack such measures. Mexican President Felipe Calderon has urged the US to help stop the flow of guns, saying that while he understands the purpose of the Second Amendment, "many of these guns are not going to honest American hands."

http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/mexican-crime-american-guns/story?id=11574583&page=1

http://www.mayorsagainstillegalguns.org/html/home/home.shtml

I love how the percentage magically jumps from 75% to 90% from one article to the next

 

[HKUSP45C]

Don't forget, that's guns which they could trace. Last I read the overwhelming majority of weapons recovered at Mexican crime scenes were wholly untrace able.

The logic is as flawed as the stats they're using. It's akin to finding a hundred stolen cars in a warehouse and 99 of them have obliterated or missing VINs but the one that has a legible VIN came from California. You can now safely say that 100 percent of recovered cars traced in the warehouse raid came from California thefts.

 

[KodiakBeer]

Time to get that Gun Export fence finished...

 

[armoredman]

Yes, but that little trace number tidbit is very carefully left off any reports by the MSM, it interferes with thier agenda.
Now if it were MEXICAN guns being smuggled into the US, that would be reported quite differently...

 

[svtruth]

Does Mexico

make any guns?
I thought the preponderance of weapons were stolen from the Mexican police and military. Granted, they received them from teh USA.

 

[Free2game]

Actually it's guns that the Mexican government asks the ATF to trace. The head of the ATF even said that out that most of the guns either trace back to the Mexican government themselves or from South America and that they're only asked to trace a small portion of them.

 

[Free2game]

make any guns?
I thought the preponderance of weapons were stolen from the Mexican police and military. Granted, they received them from teh USA.

I believe that they make some assault rifle that looks like the G36, but it's not in wide use. Most of their military weapons come from the US or Germany. The Mexican military itself is a conscript army and has a comically high desertion rate. Something like 150,000 soldiers abandoned their posts between 2002 and 2008 I believe, many of them take their service rifles with them to sell them.

 

[quatin]

I just came back from a visit to a border town in Mexico. The situation is worse than what you hear from the news. I talked to some of the locals and they are seeing guns that's not normally around. IE AKs and ARs They claim that most of it is coming from the US and I'm starting to believe them.

First of all, crossing the border is not hard, legally or illegally. The Rio Grande gets to be maybe 40 yards wide at parts. Driving through the border check is pretty easy and you don't even get searched, unless they see something suspicious. You can pack your trunk full say on a tax free holiday when there's a lot of traffic and smuggle anything you want.

Second, the drug cartels are making ludicrous amounts of money that they wouldn't hesitate to pay $10k for a $300 Yugo AK. I know I won't be tempted to straw purchase for that much, but I can certainly see how it wouldn't be hard to find people who will.

Third, guns are hard to come by legally in Mexico, the government is very much anti-gun ownership. Even if the cartels wanted to buy guns in Mexico, there's no supply of AKs or ARs. I had previously suspected that the cartels are stealing from the Mexican army. Well, I had the pleasure of walking through a guard station occupied by the army. (Saw an armored dune buggy with a mounted machine gun ) Every soldier that I saw was carrying MP5s or G3 rifles. Therefore, the US seems the most logical choice to get AKs and ARs.

Now, I'm not saying this is our fault that the cartels are smuggling guns from the US to Mexico. Nor am I saying there's even a way to stop it. With that much money to throw around, you can get almost anything to happen. However, sooner or later this violence will spread into the US and we're going to have to deal with it. (Remember, we're buying the drugs from the cartels, so we're involved.) Meanwhile, I'd be more wary who I sold to at gun shows and stock up meanwhile for the imminent drug war that's about to spill over.

 

[Cosmoline]

Even if the cartels wanted to buy guns in Mexico, there's no supply of AKs or ARs.

Of course there's a supply of AR's! The ones we sell to the Mexican military and police. The military and cops in turn supply the drug gangs.

This agitprop we're hearing is just part of the alliance between the Mexican authorities and US anti-gun groups. El Presidente can deflect blame to the gringos and the antis get this new ammo. Remember his rant against American gun owners when he came up here?

 

[HKUSP45C]

I just came back from a visit to a border town in Mexico. The situation is worse than what you hear from the news. I talked to some of the locals and they are seeing guns that's not normally around. IE AKs and ARs They claim that most of it is coming from the US and I'm starting to believe them.

First of all, crossing the border is not hard, legally or illegally. The Rio Grande gets to be maybe 40 yards wide at parts. Driving through the border check is pretty easy and you don't even get searched, unless they see something suspicious. You can pack your trunk full say on a tax free holiday when there's a lot of traffic and smuggle anything you want.

Second, the drug cartels are making ludicrous amounts of money that they wouldn't hesitate to pay $10k for a $300 Yugo AK. I know I won't be tempted to straw purchase for that much, but I can certainly see how it wouldn't be hard to find people who will.

Third, guns are hard to come by legally in Mexico, the government is very much anti-gun ownership. Even if the cartels wanted to buy guns in Mexico, there's no supply of AKs or ARs. I had previously suspected that the cartels are stealing from the Mexican army. Well, I had the pleasure of walking through a guard station occupied by the army. (Saw an armored dune buggy with a mounted machine gun ) Every soldier that I saw was carrying MP5s or G3 rifles. Therefore, the US seems the most logical choice to get AKs and ARs.

Now, I'm not saying this is our fault that the cartels are smuggling guns from the US to Mexico. Nor am I saying there's even a way to stop it. With that much money to throw around, you can get almost anything to happen. However, sooner or later this violence will spread into the US and we're going to have to deal with it. (Remember, we're buying the drugs from the cartels, so we're involved.) Meanwhile, I'd be more wary who I sold to at gun shows and stock up meanwhile for the imminent drug war that's about to spill over.

As I read your post I can't help but notice it's almost entirely based on supposition, conjecture, hearsay and guesswork with absolutely no evidence what-so-ever.

 

[quatin]

Of course there's a supply of AR's! The ones we sell to the Mexican military and police. The military and cops in turn supply the drug gangs.

This agitprop we're hearing is just part of the alliance between the Mexican authorities and US anti-gun groups. El Presidente can deflect blame to the gringos and the antis get this new ammo. Remember his rant against American gun owners when he came up here?

You didn't even read through my post. When I was there, the army had G3s and MP5s. From what the locals tell me, the police aren't even heavily armed since they are mostly corrupt, hence the army being in major security points.

 

[Free2game]

I just came back from a visit to a border town in Mexico. The situation is worse than what you hear from the news. I talked to some of the locals and they are seeing guns that's not normally around. IE AKs and ARs They claim that most of it is coming from the US and I'm starting to believe them.

First of all, crossing the border is not hard, legally or illegally. The Rio Grande gets to be maybe 40 yards wide at parts. Driving through the border check is pretty easy and you don't even get searched, unless they see something suspicious. You can pack your trunk full say on a tax free holiday when there's a lot of traffic and smuggle anything you want.

Second, the drug cartels are making ludicrous amounts of money that they wouldn't hesitate to pay $10k for a $300 Yugo AK. I know I won't be tempted to straw purchase for that much, but I can certainly see how it wouldn't be hard to find people who will.

Third, guns are hard to come by legally in Mexico, the government is very much anti-gun ownership. Even if the cartels wanted to buy guns in Mexico, there's no supply of AKs or ARs. I had previously suspected that the cartels are stealing from the Mexican army. Well, I had the pleasure of walking through a guard station occupied by the army. (Saw an armored dune buggy with a mounted machine gun ) Every soldier that I saw was carrying MP5s or G3 rifles. Therefore, the US seems the most logical choice to get AKs and ARs.

Now, I'm not saying this is our fault that the cartels are smuggling guns from the US to Mexico. Nor am I saying there's even a way to stop it. With that much money to throw around, you can get almost anything to happen. However, sooner or later this violence will spread into the US and we're going to have to deal with it. (Remember, we're buying the drugs from the cartels, so we're involved.) Meanwhile, I'd be more wary who I sold to at gun shows and stock up meanwhile for the imminent drug war that's about to spill over.

They get AKs from South America. The guns go up, not down. The ARs come from the police.

 

[Free2game]

You didn't even read through my post. When I was there, the army had G3s and MP5s. From what the locals tell me, the police aren't even heavily armed since they are mostly corrupt, hence the army being in major security points.

The border police I've seen have all had m4 style rifles. I mean just do an image search for "mexican federal police" and "mexican border police" if you don't believe me.

 

[KodiakBeer]

The drug cartels are international and dealing in the hundreds of billions of dollars range. I just read an interesting story that they are moving to the Euro simply because of the 500 Euro note. It seems the sheer bulk of storing paltry 100 Dollar notes is a logistical nightmare for them.

Anybody who think organizations like that are getting their firepower from "Jim-Bob's Guns N' Bait" in Del Rio is insane.

 

[Shadow 7D]

Funny where I was at, the federal cops had M-16s

Really guys, do you think the cartels want to send in runners to buy AR's in dribs and drops or just buy out a police warehouse of FULL AUTOMATIC USA MADE M-16's

Why buy a semi then have to dick with it, when you can buy the real deal for less????
do you think they pay 800 for a Ar, when the can buy them from south or from their own government for less and GET M16's NOT AR's

 

[Shadow 7D]

sorry, but there seems to be a logic flaw in the whole 'assault weapons' going across the boarder, now shotties and pistols, yeah maybe.

 

[KBintheSLC]

The report—prepared by the advocacy group Mayors Against Illegal Guns

I think this is the root of the problem with this "information".

Yeah... exploiting the small fraction of traceable guns that came from the US seems to fit the media agenda quite well. I just wonder how they pass this over on folks when most of the seized weapons are military grade... grenade launchers, belt-fed machine guns, M4's, etc. It is amazing that some folks still believe that you can buy these items legally in the US.

 

[TIMC]

Well I am quite sure if they can smuggle all those thousands of tons of drugs into the USA and smuggle billions of dollars out of the USA then they can smuggle guns into Mexico with no problem. I have no doubt a lot of the guns used down there are from the USA.
What the president of Mexico needs to realize is that it is not our fault or really our problem. We do not want the drugs here but he has done really what amounts to nothing to stop the flow coming here; our law enforcement has done more than the Mexican government. If Mexico wants to stop the flow of guns into their country they need to stop it. I don't see them trying to help us with the illegal alien problem. Why should we give up our rights because they don't really want to solve their problem themselves.
I personally am really kind of tired of all the whining Mexico has been doing. I say (Shut up, Man up) and fix your ow problems, maybe close the border and let nothing in or out. When a border patrol agent shoots somebody coming in the USA illegaly they don't whine.
Ok I'm done with my rant, thank you.

 

[quatin]

The border police I've seen have all had m4 style rifles. I mean just do an image search for "mexican federal police" and "mexican border police" if you don't believe me.

I have to admit, I didn't see a single police officer when I was there. (Excluding the guard at the border.) The army occupied the check points on the Mexican side and they do patrols as well. Whenever there's a shooting, it was always between the army and the cartels. I didn't hear them say that the rifles were fully automatic, they are just seeing rifles in the AK and AR shape.

 

[benEzra]

Most of these U.S.-made weapons didn't come from the U.S. civilian market (note the grenades, M203's, and NFA length M4's):

...nor did these:

Those came via governments, either diverted from the Mexican government supply chain or from Cold War stockpiles of U.S.-supplied arms in Central America. Most of the M16/M4 type rifles look too new to be Cold War era, though; those were probably fairly recently diverted from the Mexican government.

 

[easyg]

Most of the many thousands of people killed in Mexican drug cartel violence since 2006 have been killed with guns bought in US border states, according to a report based on data from the Bureau of Alcohol, Firearms and Tobacco.

All the more reason to build a real DMZ style border between the two nations.

Place military units along the border, and employ concertina wire, landmines, attack helicopters, armored infantry, the works....
Shoot anyone crossing illegally on sight.

 

[Shadow 7D]

And all this time, I never knew that I could buy a FN mini (M249 SAW) here in the US, I have been so deprived, I will have to look up my local Hells Angles and see if they have corrupt Army Supply Sergeant that can hook me up.

Um, I mean I need to go to my LGS and see what he has on the wall (funny but I've been to a Class 3 dealer that really did have one on the wall, doubt the Cartels want to pay what he was asking)

 

[FIVETWOSEVEN]

Mayors Against Illegal Guns

This is a great idea, where can I join this group because we need to outlaw illegal guns!

 

[Slamfire]

I don't believe a single statistic of those anti gunners.

I don't know how the data was collected and against what population.

Mexico is blaming their "Drug Violence" is due to American Guns, not American Drugs. Any data given out by the Mexican Government should be suspect.

Instead of stopping the Drug cartel cash flows to our Wall Street Bankers, our Government wants to take our guns.

Stupid.

 

[robhof]

These are the same people who want to sue Arizona for enforcing the Fed Imm. laws using our tax dollars even though all polls so far show 70%+ of the US favor Arizona's law.