I am traveling through NY state, not the city and have read the Stalinistic firearm laws of this state. My question is this, is the Federal Peaceable Journey enough protection to travel through the state with a pistol unloaded and secured per 18 USC §926A? I can legally possess in both originating and destination states.
Traveling through NY state, is Fed. Peaceable Journey Law enough?
- Thread starter distra
- Start date
- Status
P95Carry
Moderator Emeritus
As I understand things yes - in theory!!!
I do believe also tho (and am reminded of something like this in NJ) that it can depend on who stops you!! Hopefully NY is at least less paranoid than NJ.
If I had to make the trip I'd hope to be OK and make as few stops as possible but even so - I tend to want to drive the long ways around to avoid some states - just in case! Heck, in MD if guns on board you are not supposed to stop - even for gas etc.
I do believe also tho (and am reminded of something like this in NJ) that it can depend on who stops you!! Hopefully NY is at least less paranoid than NJ.
If I had to make the trip I'd hope to be OK and make as few stops as possible but even so - I tend to want to drive the long ways around to avoid some states - just in case! Heck, in MD if guns on board you are not supposed to stop - even for gas etc.
geekWithA.45
Moderator Emeritus
See this:
http://www.nraila.org/GunLaws/Federal/Read.aspx?id=73
Long story short:
Yes, 18 USC §926A is enough.
You will either remain undetected, unarrested, or become very rich after the charges are dropped in federal court, and the jury empanneled for the civil lawsuit finds in your favor.
Of course, by the time you get home, your dog will have forgotten who you are.
http://www.nraila.org/GunLaws/Federal/Read.aspx?id=73
Long story short:
Yes, 18 USC §926A is enough.
You will either remain undetected, unarrested, or become very rich after the charges are dropped in federal court, and the jury empanneled for the civil lawsuit finds in your favor.
Of course, by the time you get home, your dog will have forgotten who you are.
Last edited:
gunsmith
member
my bro is a cop in NY
and he assured me that cops would arrest you if you were caught with firearms.
I tried to explain the law but he said standard procedure is to arrest in these cases.
Whenever I get invited home I decline, and I let my old friends in NY know why
and he assured me that cops would arrest you if you were caught with firearms.
I tried to explain the law but he said standard procedure is to arrest in these cases.
Whenever I get invited home I decline, and I let my old friends in NY know why
IANAL, but I am a resident in NYS.
And, yes the laws here are atrocious. You cannot legally HANDLE a handgun (like in a gunshop), unless you hold a valid "pistol permit". So I would expect, whether the actual law is on your side or not, if you're stopped and a handgun is found, you WILL get into a serious hassle. Might even spend some time in the hoosgow before it got straightened out. Personally I wouldn't take the chance.
And, yes the laws here are atrocious. You cannot legally HANDLE a handgun (like in a gunshop), unless you hold a valid "pistol permit". So I would expect, whether the actual law is on your side or not, if you're stopped and a handgun is found, you WILL get into a serious hassle. Might even spend some time in the hoosgow before it got straightened out. Personally I wouldn't take the chance.
Since there is really no way to get from CT to other western states except through NYS, how does one transport the firearm through the state? Is it best to ship it to the destination state then ship it back? This really doesn't help for defense during the trip
I guess I would get myself into a free state (PA) as quickly as possible. I know you can't avoid NY entirely, but you might want to travel to PA through NJ instead of NY to the extent possible, because NJ appears to understand that 18 USC 926a applies to them.
birddog
Member
Just shhhhh and drive carefully.
We have no peaceable journey provision.
We have no peaceable journey provision.
NY is messed up. Being from Jersey, I don't get to criticize many states regarding their laws, (or their interpretation of laws) so when I can, I do!
Anyway, I would think if you kept your guns locked in cases, unloaded, maybe even disassembled to some degree, secured out-of-sight in the trunk, and drove like a normal person would, you should be OK.
For a LEO to examine the contents of your trunk, he would need PC that you had something fishy back there, and for a speeding pullover, I don't think that's likely. Make sure nothing gun-related is in plain-view.
Go above-and-beyond to secure them, keep 'em out of sight, don't drive to draw attention, and go on with life.
Anyway, I would think if you kept your guns locked in cases, unloaded, maybe even disassembled to some degree, secured out-of-sight in the trunk, and drove like a normal person would, you should be OK.
For a LEO to examine the contents of your trunk, he would need PC that you had something fishy back there, and for a speeding pullover, I don't think that's likely. Make sure nothing gun-related is in plain-view.
Go above-and-beyond to secure them, keep 'em out of sight, don't drive to draw attention, and go on with life.
MachIVshooter
Member
Understanding how peaceable journey reads and that you are not carrying unlawfully, I would just drive carefully. Having plates from a nearby state (and one from which NY sees many people), I wouldn't think you'd be hassled.
Coming from CO, I personally wouldn't. Since "peacable journey" would be hard to argue, and Easterners see us rocky mountain residents as gun-totin' cowboys, I expect I'd wind up in handcuffs.
Coming from CO, I personally wouldn't. Since "peacable journey" would be hard to argue, and Easterners see us rocky mountain residents as gun-totin' cowboys, I expect I'd wind up in handcuffs.
Spreadfire Arms
Member
- Joined
- Feb 23, 2005
- Messages
- 1,312
im supposed to go to NYC in early 2007 for my cousin's wedding. i think she's a liberal too. just to make the new yawk liberals mad im going to carry cuz im one of the very chosen few who can carry there......besides, ive never been to NYC but i suspect it has a high crime rate!
NO
I got a call from the NRA-ILA on this 3 weeks ago. They are in the middle of litigation with PRNJ and PRNY on this. They advise NOT to bring guns through either states, while there are federal laws to protect you, NY and NJ do not follow them at all times, and until the issue is settled in federal court no one is telling them that they have to follow these laws. This means that if you are arrested for illegal possesion you could be royally screwed, instead of vindicated by federal law. Furthermore since they are in a legal battle with the NRA they are able to hide behind the shield of "we are unable to speak about this matter as we are involved in a legal ruling at this time" I got this responce for both NJ and NY less than a week ago.
Hope this helps
I got a call from the NRA-ILA on this 3 weeks ago. They are in the middle of litigation with PRNJ and PRNY on this. They advise NOT to bring guns through either states, while there are federal laws to protect you, NY and NJ do not follow them at all times, and until the issue is settled in federal court no one is telling them that they have to follow these laws. This means that if you are arrested for illegal possesion you could be royally screwed, instead of vindicated by federal law. Furthermore since they are in a legal battle with the NRA they are able to hide behind the shield of "we are unable to speak about this matter as we are involved in a legal ruling at this time" I got this responce for both NJ and NY less than a week ago.
Hope this helps
I have contacted NYC and NJ and gotten a "cannot respond or offer legal advice" from both the AG and SP. I have not contacted an AG for the rest of new york state, as I wasnt concerned about that area. NY is tricky the laws vary so much from area to area.
steveracer
Member
It sucks, I know..
NY native, active duty in VA. I can't bring a handgun home, period. I CAN, however, bring a long gun, and so can all of you. So, be it 870 or M1A or SKS, go ahead and bring them, and they can't do a thing about it. Lately it's a .357 levergun, because most people don't get their hackles up over cowboy guns, but freak right out at the sight of an EBR.
Steve
NY native, active duty in VA. I can't bring a handgun home, period. I CAN, however, bring a long gun, and so can all of you. So, be it 870 or M1A or SKS, go ahead and bring them, and they can't do a thing about it. Lately it's a .357 levergun, because most people don't get their hackles up over cowboy guns, but freak right out at the sight of an EBR.
Steve
Dave Schutz
Member
NY Concealed Carry
While the US Peaceable Carry Law will ultimately get you out of jail, whether or not you go to jail will depend on the knowledge of the cop. That will depend on where in the state you meet him. In my rural county, you will probably get into a shooting discussion until his radio (we do have them now) sends him off to something that matters. In and around some of the cities (not just the big one), a look at a reminder copy of the federal law might work; I'd carry that in plain sight. But if he has a New York City accent (any of them), just give him your name and wrist size for the cuffs.
A previous post that mentioned your eventual wealth and your dog's memory is probably correct. But it's more prudent to avoid the hassle by sticking with the US highways well away from NYC (the latter is always good advice). Frankly, if the guns are properly secured and you don't make yourself a cop magnet, there's little to worry about.
My upstate permit to carry is invalid in NYC because: (1) I have no need/desire to go there, (2) I'm not personally acquainted with the Mayor, and (3) I'm a Republican. NY State has no reciprocity with other states, so a valid CCW anywhere else is irrevelant and invenrial anywhere in NYS. Only the federal law "works", and I'd follow it to the letter.
While the US Peaceable Carry Law will ultimately get you out of jail, whether or not you go to jail will depend on the knowledge of the cop. That will depend on where in the state you meet him. In my rural county, you will probably get into a shooting discussion until his radio (we do have them now) sends him off to something that matters. In and around some of the cities (not just the big one), a look at a reminder copy of the federal law might work; I'd carry that in plain sight. But if he has a New York City accent (any of them), just give him your name and wrist size for the cuffs.
A previous post that mentioned your eventual wealth and your dog's memory is probably correct. But it's more prudent to avoid the hassle by sticking with the US highways well away from NYC (the latter is always good advice). Frankly, if the guns are properly secured and you don't make yourself a cop magnet, there's little to worry about.
My upstate permit to carry is invalid in NYC because: (1) I have no need/desire to go there, (2) I'm not personally acquainted with the Mayor, and (3) I'm a Republican. NY State has no reciprocity with other states, so a valid CCW anywhere else is irrevelant and invenrial anywhere in NYS. Only the federal law "works", and I'd follow it to the letter.
raxafarian
Member
- Joined
- Jul 28, 2006
- Messages
- 41
Passing through NY state
I made several calls a few years ago since I live in CT and have a CCW for CT and PA asking about traveling through NY with guns (handguns and rifles). Several agencies told me "you can't". I finally spoke with somebody at the AG office that said I could if: "locked in a case, inaccessible part of the vehicle, and ammunition separate". I wrote his name and number down but that won't be any help since this was 8 or so years ago (and I can't find it).
I made several calls a few years ago since I live in CT and have a CCW for CT and PA asking about traveling through NY with guns (handguns and rifles). Several agencies told me "you can't". I finally spoke with somebody at the AG office that said I could if: "locked in a case, inaccessible part of the vehicle, and ammunition separate". I wrote his name and number down but that won't be any help since this was 8 or so years ago (and I can't find it).
§ 926A. Interstate transportation of firearms
Notwithstanding any other provision of any law or any rule or regulation of a State or any political subdivision thereof, any person who is not otherwise prohibited by this chapter from transporting, shipping, or receiving a firearm shall be entitled to transport a firearm for any lawful purpose from any place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm to any other place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm if, during such transportation the firearm is unloaded, and neither the firearm nor any ammunition being transported is readily accessible or is directly accessible from the passenger compartment of such transporting vehicle: Provided, That in the case of a vehicle without a compartment separate from the driver’s compartment the firearm or ammunition shall be contained in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console.
Notwithstanding any other provision of any law or any rule or regulation of a State or any political subdivision thereof, any person who is not otherwise prohibited by this chapter from transporting, shipping, or receiving a firearm shall be entitled to transport a firearm for any lawful purpose from any place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm to any other place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm if, during such transportation the firearm is unloaded, and neither the firearm nor any ammunition being transported is readily accessible or is directly accessible from the passenger compartment of such transporting vehicle: Provided, That in the case of a vehicle without a compartment separate from the driver’s compartment the firearm or ammunition shall be contained in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console.
Dave Schutz
Member
For convenience & consistency, here's the pertinent federal law:
-CITE 18 USC Sec. 926A - CRIMES AND CRIMINAL PROCEDURE
PART I – CRIMES CHAPTER 44 – FIREARMS 01/03/05
Sec. 926A. Interstate transportation of firearms -STATUTE-
Notwithstanding any other provision of any law or any rule or regulation of a State or any political subdivision thereof, any person who is not otherwise prohibited by this chapter from transporting, shipping, or receiving a firearm shall be entitled to transport a firearm for any lawful purpose from any place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm to any other place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm if, during such transportation the firearm is unloaded, and neither the firearm nor any ammunition being transported is readily accessible or is directly accessible from the passenger compartment of such transporting vehicle: Provided, That in the case of a vehicle without a compartment separate from the driver's compartment the firearm or ammunition shall be contained in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console.
That trumps state & local law (even in NYC), and a cop who makes an arrest of someone in compliance with it could eventually be in hot water. (But the interim might be unpleasant.)
-CITE 18 USC Sec. 926A - CRIMES AND CRIMINAL PROCEDURE
PART I – CRIMES CHAPTER 44 – FIREARMS 01/03/05
Sec. 926A. Interstate transportation of firearms -STATUTE-
Notwithstanding any other provision of any law or any rule or regulation of a State or any political subdivision thereof, any person who is not otherwise prohibited by this chapter from transporting, shipping, or receiving a firearm shall be entitled to transport a firearm for any lawful purpose from any place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm to any other place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm if, during such transportation the firearm is unloaded, and neither the firearm nor any ammunition being transported is readily accessible or is directly accessible from the passenger compartment of such transporting vehicle: Provided, That in the case of a vehicle without a compartment separate from the driver's compartment the firearm or ammunition shall be contained in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console.
That trumps state & local law (even in NYC), and a cop who makes an arrest of someone in compliance with it could eventually be in hot water. (But the interim might be unpleasant.)
LAR,
While that law is a great one, NJ and NY do not follow it. Yes its against federal law NOT to follow 926A. (Interstate transportation of firearms) and yes they are in the middle of a federal legal battle over it, it is still not followed. You can bring all the documentation and paper you want and at best they will give it back to you after you make bail. If you think I am joking just do a google search on the subject and you will see several law suits brought against each state from individuals for unlawful arrest, etc. Unfortunately since NJ and NY are in federal court over the matter all of these other lawsuits must wait.
On another note and back to the original question,
Your best bet is to do what another member suggested and get a name and number of someone. I highly suggest you use the state police rather than any local department. Also keep in mind, that peacable journey stops when you do. So if you stop to eat, or visit a friend, or theoretically stop to use the bathroom off of the highway, you are no longer covered under the law from what I understand (not that it matters since the law really isnt followed anyway :banghead: )
the best bet is to just stay out of NY. The reason I have this information is because I wrote both NJ and NY about flying out of their aiports with firearms checked in my luggage. After several return letters from a VERY long list of recipients as well as a phone call from the NRA-ILA in response to a copy of my letter that they received, I make sure I never fly out of NJ or NY no matter how much more convenient it would be.
If you are curious on who I have consulted here is the list of offices the that received my letter, granted this is more geared towards NJ, but still, you can see why Im :banghead: :banghead: over this topic.
U.S. Department of Justice
Office of the Attorney General
950 Pennsylvania Avenue N.W.
Washington, D.C. 20530-0001
Office of Justice Programs
Office of the Assistant Attorney General
U.S. Department of Justice
810 Seventh Street NW
Washington DC 20531
Office of the Governor
Governor Jon S. Corzine
PO Box 001
Trenton, NJ 08625
Port Authority Airport Operations
Building 1
Newark Int'l. Airport
Newark, NJ 07114
Corporate Headquarters
The Port Authority of NY & NJ
225 Park Avenue South
New York, NY 10003
Port Authority of New York
13TH St & Provost St
Jersey City, NJ 07310
New York State Office of the Attorney General
120 Broadway
New York, New York 10271
Office of The Attorney General of New Jersey
P.O. Box 080
Trenton, NJ 08625-0080
Office of The Attorney General of New Jersey
Division on Civil Rights
P.O. Box 089
Trenton, NJ 08625-0089
Office of The Attorney General of New Jersey
Division of Law
P.O. Box 112
Trenton, NJ 08625-0112
Office of The Attorney General of New Jersey
Division of State Police
P.O. Box 7068
West Trenton, NJ 08628-7068
NRA-ILA
11250 Waples Mill Road
Fairfax, Virginia 22030
ANJRPC
PO Box 353
Pompton Plains, NJ 07444-0353
Scott L. Bach, Esq.
Board of Directors
National Rifle Association of America
P.O. Box 651
Newfoundland, NJ 07435
PA Rifle & Pistol Association
Legal Action Department
PO Box 216
Sandy Lake, PA 16145-0216
While that law is a great one, NJ and NY do not follow it. Yes its against federal law NOT to follow 926A. (Interstate transportation of firearms) and yes they are in the middle of a federal legal battle over it, it is still not followed. You can bring all the documentation and paper you want and at best they will give it back to you after you make bail. If you think I am joking just do a google search on the subject and you will see several law suits brought against each state from individuals for unlawful arrest, etc. Unfortunately since NJ and NY are in federal court over the matter all of these other lawsuits must wait.
On another note and back to the original question,
Your best bet is to do what another member suggested and get a name and number of someone. I highly suggest you use the state police rather than any local department. Also keep in mind, that peacable journey stops when you do. So if you stop to eat, or visit a friend, or theoretically stop to use the bathroom off of the highway, you are no longer covered under the law from what I understand (not that it matters since the law really isnt followed anyway :banghead: )
the best bet is to just stay out of NY. The reason I have this information is because I wrote both NJ and NY about flying out of their aiports with firearms checked in my luggage. After several return letters from a VERY long list of recipients as well as a phone call from the NRA-ILA in response to a copy of my letter that they received, I make sure I never fly out of NJ or NY no matter how much more convenient it would be.
If you are curious on who I have consulted here is the list of offices the that received my letter, granted this is more geared towards NJ, but still, you can see why Im :banghead: :banghead: over this topic.
U.S. Department of Justice
Office of the Attorney General
950 Pennsylvania Avenue N.W.
Washington, D.C. 20530-0001
Office of Justice Programs
Office of the Assistant Attorney General
U.S. Department of Justice
810 Seventh Street NW
Washington DC 20531
Office of the Governor
Governor Jon S. Corzine
PO Box 001
Trenton, NJ 08625
Port Authority Airport Operations
Building 1
Newark Int'l. Airport
Newark, NJ 07114
Corporate Headquarters
The Port Authority of NY & NJ
225 Park Avenue South
New York, NY 10003
Port Authority of New York
13TH St & Provost St
Jersey City, NJ 07310
New York State Office of the Attorney General
120 Broadway
New York, New York 10271
Office of The Attorney General of New Jersey
P.O. Box 080
Trenton, NJ 08625-0080
Office of The Attorney General of New Jersey
Division on Civil Rights
P.O. Box 089
Trenton, NJ 08625-0089
Office of The Attorney General of New Jersey
Division of Law
P.O. Box 112
Trenton, NJ 08625-0112
Office of The Attorney General of New Jersey
Division of State Police
P.O. Box 7068
West Trenton, NJ 08628-7068
NRA-ILA
11250 Waples Mill Road
Fairfax, Virginia 22030
ANJRPC
PO Box 353
Pompton Plains, NJ 07444-0353
Scott L. Bach, Esq.
Board of Directors
National Rifle Association of America
P.O. Box 651
Newfoundland, NJ 07435
PA Rifle & Pistol Association
Legal Action Department
PO Box 216
Sandy Lake, PA 16145-0216
wuchak
Member
I would stop and buy a soda or something with a credit card as soon as I entered the state so I would have the time of my entry into the state documented. I would also have a copy of the federal statute handy. Just lock everything up like the law says and don't give them a reason to pull you over.
jnojr
Member
That's your problem.
Exactly! You aren't supposed to "defend yourself" there. You might wind up violating the rights of a drug-addicted gangbanger who's entitled to your valuables and your life.
jnojr
Member
If it were me, I'd respond with "If you can't, then who can?" Even if you don't get any useful information, you might at least irritate a few mindless bureaucrats.
- Status
