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UPDATE on the LEO-USAF SP shooting in CA

Discussion in 'Legal' started by RustyShackelford, Feb 28, 2007.

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  1. RustyShackelford

    RustyShackelford member

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    Howdy

    Any members here know any new information about the USAF/OEF veteran who was shot by a LEO in a traffic stop in CA last year. It was recorded on video and became a major news story.

    I wanted to know what went on with that incident.

    Thanks!

    Rusty
     
  2. Autolycus

    Autolycus Member

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    I dont believe anything happened. I think it was ruled a good shoot. I forgot the airments name.
     
  3. duckandcover

    duckandcover Member

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    Actually, he was charged with attempted voluntary manslaughter and it's been slowly working it's way through the court system.

    The Sheriffs Deputy is Ivory Webb and the Airman that was shot is Elio Carrion if you want to Google.
     
  4. El Tejon

    El Tejon Member

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  5. cassandrasdaddy

    cassandrasdaddy Member

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    http://ap.washingtontimes.com/dynamic/stories/A/AIRMAN_SHOOTING?SITE=DCTMS&SECTION=HOME

    On the 40-second video clip, he can be heard swearing at Webb before the deputy tells him to "get up! get up!" Carrion was then shot three times in the chest, left leg and left shoulder.

    Webb's lawyer, Michael Schwartz, has previously suggested that his client might actually have shouted "don't get up!" He has also argued that Webb may have believed Carrion was reaching for a weapon in his jacket pocket as he stood up. Carrion was found to be unarmed.

    During a preliminary hearing, Schwartz played an FBI-enhanced copy of the videotape frame by frame to show Carrion's hand going toward his jacket, a movement that is almost imperceptible when the footage is seen at real speed.
     
  6. oobray

    oobray Member

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    I was unable to find a video on that link. I think they might have removed it.
     
  7. buzz_knox

    buzz_knox Member

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    I can just see the attorney now. "If I told you that he said 'don't get up', will you acquit him? You will? Great! In that case, he said "don't get up! don't get up!"

    The attorney was tossing out a little tidbit to the jury pool, so they'll expect to see something that may or may not exist. Given that witnesses can be heard on the tape telling the officer that he'd instructed the air man to get up before shooting him, I don't think there's much of a chance for this argument.
     
  8. Shovelhead

    Shovelhead Member

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    Update

    Apparently, it is OK in California for a Law Enforcement Officer to issue you a direct order,
    then shoot you for complying with that order.

    http://www.wjla.com/news/stories/0607/435159.html

    Ex-Deputy Cleared in Airman Shooting
    SAN BERNARDINO, Calif. - Thursday June 28, 2007 9:03 pm​


    A sheriff's deputy was acquitted of all charges Thursday in the videotaped shooting of an unarmed Iraq war veteran who was a passenger in a car that crashed after a high-speed police chase. Former San Bernardino County Deputy Ivory J. Webb was found not guilty of attempted voluntary manslaughter and assault with a firearm for opening fire on Elio Carrion, an Air Force senior airman, said Susan Mickey, a district attorney's spokeswoman. Webb, 46, who has since left the department, had faced as many as 18 years in prison if convicted. He hugged his attorney and burst into tears after the verdict was read in San Bernardino County Superior Court.
     
  9. DKSuddeth

    DKSuddeth Member

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    wrong, just wrong on so many levels.
     
  10. hoji

    hoji Member

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    Shut up serf.Avert your eyes when your betters approach.:fire:
     
  11. Deanimator

    Deanimator Member

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    You shouldn't be THAT surprised. Look at the Weems shooting in Chicago. A cop blew an unarmed man's brains out, while standing under a transit company surveillance camera and got a THIRTY DAY SUSPENSION... followed by a promotion to detective...
     
  12. F4GIB

    F4GIB Member

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    At least this civilian wasn't trying to obey the orders of Cop A when shot by Cop B who was shouting conflicting orders. Remember the TOTALLY innocent bystander in Baltimore (well, he did have the audacity to own a red car) who was shot in the face with an M-16 by the FBI agent (former SWAT team member named ... Burda?). In that case, the undercover officer had told his colleagues it was the WRONG car but they went ahead with their fun and games (just for practice?).

    And the Mods wonder why so many civilians are disgusted with the POLICE. Yup, it's real hard to tell the few good ones from the many bad (or at least indifferent) ones.
     
  13. Taxpayer

    Taxpayer member

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    What I have seen on forums where the actions of police are srutinized over actions such as are being discussed here, is that some LEO's will simply be in denial about the actions of a fellow officer and even try to change the direction of the discussion by attacking the person making a remark. One tactic used is to take one statement or sentence of what is said out of context and focus on that to try and take the topic off on a tangent in personal attacks on the persons character.

    Also, I find it odd that police will claim they are no different than mechanics or plumbers or doctors, yet how many times have you been pulled over by one of those professions? Doctors and plumbers do not have police powers.

    Now don't get me wrong, I'm new here and I don't think all police are evil or out to get us, but it seems that you just can't tell in advance if you are dealing with a decent felllow or an out of control person who doesn't care about your rights. It seems that you can't go very long without reading about a LEO on trial for something and or convicted of something. So given that, it does seem that the system is working to weed them out, I just wish it would somehow weed them out before they hurt someone.

    Sorry for taking up so much time with my rambling.:banghead:
     
  14. Elza

    Elza Member

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    Welcome, Taxpayer.

    There are those that do the same thing here as well.
     
  15. Noxx

    Noxx Member

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    This occurred about ten miles from my home, on a street where I used to live, so I've been following it closely.

    In light of the video, how this guy got off is just utterly beyond me. Makes me sick.
     
  16. CountGlockula

    CountGlockula Member

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    OK. Two drunk guys (strike 1) eluding a cop at 100+ mph through a residential area (strike 2)...watching the video of Corrion reached into his jacket/got up... (strike 3)...

    I'm fine with the verdict.

    Why isn't the Corrion guy in jail?
     
  17. cassandrasdaddy

    cassandrasdaddy Member

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    hmmm we have a jury that had the oppurtunity to review all the facts and the tape at length. they come to one verdict then we have the usual suspects from the net read a blog or two see a clip on you tube and they arrive at the RIGHT verdict.....hmmmm whats wrong with this picture.
     
  18. Noxx

    Noxx Member

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    You don't wonder for a moment why the officer told him to get up? Or that the officer filed a report that differed WIDLY from the incident until the video became public, then he backtracked all over himself to get to a more reasonable lie?
     
  19. KLDimond

    KLDimond Member

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    More apologists

    I don't care how fast the Corvette was going, CARRION WASN'T DRIVING!!

    Have you ever tried to get the driver of the car you're in to slow down, when he's doing something stupid? Get real!! What's he supposed to do, take his seatbelt off and climb over the driver and stomp on the brake harder than the driver's stomping on the gas? ACK! You apologists drive me WILD!

    The video was actually quite clear, and it's PLAIN that Webb said, "Ok, get up. Get up!!" At the time of it, I downloaded two or three of the video dubs, which varied amazingly in quality (don't know why...), but there was never any doubt what was said.

    I don't know what possessed the decision here, to acquit Webb. It's a total outrage.

    By the way, folks who deign to argue that the jury is so bleeding smart and above error: what do you think of OJ's not guilty verdict? Maybe the jurors were all police apologists like so many here.

    Now, don't get me wrong; I'm not anti-police. But that fact doesn't make me see a serious, real felony as "boys will be boys." And it sickens me that so many have that feeling.
     
  20. pacodelahoya

    pacodelahoya Member

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    Ah yes, the usual suspects.
     
  21. cassandrasdaddy

    cassandrasdaddy Member

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    During a preliminary hearing, Schwartz played an FBI-enhanced copy of the videotape frame by frame to show Carrion's hand going toward his jacket, a movement that is almost imperceptible when the footage is seen at real speed

    i think this is the snake that bit carion in the butt not that i ever did something like that when i was drinking but if i did it only got me 3 broken fingers
     
  22. buzz_knox

    buzz_knox Member

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    When you enhance videos, digital artifacts can make things appear other than they are.

    Of course, since the officer instructed him to get up (and was there any evidence he said "don't get up" outside the lawyer's attempt to taint the jury with his statement that maybe the officer said it), the concept of furtive movement goes out the window. Was he reaching towards his jacket, or was he moving his hand under his center of gravity to help push himself up?
     
  23. cassandrasdaddy

    cassandrasdaddy Member

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    in don't know i do know that a group of folks had a chance to examin more evidence at greater length than anyone here and came to a conclusion. i'm gonna go out on a limb and say maybe they know more than me about what really happened., though i could be wrong i'm assuming a jury trial... was it? or just a judge?
     
  24. DKSuddeth

    DKSuddeth Member

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    like the OJ trial, right?
     
  25. Lucky

    Lucky Member

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    Wow, good for the FBI. Not only can they snipe pregnant women holding babies, they can also manufacture evidence. Oh, and they can also protect 9/11 hijackers from being arrested and investigated before they do their attack.

    I don't want to be obtuse, but how do you reach into a pocket while getting up without doing a 1-arm push-up? And the guy in the video wasn't doing that.
     
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