Two Pepper Sprayed Over Phone Call At Fla. Movie

[Wildalaska]

I'm sure that we will have another post from WonderNine acknowleding the fact that 1. the cop could very well be in the right and 2. that his prior bloviating was premature.

Nope wont happen...when someone TRULY beleives something no amount of facts will dissuade them.

Thats why we have alien abductions, "Holy Blood Holy Grail" and all the other "facts" that fit a certain weltanshauung.

With all due repsect to WonderNine, check out the web sites in his sig and then evaluate his posts.

WildandbtwpolicemisconductdoesoccurinthisworldjustnoteverytimeAlaska

 

[flatrock]

It seems pretty obvious that we don't have all the details on this incident.

It's possible that this was one of the rare officers that have way too much ego, and react very poorly to anyone questioning thier actions.

However, if you're phone audibly during a movie, expect to be thrown out. At the theater I go to they ask you to turn off your cell phones when they start running the previews.

If you have a phone with a vibrate mode and get an important phone call you need to take, then get it in the lobby. Examples of this might be a parent getting a call from a babysitter, or a doctor getting a call. Don't try and take the call while in your seat and talk quietly, you're disturbing those around you, and should have the common sense to realize that you don't have the right to do so.

If you break the rules and are asked to leave, don't expect a refund, don't argue that you weren't disturbing others, if you weren't the person asking you to leave wouldn't be asking.

As for the witnesses saying the couple wasn't doing anything wrong. It's possibly the truth and the cop deserves to be properly disciplined and possibly sued. However, if the reporter was looking for someone to say it was all the cops fault, they usually don't have trouble finding such "witnesses" in a croud of people.

 

[hillbilly]

And I knew it, I just knew it....

Somebody would start equating carrying a cell phone with carrying a gun.

Cell phones ain't guns. Guns ain't cell phones.

Just out of curiosity, how many people who are reading this thread have experienced the following?

1) You movie watching is ruined by some idiot whose cell phone rings.

2) Your movie watching is ruined by some idiot who pulls out his or her CCW gun and starts firing random shots into the ceiling.


If we started having a problem with idiots firing their CCW handguns into the movie theater ceilings, how many of the posters on this thread would complain about those idiots, and decry those idiots for making all gun owners and CCW holders look like irresponsible morons?

And to be honest, no I don't have kids.

But I used to be a kid, and my parents were able to leave me with a sitter, or even alone at home and not be tethered to me at all moments via a cell phone because cell phones didn't exist back then.

And incredibly, I seemed to have survived not being cell-phone tethered or pager-tethered at all times.

And when I do have kids, I will be able to go to the movie for two hours and leave them with a sitter and not be tethered to them via a cell phone for those two hours.

Heck, I'll probably even let my kids do what my parents let me do....go walking around in the woods for half a day or more with no cell phone or walkie-talkie, or satellite tracking chip embedded in them.

hillbilly

 

[MP5]

Are you saying that you absolutely cannot leave the cell phone in the car for the two hours or so that a movie lasts, and that you absolutely have to be constantly cell-phone tethered at all moments, including the two hours that a movie lasts?

I've gotten by fine without owning a cell phone or pager. The world won't fall to pieces just because you're not carrying a phone around for a couple hours. ER doctors and the like need these tools for genuine emergencies, but most people just seem to gab on them at inopportune times.

 

[Warren]

What about text messaging? Would that be cool to do as long as there were no beeps coming from the phone?

Would the light of the screen be an annoyance?

 

[Ransom]

Nope wont happen...when someone TRULY beleives something no amount of facts will dissuade them.

from the first article:

Marcia Gray, a 49-year-old Tampa accountant, was in the lobby when the couple were pepper sprayed.

"The man turned and asked the officer why he was making them leave and the cop just maced him in the face," Gray said. "They weren't yelling or touching him. The man bent over and the girl asked why he maced her boyfriend. Then the cop maced her, and she dropped her soda."

from the second article:

A police report released Tuesday sharply contradicts the accounts of Warronnica Harris and Terrell "KC" Tolson, as well as two witnesses, who claim Officer John Douglas acted without provocation when he used pepper spray to subdue the couple in the hallway of the theater.

Why is the second article all of a sudden the gospel? Its just the police report and gets the officers side of it. Each person involved is going to make themselves look innocent but when you have witnesses that had nothing to do with the whole thing contradicting the cop it makes the cops story look really bad.

 

[jnojr]

Heck, I was on call this weekend and went to the movies. However, I am a courteous patron and kept my pager on vibrate so as not to disturb anyone else if I got paged (a shame that could not be said of the senior-citizen couple behind me who insisted on maintaining a steady conversation for the duration of the film, finally forcing me to move before I made unkind comments to my elders).

You don't need to "make unkind comments". Just turn around and say "Excuse me... I paid to see a movie, not hear you yack on your phone. Please turn it off or leave." Call management if they don't do one or the other immediately. You will get a resounding cheer from everyone else in the theater... or, at least, those who aren't on cell phones.

Me, I turn my cell off if I go into a movie.

 

[MP5]

Why is the second article all of a sudden the gospel? Its just the police report and gets the officers side of it. Each person involved is going to make themselves look innocent but when you have witnesses that had nothing to do with the whole thing contradicting the cop it makes the cops story look really bad.

Authority tends to do whatever it can to maintain its authority.

 

[Ransom]

Authority tends to do whatever it can to maintain its authority.

The witnesses are being rubbed out as we speak.

 

[sendec]

And further more.....

Have you ever noticed that everyone wants to carry a cell/pager/blackberry/portable smoke signal unit, until they are required to do it? As soon as the boss either demands it, or like an idiot you let slip that you have one and he/she should use it whenever, thats when it ain't so cool no more. I ditch mine every chance I get.

For the terminally dense or utterly humorless, the previous should not be construed as a "fact" but is instead a social commentary representing the author's personal opinion based on his observations of public behavior in American, Carribean, and Brazilian societies. Any relationship to persons living or dead is coinidental. George Bush did not approve, dissaprove or have any knowledge of this ad. Cut the blue wire. No animals were harmed in the making of this post.

I love the smell of OC in the movies.......it smells like, victory.

 

[jnojr]

That some of you feel that your $7 entertainment is more important than someone's family being able to reach them in an emergency is absolutely vile. I'm not saying they should hold a conversation there, but if some dad takes a call from his babysitter who is telling him that his kid is on the way to the doctor and you give him grief?

Put phone on vibrate mode. Phone vibrates. Get up and walk out of the theater, then talk.

Yes, the entertainment I paid for is more important to me than you yakking on your phone. If there's a terrible emergency with your kid, then the caller should be dialling 911. Where do we draw the line? You getting an "on call" call from your work? You closing a $10,000,000 deal? What does any of that have to do with me? Nothing. There is no valid justification for you ruining everyone elses movie, and suggesting that you're so important that you must be able to talk on the phone while 200 other people try to watch a movie is selfish, if not quite "vile".

Put phone on vibrate mode. Phone vibrates. Get up and walk out of the theater, then talk.

 

[Brad Johnson]

That some of you feel that your $7 entertainment is more important than someone's family being able to reach them in an emergency is absolutely vile.

Nope, we feel that the call taker/maker is an inconsiderate ass who finds it necessary to disrupt several hundred other paying patrons' entertainment as a result of an unwillingness to get off their damn lazy butt and step into the lobby to take a phone call.

I carry a cell phone AND pager. Both are set to silent, all the time. As a real estate agent I get calls and pages 24/7. My ability to communicate directly impacts my income, so I try and take every call no matter where I may be. However, I am also considerate enough to get up off my rather ample rear end and walk to the lobby or a private area when I receive a call during a movie or entertainment event. Any feeble explanation to the contrary would be an inconsiderate excuse for being a lackadaisical jackass who is so wrapped up in himself that he would knowingly and willingly impose upon others an unnecessary interruption of their comfort and enjoyment.

Brad

 

[MJRW]

"Yes, the entertainment I paid for is more important to me than you yakking on your phone. If there's a terrible emergency with your kid, then the caller should be dialling 911."

Oops, that almost looks like that is the question I asked. You're playing a worthless and transparent game here. What I said doesn't preclude or exclude anyone calling 911 prior to parental notification. I never said they should hold lengthy conversations or even suggest it. Where the line ends I don't care about because on the right side of the line is that you can miss 15 seconds of a movie for pops to answer the phone that he told the sitter to call only in case of emergency and say "I'm on my way."

Hillbilly,

They aren't equatable in any sense that you've provided.

"1) You movie watching is ruined by some idiot whose cell phone rings.

2) Your movie watching is ruined by some idiot who pulls out his or her CCW gun and starts firing random shots into the ceiling."

Hmm...one just irritates some people, another does physical damage and endangers people. I WONDER WHICH OF THESE IS DOESN'T FIT? Let me go ask Stephen Freaking Hawkings.

MJRW: Mr. Hawkings, someone has suggested that a cell phone ringing is akin to firing shots into a theater ceiling.
Stephen Freaking Hawkings: That person's comparison and analogy creation abilities are lost forever in a black hole. Further, the latter is actually illegal unless possibly there are is an Al Quaeda-Alien hybrid crawling around up there which is unlikely.
MJRW: Thank you, Stephen Freaking Hawkings.

You may have gotten along fine before there were cell phones, but people also didn't carry guns before there were guns and they seemed to get along fine. But availability of superior tools means that we can go ahead and use those superior tools. And if watching Shrek is so remarkably important to you that you simply couldn't be disturbed by mom or dad answering the phone because they want to be able to enjoy the movie, too, without worrying about being unable to be contacted for too long, you've got way too much attachment to the silver screen and overpriced popcorn.

 

[Bartholomew Roberts]

Each person involved is going to make themselves look innocent but when you have witnesses that had nothing to do with the whole thing contradicting the cop it makes the cops story look really bad.

You have two witnesses that contradict the cop, at least one of whom is a friend of the person being arrested (i.e. not meeting the "nothing to do with the whole thing" criteria).

You have yet another witness (usher) who supports the cop's version of events exactly.

 

[flatrock]

If you set your phone on vibrate, and politely take an important call in the lobby, you might find that the movie theater managment would be willing to allow you to catch the next showing of the movie or maybe even give you a pass to use to see the movie at a different time.

They are under no obligation to do so, but I've found that if you act like a polite and responsible person, managment in places like that are often willing to treat you well in response.

If you act rudely, you're likely going to be asked to leave.

I'm surprised that they were only charged with disorderly conduct, and the woman how hit the security guard with her soda wasn't charged with assault.

The fact that the security guard is an off duty officer doesn't really seem relavant in this situation. It does show that officers don't get paid a reasonable amount and often end up taking side jobs, which seems pretty sad to me.

 

[Gunsnrovers]

If my entire movie watching experience is destroyed by a 30 second phone call from some yahoo 5 seats down, I'm sprung WAY too tight. It's obnoxious. It's annoying. It's rude. If it really wound me up, I could demand a refund. Life will, thankfully, continue. Far more annoying and rude things (and more then likely unsafe things) will happen to me over the course of the day.

 

[nero45acp]

I'm all for seeing rogue cops/feds being sanctioned when they step over the line, but this is a case where you have different witnesses giving very different versions of what happened. Given the maced male's history of assault convictions on a school employee and a law enforcement officer while the cop has a clean 14 year work record, I tend to believe the cop's version.



nero

 

[jpIII]

My wife works as a nurse in the emergency room at one of the local hospitals.

When she is on call, she carries her phone with her 24/7.
She keeps it on silent when at church or the movies etc.
She must answer it regardless of where she is, as it is a matter of life or death, and it also means her job! LITERALLY!

There are some circumstances in which it is acceptable to answer a phone in a movie, but just take the conversation outside.

'nuff said.

 

[WonderNine]

No wonder Drudge posted this story, he knew something that wasn't in the link to the original article.

In the past, I have fought urges to snatch the cell phone away from an idiot and beat him to death with it.


Good Lord, I would personally love to pepper spray some moron who had a phone ring in a movie that I shelled out $7 to see.

Only, I would first gag them so their screams of pain wouldn't further annoy me as I tried to watch the movie.

If you have a personal situation so serious that you need to always carry a phone with you, then you have a personal situation you should be somewhere attending to, not at a movie. - hillbilly

Last time I was in the theater my phone accidently rang while I was trying to figure out how to shut it off. Nobody pepper sprayed me or wanted to kill me. Seek therapy dude.

 

[Matt G]

Wondernine is absolutely right, friends-- making rash decisions and acts for minor annoyances is wrong.

Yep.


Just like, um.... just like. . . just like--- Say, Entitling a thread "Two Pepper Sprayed Over Phone Call At Fla. Movie", when in fact, they were sprayed because they were physically threatening (and even assaulting) a man acting on behalf of the theatre to have them leave.

Note: the "Witnesses" (unnamed, and with no reference to how to find them) from the first story said that the couple 'weren't doing anything wrong.' I gather that they're talking about the couple's actions in the movie theatre viewing area its self. Whether they were or were not doing anything worth being ejected from the theatre (with a refund, no less!) is a civil issue not worth addressing here. We can all agree that a property has the rights to ask someone to leave. As Coronach said, private property rights, remember? We believe in a property owner's right to run their place as they see fit?

So the security agent, who is in fact a cop, takes them outside, and they get beligerent, loud, disruptive, and resist going outside. Threats are made, and he sprays them. The ONLY issue here is whether the spray was an appropriate reaction to their physical resistance and threats.

The cell phone is NOT THE ISSUE!!! I don't care if they were being ejected for wearing purple neckties. Or for putting too much butter on their popcorn. The theatre[*] was putting them out lawfully, and they attacked the theatre's agent. THAT's why they got sprayed.



[*][B.T.W., I have no idea why I'm spelling it "theatre" rather than "theater." But I started writing it that way, so I guess I'll be consistant. Looks pretentious though, doesn't it?]

 

[Coronach]

Why is the second article all of a sudden the gospel?

Actually, its not. If you read further back in the thread I said:

Well, the updated info is the officer's verison of the whole thing. The only way to get to the bottom of it is to look at everything and go through all sides...which will doubtless happen at the defendants' trials and in the inevitable Internal Affairs investigation.

And, keeping a running tally on the supposed witnesses (an accurate list of which, btw, the newspaper does not have)...we have the co-defendants, the co-defendant's friend, and one seemingly uninvolved person, all saying X. We then have the usher and the cop saying Y. So...it looks like they split the difference witht the 'uninvolved' parties.

This is why we have trials. What did each see? How close were they? What biases do they bring to the table? Clearly the witnesses disagree, even the uninvolved ones, but we can't cross-examine them on the internet.

And this:

I'm all for seeing rogue cops/feds being sanctioned when they step over the line, but this is a case where you have different witnesses giving very different versions of what happened. Given the maced male's history of assault convictions on a school employee and a law enforcement officer while the cop has a clean 14 year work record, I tend to believe the cop's version.

pretty much sums up my POV.

The race might not always be to the swift, nor the fight to the strong, but thats the way to bet. The cop might not always be correct, but, given this scenario, its where I'd place my money.

Mike

 

[0007]

One inconsiderate ??????? taking a 30 second call in a theatre might not be a problem, but 20 or 30 or 50 doing so sure as hell is. Go back to the original point about cell-phones. They are an unnecessary techno-toy for 99% of the people who have/use them and the other 1% somehow managed for the hundred years of regular phones before cell phones came along.

It is just me or does this thread appear to have been high-jacked from pepper-spraying to cell-phone bashing??? :

 

[Sportcat]

Here are our dynamic duo...

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/0728041cell1.html

 

[Don Gwinn]

So, if I may be allowed to attempt to sum up, we don't know who to believe here, but we know this:

1. If the OC'ed parties are telling the truth, they were abused by the police officer. No question.

2. If the officer is telling the truth, he was absolutely in the right. No question.


So the deciding factor will be who's telling the truth--which we can't determine here. So why are we still arguing about it?


By the way, those of you getting all worked up about being told not to talk on a cell phone at the movies are cracking me up. It's got nothing to do with being forced to leave your phone home. I carry my cell on vibrate almost all the time as a simple matter of courtesy. It is the very smallest type of "no big deal" known to man.

 

[Mikul]

Sounds like a good spraying to me.

So many people have no consideration for their fellow man. It's sickening. When we make a mistake and are asked to correct it, we should. Instead, people like this are willing to get violent over it. This happens far too frequently: people who are willing to hurt other people so that they can talk with their friend on a phone in the middle of a public theater or so they can go 10mph faster on the highway, etc. These people need a good spraying and more of it. If you can't be act properly in public and you refuse to shape up when politely corrected, you deserve a good face full of condiment.

I have been to the movie theaters one in the last three years, not because I don't want to go, but because whenever I do go there are people having conversations (cell phone and otherwise) using laser-pointers, or otherwise showing off how they can do whatever they want because if somebody does something, the law will protect the cretin.

"I asked him to shut off his cell phone and he wouldn't," should be a valid defense in court.