Took another newbie to the range today

[PlayboyPenguin]

I got to take my second newbie in a month to the range today. It was a nurse friend of my partner. He is a little guy and has had a problem with being targeted for "gay bashing " in the past because of his small size.

He found out that I like to go to the range during an open house we had this weekend and expresed that he thought about getting a gun for defense but was scared of them. I told him the best way to get over that was to go shooting. So today I took him to the range.

I started him out on a 9mm Taurus 92SS and then let him shoot my Ruger GP100 6" and my SP101 2.25". I wanted to let him experience both a revolver and an auto to see what he prefered and not push my love of revolvers on him. He seemed to prefer the GP100 since the SP101 had a little too much bite for a guy his size (he is like 5'6, 135lbs). he did like the Taurus 92SS alot but thought it was harder to load and was afraid he could not get it apart to clean it. I told him I could easily teach him to disassemble and clean it in no time so that should not be a concern. I also told himm they come smaller in case he wanted to be able to carry it.

He seemed to really enjoy himself and when I asked if he was still afraid of guns he said "not as much" and then proceded to ask me where to buy and pricing. He also made me promise to take him again and let him shoot a smaller auto and he also wants to shoot my .44mag which was with me but I felt it might scare him off at first.

 

[Oleg Volk]

Do you have a .22 for teaching newbies?

 

[PlayboyPenguin]

Yeah, I have a .22 but he had expressed definate interest in someting that would be a "man stopper". I can appreciate the .22 for children or for people working on accuracy but when it comes to home or self defense I see little practicality in them.

If someone is just wanting something to use in an emergency I feel it is better to wet their feet with something more like what they will actually be wanting. Knowing that this type will probably not be going to the range very often and also that guns like a 9mm are such easy shooting guns that they do not need to be exposed to a pee shooter first. Also if you get the right frame size a .357 can be very easy to shoot.

 

[Bridger]

"man stopper" or not, I don't see what the problem is in introducing people with them. It's best to try a variety of firearms, and the .22 helps establish basic marksmanship skills without the flinch, noise, or cost, of the centerfire stuff.

The first handguns I ever shot were a .44 Magnum, .357 snubby, and WWII 1911 in .45. While I love all three calibers, my shooting that first time at 7 yards was...well, I've come a long way. I don't own my own handguns yet even, just shoot my friends. I shoot his .22 pistols a lot, and it only helps my shooting with the serious stuff and the guns I am considering for concealed carry

 

[Freddymac]

I second the 22

I don't care how big or small someone is, you should, IMO, always start a new shooter off with a 22. We shooters often take for granted that when you shoot a gun, something is exploding right in front of your face. To minimize flinch I feel that you should start new-b's out eith a 22. Lets face it, even if someone likes loud bangs, but has a flinch, accuracy will suffer. How much fun is shooting when you can't hit what you are aiming at? So, for the sake of our sport, please start people out with an easy to shoot 22. I have a 22/45 for teaching. After all, why do most of us own 22's? Because they are good for honing/ developing basic skills, and they are just fun to shoot.

Just a thought,
Fred

 

[Trebor]

As an instructor I ALWAYS start a new shooter off with a .22. Depending on the amount of time we have, and what else they want to shoot, they may only fire two or three magazines of .22 before moving on to something else, but they still always shoot a .22 first. The reduction in noise and recoil just makes learning the fine points of trigger control, sight alignment and hold that much easier.

 

[Stickjockey]

Accuracy and defense go hand in hand. While not the best for actual defensive shooting, the .22 is good for developing those skills used for defense.

I would also suggest introducing him to http://www.pinkpistols.org

 

[Igloodude]

Thirded (fourthed? fifthed?) on the .22 - if they've expressed any sort of fear, even moreso. If nothing else, it allows them to get familiar with the concept of sight alignment and trigger control without consciously or unconsciously worrying about recoil. You can always go to a heavier caliber once they've said "is this all there is?" but if they've not reacted well to the centerfire, it's tough to get that initial flinch out of their head.

Edit: by the way, a big thumbs-up on introducing the newbie to shooting.

 

[PlayboyPenguin]

Geez, gimme a break

Why is everyone acting like those gun shop salesman that everyone is always complaining about. The ones that tell you what you want or need instead of listening to what you want or need.

I have had a great deal of training in firearms myself. I served 8 years of actice duty military and I completed training at the state police academy. I hate to break it to anyone but neither of those organizations started me off on a .22 pistol. The Army trained me with a .45acp and the police academy trained us with 9mm. I learned just fine.

This person did not want to become a shooter or to be someone that went to the range alot. He just wanted one gun that he was comfortable with and he felt could stop a threat. That is what I showed him and he was very pleased with what he shot. Why are some people so quick to try and find something wrong with anything someone does?

Accuracy and defense do go hand in hand but if I took him to the range and taught him how to shoot a .22 then he went out and bought a .357 and never practiced with it again he would probably not be able to hit anything with it. If he learned with a .357 and then went and bought a similar one he would know what to expect.

 

[Igloodude]

Sorry, I'm just working off my own experiences - sure, the Navy handed me a .45ACP 1911 to start with too, but the newbies that I've taken to the range seem to like to dip their toe in the water before diving in.

Is there a downside to shooting five rounds with a .22 before having a new shooter fire a centerfire?

 

[Dogmatix]

Congrats and Thanks

As of yet no one has mentioned any sort of congratulations for starting another shooter or turning another anti gunner. So I will be the first. Way to be! You may have changed some guys life and possibly saved him farther down the road. I commend you. I believe your approach was great.

Thanks again,

Wayne

 

[Freddymac]

Dog, thats true

We should all thank playboy for taking someone shooting, and we all should try to take someone new shooting as often as possible, but the most important thing about taking someone shooting who has never shot a gun before, (particulary someone who already has a fear of guns) is showing them that shooting is fun and that guns are not scary.

Fred

 

[Trebor]

Hey, you did good taking the guy to the range. Good for you. I should have said that sooner.

I'm not going to apologize for suggesting that having a newbie shoot a .22 first is a better idea than starting them off with a centerfire pistol.

I have had a great deal of training in firearms myself.

Sure, but how much training do you have in firearms instruction? My reccomendation is based on my experience as an instructor who specializes in working with newbies. Some newbies do just fine starting with a centerfire pistol but, in my experience, that's not the way to bet.

 

[Soybomb]

I think you've taken it as an attack and far more personally than it was meant.

This person did not want to become a shooter or to be someone that went to the range alot. He just wanted one gun that he was comfortable with and he felt could stop a threat.

I would say he does want to be a shooter then if he wants to accurate enough to stop a threat. I know when I first started even at 7yds I was quite bad and developed a flinch with a 9mm. Even 15 minutes with a .22 is time well spent I think. Ymmv and all that.

Glad you got to take him out and maybe have started him on the roads of having another means of self defense.

 

[MedGrl]

Good on you for taking a newbie to the range. I don't see what is wrong with not starting with a .22. my first trip to the range I shot a .357 S&W N-frame and a .45acp. nothing wrong with that.

 

[Rick O'Shea]

PP,
First of all, excellent job of introducing this gentleman to the wonderful world of firearms. Even if his initial interest is self-defense (a VERY worthwhile cause), I think it likely that the fun factor will take hold pretty soon, if it hasn't already.

Second, (regarding the .22 vs. larger caliber debate) how did he shoot?

While the rimfire training introduction makes a lot of sense, some people take to the regular stuff like ducks to water.
If you're concerned about him maintaining front sight focus and not flinching, just put some .38's in the GP100. They'll go bang instead of Boom, but he'll still be shooting the "big gun".
Once he gets addicted he'll want a .22 for cheap-ammo training and plinking anyway.

+1 on the Pink Pistols. A great group from all I've seen and heard.

 

[PlayboyPenguin]

Rick

His first few sets where pretty bad. But after some short lessons on not anticipating the shot, how to squeeze the trigger, and some basic aiming techniques he was doing very well. He shot very well with the 9mm. He did good with the GP100 but suffered a little with the SP101 due to the smaller barrel and frame. He even mentioned that the recoil was nowhere near as bad as he thought it would be and now wants to shoot my bigger ones (the ones he was afraid of earlier when I let him choose from my collection what he wanted to try).

 

[Rick O'Shea]

Sounds like he's already doing better than I did when I started.

My nickname stems from the fact that on one of my first range trips with friends (shooting a .357 snubbie...), my only shot to hit the target bounced off the ground! (Yes, it was an outdoor range).

You sound like a good teacher and are certainly a good friend. (Though his partner might disagree when the "disposable" income starts disappearing!)

Best to you both,
Rick

 

[PlayboyPenguin]

?You sound like a good teacher and are certainly a good friend. (Though his partner might disagree when the "disposable" income starts disappearing!)

There in lies a possible problem. His partner is pretty freaked out by guns. Not to mention he got a little jealous when he found out we went to the range together. he might be a little tougher to convert. I have offered to take him next time.

 

[Dogmatix]

Jealousy sucks. Best of luck with that. And I hope he comes too, wouldn't hurt to have both parties involved if anything ever occured to where the gun was needed. I'd love if my Fiancee packed too its a turn on

 

[Rick O'Shea]

Truly, get them both involved if possible.

Most significant others are more jealous of time spent away from them than of any actual romantic threat.

My wife is very sweet, and although she doesn't shoot, she doesn't begrudge me range time (I think she senses the therapeutic value). I would love it if she would come, though; I miss her when she's not with me, and when I'm having a good time I want to share that with her (I know, awwww...)

And as Dogmatix said, there's the strategic advantage...

 

[meinbruder]

"There in lies a possible problem. His partner is pretty freaked out by guns. Not to mention he got a little jealous when he found out we went to the range together. he might be a little tougher to convert. I have offered to take him next time."

Perhaps it would help to invite them to join an organized group-shooting trip for the partner’s first introduction. It is normally less threatening for newbi’s as well as slightly jealous partners when placed in a crowd situation. On behalf of the Port Pink Pistols chapter I would like to extend an invitation for you, and them, to join our next trip.

I would also like to extend that invitation to any THR member who would like to join us. I don’t have a set date yet but the first Sunday with sunshine, or at least no rain, I hope to gather the group for an outdoor shoot. Please email me if interested.

Mike Bowman
Portland Pink Pistols
[email protected]

 

[Bridger]

Ah I should have said good work on introducing new shooters, it was intended at least heh.

But a .22 is still a better start. It helps to diagnose errors and reduce fear of recoil and blast. As another poster mentioned, a couple magazines through the .22 is no big deal. I don't own any handguns, but when I take new shooters out we shoot at least 50 rounds through the .22 before moving on. The other stuff ends up getting shot more, but at least with the .22 they get a good start on the basics.

And it's not like anyone is too stupid to understand the difference in manual of arms, especially if it's .22 auto -> centerfire auto or the same with revolvers.

I don't like to tell people that I know better than them do, but lets face it, as experienced firearms users we DO know what is better for a new shooter than they do. When I was new I thought I didn't have any time for a wimpy .22, until I realized I was paying .50 cents a shot to miss