Trunk Gun: Smart Investment or Bad Idea?

[Claude Clay]

in the time it takes me to type.....

i had what to say re unless you are my neighbor you will plan a trip to the post offfice/bank/shopping or walking the dog differently. in fact, though at the end of the day we will have done similiar chores, we will have gone about it many different ways. encountered different obsticals, road detours that perhaps put us into a 'bad neighborhood' that we had not intended to get off the highway there. if you know the road you will know how to get back on it following the safest path. which is not always as the detour signs have you to go.

so we prepare and also understand that events occure, we give creedance to the 'what-ifs'

the moment i may take to think on something is not from fear but goes to thinking up a 'what-if' and turning loose the sub-concious to work on a plan.

a life long friend ( now in NJ) asked me some time ago, after he'd been mugged and car jacked 3 times--why thes things don't happen to me , 'and you carry a gun and work in the inner city'. took him a long time to understan SA and 'what-if'. heck, even having your keys arranged as you need them on the key ring saves fumbling in the dark.

 

[Sam1911]

I have had my truck broken into and lost cash, ipods, and tools. I still keep all three in my car,

"There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves." --Will Rogers

So...what does that fence feel like, anyway?

 

[happygeek]

Someone's looking at your vehicle and thinking, "piggy-bank."

Very true. I used to think driving a cheap, old, used car was insurance against break ins. After having my 91 Honda Accord I paid $2,000 for and my 98 VW Jetta I paid $3,300 for both broken into in a period of 4 years, I no longer believe that.

It does seem as though driving a manual transmission helps avert the car itself being stolen. Of course that does nothing for whatever is in the car that isn't bolted down.

 

[fireman 9731]

Where I live, criminal behavior is not acceptable. Call it "Mayberry" if you like! If you live in a place where criminal activity is the norm then I contend that the people of that area have accepted a certain amount of criminal activity as acceptable.

Exactly.

So...what does that fence feel like, anyway?

Well, that is at least twice now that you have made condescending remarks to forum members in this thread alone. I guess its becoming the norm for moderators to insult the intelligence of its members. Before you know it, it will be the Sam1911road.org. Thats not a road that I want to travel on... or have guns in my vehicle on.

 

[JustinJ]

My gosh, for this being a "pro-gun" venue I'm surprised how many people are naysayers!

My intent is not to insult your intelligence but i take great exception to comments such as this. The notion that being into guns means i must take a position one way or the other on various issues is absurd. Tribalistic thinking is exactly why our country has become so polarized and adopting positions based on anything other than critical thought is always bad. I'm not saying you are not capable of critical thought. Unfortunately smart people do often forget or simply choose to not think for themselves. I'm not saying your position on this issue is wrong or right only that it should be formed on far more than what you expect to be in line with the gun community.

 

[hang fire]

fireman 9731--Re: #103

That seems to be getting the norm for more and more sites as of late.

 

[Sam1911]

Well, that is at least twice now that you have made condescending remarks to forum members in this thread alone. I guess its becoming the norm for moderators to insult the intelligence of its members.

If you feel I've insulted you or anyone else, I deeply apologize. Sometimes it is hard to say what needs saying in plain language without bruising the sensibilities of someone else, as I'm sure you'll agree. I also forgive you for whatever slight you may have unintentionally delivered by implying that the rest of us are cowardly or not involved in our community if we do not live where you live or see the world through the same lenses you do. Or by stating that we were somehow not upholding the RKBA because we choose not to leave our firearms in vulnerable, unattended locations.

Fair enough?

If my comment to taraquain seemed too cutting or harsh (in response to his comment that he's lost thousands of dollars to, and given up guns to, criminals by leaving them in a vehicle -- but that he'll go right ahead doing the same thing) I'll merely say that I did not make the statements that call his intelligence (wisdom, actually) into question, he did. And to point out the irony that Mr. Will Rogers didn't seem to have a category for folks who do the same thing even after they've been burned in a sensitive way.

 

[gp911]

I'm with the group that sees it as impractical for defense, but useful in a survival scenario like sliding your vehicle off the road and into a ravine in bad weather. If I still lived in the country I would keep a single shot shotgun or .22 in the survival kit. It's highly unlikely that I would need a gun in that scenario either, but more likely than me getting into some sort of altercation where digging in the trunk was preferable to driving away. No offense meant to those that believe otherwise though, we all have our reasons.

 

[Neverwinter]

My intent is not to insult your intelligence but i take great exception to comments such as this. The notion that being into guns means i must take a position one way or the other on various issues is absurd. Tribalistic thinking is exactly why our country has become so polarized and adopting positions based on anything other than critical thought is always bad. I'm not saying you are not capable of critical thought. Unfortunately smart people do often forget or simply choose to not think for themselves. I'm not saying your position on this issue is wrong or right only that it should be formed on far more than what you expect to be in line with the gun community.

I was going to post something like this.

Sent using Tapatalk 2

 

[Sam1911]

...but useful in a survival scenario like sliding your vehicle off the road and into a ravine in bad weather. If I still lived in the country I would keep a single shot shotgun or .22 in the survival kit.

Ahh, now we're getting back to my question from the first page:

I certainly can appreciate firesky's comment about a very basic break-action shotgun in part of a wilderness survival kit, though I'm still not sure I find it very critical. I mean, his reason for establishing a survival kit was a friend who was stranded -- for two days. You can survive FAR longer than that without eating anything at all. Seems a can of SPAM, a pack of durable chocolate bars, or a couple MREs would be much better use of the space.

Deep wilderness survival generally doesn't hinge on firearms, but on WATER primarily, then after several days without, minimalist emergency rations may become valued. Longer stretches of time would speak to a need for the ability to identify edible plants, catch fish, snare small game. Hunting involving firearms seems like a survival skill that most realistically comes into play in the very long term -- like putting up food for survival over a season or more.

Seems to me that vehicle-emergency survival is quite likely to require first aid, signal devices, warm clothing (and/or other shelter/warmth items) if in winter, and water. Someone having a vehicle-related emergency is likely to be injured. If they are stranded out of immediate sight of the road, their next most critical need is to get back to the road and/or civilization, or to signal for someone to find them. I don't know how many drivers are stranded in the continental US each year that are not located within (let's say) one day, but it sure isn't very many. And you can go without food for weeks without suffering any long-term ill effects.

So, it seems to me that a vehicle survival kit may be a great idea, but the stuff I'd put in it would almost certainly not include a firearm for killing game. If we say we normally do have a concealed weapon on our persons, then in the really, REALLY unlikely confluence of events that we're both a) stranded near our vehicles but not immediately rescuable, and b) accosted by any person or thing desiring to harm us, we've already got that covered without going to a stashed long-gun of some kind.

Meaning no disrespect to anyone (just prompting critical thinking) including a firearm seems like a knee-jerk idea -- it's a "survival kit" so it has to have a gun. I just haven't yet heard of a reason WHY it does.

 

[armoredman]

It's illegal to have a firearm or ammo on most NASA installations,

I did not know that. There are also no NASA installations in Arizona I am aware of, unless Kitt Peak Observatory falls under that? I went there last about 25 years ago.

BTW, for the federal land thing, the new thing to save our beleaguered Pots Office is the contract post office - these are NOT on federal land. Mine is in a gym.

 

[22-rimfire]

Meaning no disrespect to anyone (just prompting critical thinking) including a firearm seems like a knee-jerk idea -- it's a "survival kit" so it has to have a gun. I just haven't yet heard of a reason WHY it does.

Honestly, I think including a firearm in your survival kit is more pyschological than anything else. A long gun would certainly aid in wild game purcurement. More than anything else, fire, shelter, and water are the keys to short term survival. However a good knife does come in real handy which is why I do indeed keep a knife in my pocket all the time and a shot machete (at least) in my vehicles.

I think more than anything else, keeping long guns in your vehicle is a macho thing unless you have a frequent need for its use (and that is not against people or defensive). If you want to keep a long gun in your vehicle, go for it.

 

[nickn10]

Same exact thing could be said for leaving a loaded gun unlocked in your nightstand with kids in the home. It wasn't too long ago that that was perfectly legal too (in some states it is illegal to store a gun in a place easily accessible by children).

In both cases, there is a risk/benefit. Most people would say that the risk of a child hurting himself with a gun outweighs the benefit of leaving it loaded and unlocked to thwart crime, such that they put it in a bionic safe or quick-access safe. In the case of a trunk gun, the question is if the financial and moral risk outweighs the potential self defense benefit. Clearly, both cases illustrate that there is a stark difference between legal gun ownership and responsible gun ownership.


No kids in my home, never had any, to assume irresponsibility on my part is impolite of you. Stop thinking negative characteristics exist in in people you don't know. Unless that is the type of people you associate with. I'll quote a oft used hominy, " I'd rather have a gun I don't need than not have a gun when I need it" I guess I'm not "most people" as used in your reply. Thank You, Nick

 

[firesky101]

Sam1911,

You are correct, I cannot think of a likely scenario where I would use the firearm. It was just a cheap and compact gun so I keep it there for the things I cannot think of. That being said the rest of the stuff stashed around the spare is much more likely to be used. I am thinking of adding one of those pop tents that fold up all flat.

 

[flip888]

I have a saiga ak74 that i keep hidden in my jeep because i like to go shooting after work if occasion allows. I think keeping a rifle in your vehicle in case of self defense needs is irrational. I just keep it there because i use it a lot.

 

[jrdolall]

I can't think of a single reason why a single shot 20g in the back of my gun safe could be used for defense. I would have to move several semi's to get to it. I still keep one there.

 

[taraquian]

Sam1911; for the record I took no offense to your comment...as a matter of fact it kind of tingles

For my job I have to carry all my tools, I am very aware of where I park andmake sure the doors are locked andnothing is visible. If thieves getmy box I am out several grand with or without a gunin it. I used to drive all through the desert and have needed to put down a few critters, some for kindness and some for fun. Guns are tools and tools go in a toolbox right?

 

[DAP90]

Curious...did they leave the van unlocked? Were the keys in it?

The van was unlocked and the keys in the ignition. There were 3-4 guns left there at the end of a hunting day plus a gun or two that were permanently stored in the car.

I’m not defending the practice but they, like others, felt safe from theft. It’s over a mile to the next house. They know everyone. It’s small town. You get the picture.

It goes to show that nowhere is completely safe. Certainly they took fewer precautions that many on here would but they never thought they needed to. For most of us there’s a good chance our car will be broken into or stolen at some point in our lives. I rather not list a gun amongst the items stolen if I can make it a bit harder by not leaving it in there full time.

 

[19-3Ben]

I'm almost afraid to ask but what SHTF do people envision where things go from everyday normal to battle in the streets over the course of a normal drive to or from home?

Aside from rioting, as already mentioned in a previous post, remember what happened in Mumbai a few years ago?

I do not leave a gun in my car, but can understand why one might want to.

edit to add:
per Sam's post:

Seems to me that vehicle-emergency survival is quite likely to require first aid, signal devices, warm clothing (and/or other shelter/warmth items) if in winter, and water.

This is the sort of thing I carry, along with a flashlight and spare batteries, rope, paracord, multitool, duct tape, and a few other very basic sort of things that can come in handy.

 

[holdencm9]

No kids in my home, never had any, to assume irresponsibility on my part is impolite of you. Stop thinking negative characteristics exist in in people you don't know. Unless that is the type of people you associate with. I'll quote a oft used hominy, " I'd rather have a gun I don't need than not have a gun when I need it" I guess I'm not "most people" as used in your reply. Thank You, Nick

You clearly missed the point. You said (something along the lines) that because something is legal that is enough reason for you to keep a gun in your vehicle. I was simply making a point that because something is legal doesn't mean it is responsible.

I don't know you or your life situation, but I will say this IMHO: For me and people in my situation (living in a city > 300,000, metropolitan area ~ 3 million, commuting to work 5 days a week, as well as driving for errands and entertainment) keeping a trunk gun IS irresponsible. Any gun kept in a car 24/7 is far more likely to be stolen and and possibly used in a crime, than it will be used in self defense.

Again, it seems your opinion on this matter depends a lot your perception of various risks, past experience, and level of guilt you'd be willing to accept if a gun got stolen.

I have never been a victim of violent crime, but have had my cars broken into several times, and I would NOT be okay with any of my guns ending up in the hands of criminals. Now, just because I haven't been a victim of violent crime yet, doesn't mean I don't believe it can happen to me, so I do carry almost every day. But I just don't see how a gun in my trunk is ever going to save my skin.

Unless of course I am in the mall with my family when a mad man goes on a shooting spree with body armor, and I am able to escape to the parking lot but my family is still trapped inside, so I grab my trusty AK out of my trunk and go back in to save them. [/sarcasm off]

Survival guns, in rural areas, maybe make more sense, but unless you are REALLY in the middle of nowhere and plan to be lost for several weeks, I can think of about 100 things I'd rather have in my trunk than a gun.

 

[Deltaboy1984]

A firearm in your auto is just another tool in your tool box.

 

[Inebriated]

I keep a G21 in the glove, and bring it in every night...

And when I do my Draco SBR build, I'll have to figure a spot for it.

 

[nickn10]

You clearly missed the point. You said (something along the lines) that because something is legal that is enough reason for you to keep a gun in your vehicle. I was simply making a point that because something is legal doesn't mean it is responsible.

I don't know you or your life situation, but I will say this IMHO: For me and people in my situation (living in a city > 300,000, metropolitan area ~ 3 million, commuting to work 5 days a week, as well as driving for errands and entertainment) keeping a trunk gun IS irresponsible. Any gun kept in a car 24/7 is far more likely to be stolen and and possibly used in a crime, than it will be used in self defense.

Again, it seems your opinion on this matter depends a lot your perception of various risks, past experience, and level of guilt you'd be willing to accept if a gun got stolen.

I have never been a victim of violent crime, but have had my cars broken into several times, and I would NOT be okay with any of my guns ending up in the hands of criminals. Now, just because I haven't been a victim of violent crime yet, doesn't mean I don't believe it can happen to me, so I do carry almost every day. But I just don't see how a gun in my trunk is ever going to save my skin.

Unless of course I am in the mall with my family when a mad man goes on a shooting spree with body armor, and I am able to escape to the parking lot but my family is still trapped inside, so I grab my trusty AK out of my trunk and go back in to save them. [/sarcasm off]

Survival guns, in rural areas, maybe make more sense, but unless you are REALLY in the middle of nowhere and plan to be lost for several weeks, I can think of about 100 things I'd rather have in my trunk than a gun.

I live in rural Colorado. I retired from the Colorado Dept of Corrections! I probably have a better sense of what happens when unprepared people have an unfortunate experience with a determined criminal. I would feel no more guilt if a handgun (which is my "trunk gun") was used by a criminal in a crime than if my vehicle was used as a get a way car. I have walked into an armed robbery (as a customer) and also had a gun pulled on me by my ex's drunken boyfriend. No shots fired, no heroics just stayed calm and didn't escalate, lucky I guess.

<deleted>

 

[JEB]

i voted "no way" but not so much because of theft; im more worried that as it is baking in the heat and choking on gravel dust, that it will rust up something terrible.

 

[jrdolall]

The reason we need gun control is so that guns will not fall into the wrong hands so we should limit the access people have to legal firearms in order to limit the access crooks have to illegal firearms. Just ask the anti gun crowd if you don't believe it.

If leaving a gun in a locked car is irresponsible then isn't leaving a gun in a locked house irresponsible? Isn't it irresponsible to carry a gun in a bad neighborhood because you are much more likely to be mugged or killed and then the gun you are carrying will end up in the hands of a crook? In all of these situations it is possible that a crook could wind up in possession of your gun and could use that gun in the commission of a crime. If someone breaks into your house and steals a gun do you feel responsible if he uses that gun in a crime? I probably would. I would also feel bad if they stole my car and it was used in a hit-and-run crime or rammed into another car injuring people.
Crooks are crooks and that is what they do. Choosing whether or not to be a gun owner is a personal choice. Keeping your guns in a $5,000 safe, an $89 safe, a bedside stand, in a closet, under your pillow, in your car, over the fireplace, loaded or unloaded,etc, is a choice we all make based on our particular circumstances. I personally do not keep a round in the chamber except in the gun I have in my pocket. This is because I don't want a kid, I have 2 kids at home, to pick up a gun and shoot it accidentally and I don't want ME to shoot it accidentally. I realize that in a SD/HD situation it will require an extra second to be ready to fire and that second could cost me my life. I have decided that it is worth that second to be just a little bit safer. I have also decided that, based on my circumstances, it is acceptable to keep a gun in my truck 24/7. It could get stolen tonight. I know that and I accept the responsibility.