Upgrade from 30-06 or use what I have

[westernrover]

I would be totally focused on hunting closer than 500 yards rather than changing anything about the gun. I hunt in the Great Basin where the mountains are high and the canyons are wide-open. There are elk and bighorn and mountain goats, but the tags are scarce compared to Mule Deer and Pronghorn. I've definitely seen opportunities for 500 yard shots -- every season. My rifle happens to be one of those belted magnums that would easily make the shot (and I don't doubt that .30-06 could do it just as well) -- my marksmanship in those conditions, I would not boast to be so sure. Because those opportunities to apply the killer-gear force multiplier are not that rare, I seek the rarer more precious opportunities when my skill, wit, and fortune allow me to get closer to 200 yards. I have hunted with a bow and closed to under 30 yards in different terrain (different state), but to ensure success with a bow in the land where I am now, I'd need to dedicate more time to hunting than I am able. A 500 yard shot? I have more than a three-day weekend to do better than that.

 

[Bill Raby]

I would practice getting closer than 500 yards instead of shooting at 500 yards. Even if you can do fine hitting targets at that range, taking a shot at game that far just comes off as irresponsible. There are plenty of people out there that can get an elk with arrows. Seems like when someone wants to be more successful at hunting they put the time and money into being able to take longer shots and totally ignore getting better at HUNTING.

 

[Rubone]

I kill an elk about every two years depending on the draw and conditions. Imay get three in a row and then get skunked a couple years. Cows mostly for meat, I could care less about trophies. My rifle of choice is an older Ruger 77 MKII 300WM but in the past I have used many others, the most prominent being my old 25-06 Remington 700 BDL which took a lot of game. I don't go for any long shots, most Elk I kill are around 200 yds or so, and contrary to most beliefs are killed mid day. Lots of my friends use 7mm, and I'm sure my .Remington 700SPS 270WSM would do a fine job, although I would not hesitate a bit to take my 30-06 Ruger MKII "Sporter" out there. For whatever reason it is my designated Deer rifle. Nice little buck with the 30-06. The point being, all are capable, work within your comfort level!


And a nice Cow with the 300WM


Antelope with .270WSM

 

[Okie_Poke]

I say keep your ‘06 and get really good with it. If you’re itching to spend money, put a new scope or stock or trigger on it. My suspicion is you’ll practice more with your ‘06 than you will a magnum mule, both because of recoil and because of ammo cost. Hopefully after you’ve put in all the time getting good out to 500 you’ll get a 75 yard chip shot next year.

 

[Omaha-BeenGlockin]

The .30-06 is the biggest I care to shoot these days and probably more often will take my .270------got tired of being beaten to death by the big magnums.

If you are really wanting something for extreme range, look into the .257 or .270 Weatherby's-----will really reach out there with less recoil than the others not saying it won't be harsh but less than the bigger ones-----and you'll have to pay for it since none of those are cheap.

 

[WisBorn]

In my opinion a 500 yard maximum is a good choice. The 30-06 will do it, but the 300 mags and 7mm mags will do it better.

I have not tried the PRC's, but I agree with @LoonWulf if you want to stay with a 30 the 300WM or 300prc are good choices.
If you are concerned about rifle weight and recoil you may want to consider the 300wsm or 7mm Rem Mag or 7mm PRC.

Of the guns I own/owned if I was looking through the scope at a bull elk 500 yards away I would want my long traded away A-Bolt 300WM with the Boss. Second choice is my favorite Weatherby MarkV ultra lightweight 7mm Rem Mag. I wouldn't shoot if I had any of the 3 30-06 rifles that I have owned.

Please note that I have never hunted elk, but have shot many whitetails with 30-06, 300wsm, 300WM, 308win, 7rm and other cartridges. When the distance increases I want a magnum....

 

[lysanderxiii]

Don't fall into the trap of muzzle energy down range because Native American Indians were using bow and arrow successfully without worrying about muzzle energy.

Not necessarily disagreeing with you about the .30-06 for elk at 500 yards, but Native Americans were not shooting bows and arrows at elk at extreme ranges. There is a limit to the range that a cartridge is reliably lethal, and that includes the probability of improper point of impact.

 

[Risky buisness]

I congratulate you on your decision not to shoot at a distance your not familiar or comfortable with. I see many examples of folks believing simply because they get a new super yahoo 6.5, 7 something or .34 boomer, that it automatically makes that game animal ' within range'. Nothing is further from the truth. I saw earlier in the comments folks mentioning that, saving the $$ on a new rifle/ optics and purchasing ammunition and getting lot more practice with your .30-06 is a good idea. I concur, their is something that is oft times missed with these discussions, that of training. Their are quite a few locations where one can aquire wind estimation, ranging techniques, optics enhancment opportunities, and shooting at range from something other than a bench that may well be worth your time as well.

 

[Bill Raby]

Not necessarily disagreeing with you about the .30-06 for elk at 500 yards, but Native Americans were not shooting bows and arrows at elk at extreme ranges. There is a limit to the range that a cartridge is reliably lethal, and that includes the probability of improper point of impact.

They were not shooting arrows at extreme ranges because they actually knew how to hunt. Today people know how to spend lots of money on fancy gear and hit targets at 500 yards. But they don't know anything at all about hunting. Seems like people don't know the difference between hunting and target shooting anymore.

 

[Hugger-4641]

but the 300 Winchester will rattle your teeth and knock some filling loose.

Can't disagree with 30-06 being more than adequate, but can't agree with this either. Some of the uber light models do thump you, but both of my 300wm have less recoil than my 30-06's.

At 500yds, the 30-06 is gonna drop about 4 1/2 feet (55") vs the 300wm will drop closer to 3 feet (38"). So you are going to have to put the time and practice in with either one if you want to to make a 500yd shot.

 

[sabbfan]

They were not shooting arrows at extreme ranges because they actually knew how to hunt. Today people know how to spend lots of money on fancy gear and hit targets at 500 yards. But they don't know anything at all about hunting. Seems like people don't know the difference between hunting and target shooting anymore.

I agree that closer is better and it is hunting, not target shooting. At home I’m successful every year with whitetail with both a 44 mag Henry and a 44 mag SRH revolver with shots rarely over 100 yards. On the flip side when I travel over 10 hours and spend thousands on an elk hunt in unfamiliar territory it’s nice to be able to take game at longer but not extreme ranges instead of coming home with no meat in the freezer.

 

[jmr40]

At 500yds, the 30-06 is gonna drop about 4 1/2 feet (55") vs the 300wm will drop closer to 3 feet (38").

Which is completely irrelevant with modern optics and an accurate range finder. With either one you're going to have to compensate for drop. The 300 needs to come up about 2.5 mils, the 30-06 about 2.9. That's 4 more clicks on the scope turret.

What you need to be concerned about is enough impact velocity to get bullet expansion, about 1800 fps is the suggested minimum. The 300 with a good 180 gr high BC bullet will still be hitting at about 2100 fps, the 30-06 about 2000.

 

[Hugger-4641]

Which is completely irrelevant with modern optics and an accurate range finder. With either one you're going to have to compensate for drop. The 300 needs to come up about 2.5 mils, the 30-06 about 2.9. That's 4 more clicks on the scope turret.

What you need to be concerned about is enough impact velocity to get bullet expansion, about 1800 fps is the suggested minimum. The 300 with a good 180 gr high BC bullet will still be hitting at about 2100 fps, the 30-06 about 2000.

Nice of you to clip part of my post and ignore the last sentence.

So you are going to have to put the time and practice in with either one if you want to to make a 500yd shot.

 

[Hugger-4641]

Which is completely irrelevant with modern optics and an accurate range finder.

I'll return the favor. Modern optics will not compensate for lack of practice and familiarity with your equipment.

 

[45/30-06OKIE]

7 PRC

DO IT

Why not 6.5 PRC? 150gr SMK at the speed of light lol. I still haven't chronographed them yet. I have shot groups at 25 yards and half way shot groups at like 70 yards. I need to go out to Fouled Bore in Ninnekah OK and shoot at longer range...

 

[GooseGestapo]

The problem with 500yds isn’t the bullet drop!
My 24” .30/06 runs 3,000fps with a 165gr bullet w/RL17., my 7mmMag does 3,100fps with a 26”bbl and RL22.
Not enough difference in drop with a 300yd zero to make a significant difference.
Especially since the 7mm weighs 10lbs vs 6+ for the ‘06…

Consider that my chance on a cow elk came at 150yds! But it was a challenging shot through the aspen saplings, off hand, uphill!

I’m fortunate to have the CMP Talladega 600yd range accessible, and I have regularly shot my NM AR15, @ 200,300, and 600. Also got to corroborate my ‘06 zero.
Problem is; will it match at 500yds; at 9,000’ elevation and 15degF vs 80deg @ 700’?
And will bullets expand at 500yds?
WIND DRIFT?

Final question! Are you hunting on foot, and how far away is the truck?
Day before the 150yd shot, I had opportunity to shoot similar or same elk at 400yds (lased, you do own a laser range finder with 500yd capability?)

My brother who lives in NV looking through the spotting scope, said don’t do it!. It would have taken us three days to pack it out!!!


This was where elk was standing, looking at me @400yds


This is where I was sitting, slung up, safety off, finger on trigger. Elk was standing broadside In open area just left of the pine tree on crest of ridge…
We were three miles by GPS from the truck! (Straight line).
I’m 65 at the time, he was 61…

 

[ms6852]

Can't disagree with 30-06 being more than adequate, but can't agree with this either. Some of the uber light models do thump you, but both of my 300wm have less recoil than my 30-06's.

At 500yds, the 30-06 is gonna drop about 4 1/2 feet (55") vs the 300wm will drop closer to 3 feet (38"). So you are going to have to put the time and practice in with either one if you want to to make a 500yd shot.

When it comes to the 300 Winchester it is a sweet caliber for long shots, in my opinion hard to beat. I've always wondered if I ever bought a rifle for long distance shooting if I would go with a 7mm magnum or the 300, and the answer was always the 300. Being a practical man that I am I never bought it since I already had the 30-06 that would kill anything in North America and I never planned to hunt anything that could eat me for a snack. The 300 is a flat shooter no doubt about that, and for me it did rattle my teeth.

 

[ms6852]

Not necessarily disagreeing with you about the .30-06 for elk at 500 yards, but Native Americans were not shooting bows and arrows at elk at extreme ranges. There is a limit to the range that a cartridge is reliably lethal, and that includes the probability of improper point of impact.

Was not inferring that they were shot at 500 yards, just the the arrow does not have that much muzzle energy. Should have written it better.

 

[C-grunt]

Id upgrade to a better optic (assuming you dont already have a really nice one) with good turrets and a laser range finder. I think that would be a better investment.

 

[JeeperCreeper]

Why not 6.5 PRC? 150gr SMK at the speed of light lol. I still haven't chronographed them yet. I have shot groups at 25 yards and half way shot groups at like 70 yards. I need to go out to Fouled Bore in Ninnekah OK and shoot at longer range...

I only shoot 7 PRC because they don't make a 7.5 PRC haha jk, clearly.

I think the 6.5 PRC is a great option since ammo, components, and rifles are already out there.

I'd get the 6.5 if I didn't already have a Creedmoor, and the 7 PRC is just different enough when the market gets more saturated in time

 

[45/30-06OKIE]

I only shoot 7 PRC because they don't make a 7.5 PRC haha jk, clearly.

I think the 6.5 PRC is a great option since ammo, components, and rifles are already out there.

I'd get the 6.5 if I didn't already have a Creedmoor, and the 7 PRC is just different enough when the market gets more saturated in time

Yeah wait till Lapua makes 7 PRC brass, cause their 6.5 PRC brass is top notch!

 

[LimaCharlie]

If I only had one rifle, it would be a 30-06. It can be loaded for varmints to anything in North America depending on distance.

 

[Peakbagger46]

In my opinion, the ‘06 is the quintessential elk rifle with more than enough energy at 500y, not to mention a good balance of sectional density and frontal diameter. Pick a good 180g bonded bullet with a decent bc and practice at distance. That being said, 500 is a long ways for any hunting arm.

You mentioned hunting Colorado. I live here and rifle elk seasons with the over the counter bull tags are very low success rate hunts and are kind of a money making tool for parks and wildlife. If I were you I’d look elsewhere or start putting in for points for a limited draw area.

 

[Peakbagger46]

30-06 has plenty of power for elk at 500 yards , just make sure you are using a good , accurate bullet . Past 350-400 yards you have to deal with trajectory no matter what your shooting , from a 300-378 to a 45-70 .What the trajectory is is not important . KNOWING what YOUR trajectory is , is vital . Good optics are your best investment if you want to be able to make a long range shot .

Well said. Also wind becomes a major issue past 400 in my experience shooting paper (I haven’t shot past 320 on game as I will do everything including belly crawls to close the distance).

 

[Chuck R.]

Luckily we have ballistic software available!

IAW Strelok Pro @ 500 yds with both calibers using Federal 180 Nosler AB factory loads.

The 30-06, firing a 180 Nosler AB (200 yd zero) at 35 degrees gets roughly 2700, with a 10MPH 90 degree wind is at 500yds:

1902 FPS, 1446 lbs of energy, -46.6" and has 19.6" of windage

The 300WM, same bullet, Federal ammo , 200yd zero at 35 degrees gets 2960 FPS and under the same conditions at 500yds:

2089 FPS, 1745 Lbs, -38.2 and has 17.7" windage.

So at 500 yds, the 30-06 drops 8.4" more, has 1.9" more drift, and 299 lbs less energy.

Not a lot of difference at 500, as long as both use 180grn.

Personally my choice is the 300WM, and I'm having mine rebuilt now for an upcoming elk hunt this fall. I've killed bulls with .300WM, 8x68S and .350RM.

I'd use a 190 or 200 grn bullet in the 300WM
I reload, and have my own range out to 760yds, so can get some practice in
I don't find the recoil of the 300WM that "objectionable".