To Christian Gun Owners: Why do you disagree with the Amish position?

[ctdonath]

The longest-lasting nonviolent group I know of is Tibetan Buhddism.
Their greatest defense is probably the rocky terrain and few resources worth fighting over.
Domination by others is more a matter of ego & geography. Conquest of Tibet nets little, and the religion is deeply ingrained, so attempts to commandeer the culture are not enthusiastic enough to be successful - just ain't worth it.
The only reason to conquer Tibet is to dominate people ... and their non-violence policy (coupled with ineptitude when they do take up arms) means the only way to really conquer them is to wipe them out, a rather self-defeating excursion. It's not like the land is inherently desireable.

I have been noting a growing number of groups which, as mindwip observes, can only exist because they are supported/protected by a those with opposing views. Amish can live in peace because of PA cops & USA soldiers. Vegans thrive only thru the efforts of omnivores. Leftists have political power because of a political system built & maintained by Rightists.

 

[History Prof]

No, I was thinking of Bible stories where Christ hung out with prostitues and tax collectors for the purpose of offering them salvation just like everyone else. The holier-than-thou types of the time were horrified that he would even associate with those people. However, he did not participate in prostitution/sin nor do I think would he participate in the drug culture mentioned above.

Yea, I think I forgot to mention that part. Certainly Jesus would NOT be participating, although He (2000 years ago) would be "hangin' with that crowd" for the purpose of setting them straight. That is why, when He returns, He will be judging those who DIDN'T get on the straight and narrow...

 

[mindwip]

I thought about Tibetan poeple but i thought they were not free and were controled by the chinese. Looking up on the "all knowing" wikipedia i did find some comments that would show that tibet is not a wholely non-violent poeple

Neither the Republic of China nor the People's Republic of China has ever renounced China's claim to sovereignty over Tibet.[14] In 1950, the People's Liberation Army entered the Tibetan area of Chamdo, crushing nominal resistance from the ill-equipped Tibetan army.

The 14th Dalai Lama and other government principals fled to exile in India, but isolated resistance continued in Tibet until 1969 when CIA support was withdrawn.

Tibet has no control over what happens to it, there leaders are exiled in India.

All governments, however, recognise PRC (PRC is People's Republic of China) sovereignty over Tibet, and none has recognised the Dalai Lama's government in exile in India.

I bring up this question because i dont see how any religion can stay alive and be all peaceful. In this way i think it is hard to rationalize that the Amish(or others like it) are the true word of god. I dont personaly see why god would want his followers to die and not spread there religion. It seems counter -productive

 

[Doug.38PR]

Another thought. Since Amish, and other pacifists, are against killing men under any circumstances....that must follow they are against the death penalty. Somebody has to do the executing.

On that note, one of the things anti-Christian anti-death penalty people attack Christianity on is it being "backwards" because the Bible supports the death penatly.

So in that light, pacifist Christians, Amish and otherwise, are saying the Bible is wrong.

I say, since the Bible does support the death penalty then killing in self defense cannot be a sin.

 

[Eleven Mike]

The Catholic Church also opposes the death penalty, yet it does not condemn killing altogether.

While I agree that the Bible supports and even commands the death penalty, there is room for misinterpretation.

 

[Doug.38PR]

The Catholic Church also opposes the death penalty, yet it does not condemn killing altogether.

They do? Are you sure "the" Catholic Church as a denominationl body opposes it or just a large number of Catholics within that denomination? Death penalty has been around for a LONG time, longer than the Catholic Church (one of the oldest of the denominations)

I always thought Catholics (as a denomination) were generally pretty conservative politically and traditionally

 

[hso]

I think the original question has been answered and we're beginning to drift. I'm going to close this thread and thank everyone for showing that a civil discussion about a challenging topic can be carried out.

My compliments to the members of THR.