USA (women) "Guns offer false security"

[Tamara]

Sean,

That's what really cracks me up about this woman's polemic. I'm bigger than your average male, and stronger, too (given the fact that most guys don't work out enough to make use of the natural advantage granted them by testosterone); I've studied, over the years, a double handful of various hand-to-hand combat techniques, and have, in honest-to-Wotan fistfights, made grown men cry. I still carry a gun(s). Why? Because all it takes is a male roughly my size who has stayed in shape and has any experience in bare-hand dustups, and *poof* mother nature has thrown the advantage in his court, simply because I don't take 'roids, while his body makes 'roids.

Don't tell Kimberly, though, because it might damage her new-found self-esteem.

 

[El Tejon]

Tamara, you make grown men cry just by posting those gun photos.

 

[Nightfall]

Bruce Lee and Jet Li combined couldn't take out an average shooter with a good firearm. A once a week course in punching a big red rubber man will not give you the ability to.

 

[dustind]

I believe there are only 73 cases of firearms being taken from someone a year. 63 of those are from police officers forced to open carry and grapple with bad guys. Why does she think that she will be one of the unlucky ten? 98% of the time the attacker will flee at the mere sight of a gun.

 

[CZ-75]

Some 18 year old punk took out three cops in Alabamastan over the weekend by getting a gun from one of them.

 

[Sean Smith]

Mindset is a funny thing. The nugget of truth in the half-digested ideological slag that makes up that article is that hardware (the gun) will not fix a software problem (the mindset). Unfortunately, her idea of developing the proper life-or-death mindset has about as much in common with The Book of Five Rings as it does with the secret recipe for making Coca-Cola. She clearly has not the slightest concept of the threat she is dealing with, her own innate capabilities, and the mismatch between the two that could needlessly get her killed.

And oddly enough, people with the proper mindset for the task have the proper tools to deal with it. Sure, it is "the carpenter and not the tools," but how many carpenters do you see using bal-peen hammers to do sledgehammer work?

Speaking in general, this sort of thing has always baffled me. I'm a 6'2" male who works out regularly and used to be in the Army. I haven't been in fear of physical violence for who knows how long. For me, guns are mostly for fun, but I still like the idea of having a proper weapon when I need it. Because even a cursory study of violent criminals reveals that:

a. Some of those guys are farging huge.
b. Most of those guys will have SOMETHING... even a big stick will give them an advantage over your bare hands.
c. There is often more than one of them to deal with at a time.
d. Many of them are so doped up that they won't stop just because you've broken a couple of their bones.

So the idea that a 5'2" tall woman could live in the same world and think they are prepared to deal with its threats by learning how to drop an f-bomb and quirt stuff I put on my tacos in a thug's face is really, really wierd to me.

 

[Trisha]

OoooOH!

Kimberly has "street smarts?"

For real? Wow! Do they come in fashionable colors, you know like all those bandanas I see being worn in ethnic neighborhoods? Is there an educational cd I can listen to, you know, with all the 'right' music to listen to in some of those really scary streets?

I'm so relieved to know that someplace really, like, sensible, the University of Davis - they're up on all this, right? They even let professors with dope convictions teach there - I bet they all have "street smarts" too!

((sigh))

Normal people rule the world. . . and yet some look askance at me?

 

[StLGlocker]

I think Charlotte Johnson feels fairly secure.
http://www.thestarpress.com/tsp/news/local/03/jun/0606shootingsnews.php

 

[Monkeyleg]

Tamara, I have to ask a serious question: are you as nimble on your feet in verbal discusssions as you are in written ones? If so, you should really get yourself out on the talk show circuit. You can decimate a foe like no one I've ever seen.

 

[OEF_VET]

Tamara, way to make a point. You rule!

I'm so glad my fiancee thinks like you do, and she was born and raised in Illinois. Granted, it was Southern Illinois, and her dad is a strongly pro-gun, police firearms instructor and lawyer, but Illinois nonetheless. We've had several discussions about the rather idiotic argument that a woman with a gun is just going to lose it to her attacker who will then turn it on her. Her response generally goes something along the lines of "Like hell!" I'm so glad she sees the light and realizes that if an attacker can get a gun away from you, no cell phone or no amount of martial artistry will help either.

It boggles my mind to realize that these sheeple actually believe that a woman incapable of retaining her gun from someone will be able to bare-handedly hold off an attack long enough to call the cops and then wait for them to show up. How do these sheeple get so dumb? Is it in the bottled water they drink? Or the tofu, soy, no harmed animal, 'food' they eat?

Frank

 

[Betty]

I'm such a whopping huge gal that taking on a 6' 280 pound man would be like a bug on a windshield.

That's why I carry a gun. A big one. And another gun. And I learned how to use them.

 

[Idaho]

While I agree with all the above posts, the author of the original does make one legitimate point, albeit obliquely: a gun is not a magic talisman. Some people (men and women both) think that the mere fact of owning a gun is sufficient. You all know that it is not - it takes both the gun and the training to be effective. So, if the choice is presented between a woman buying a revolver, dropping in 5 rounds and putting it in the nightstand, versus a woman going to martial arts classes regularly and maintaining situational awareness - well, I would probably say that the second choice is the stronger one. Obviously the best choice would be to have a gun and train with that, but we all know there are people out there that own a gun who barely know what end is the pointy end.

 

[Solinvictus70]

There is one word that discribes the woman who wrote the op-ed piece: victim.

 

[BigG]

In fairness, it all depends on the mindset. You can't want something for someone more than they want it for themselves. I see people ask "what kinda gun should I get for my girlfriend?", etc. Unless THAT person has decided that the gun is the answer for them, it could prove a liability to them. It sure ain't going to prove a help to somebody who believes that hurting a fly is wrong or that a gun just frankly scares the hell outa them. Just my two sense.

 

[NukemJim]

Tamara, Most excellent response.

dustind:

I believe there are only 73 cases of firearms being taken from someone a year. 63 of those are from police officers forced to open carry and grapple with bad guys. Why does she think that she will be one of the unlucky ten?

The theme of having the gun taken away from a nonLEO is a commonly used argument against CCW. I have been trying to find a reference for this type of number . dustind can you help with a source please?

Thank you

NukemJim

 

[sm]

The author wouldn't know common sense if it jumped up and bit her on the arse, she'd probably turn the other cheek.

Tamara -way to go.

Interesting Idea about Tamara, Runt's, Trisha...and I can add others like pax...gathered together for an interview would be great. Even a column from time to time.

 

[citizen]

What a Speaking Tour THAT would be!!!!!!!!


(Oh; to be their agent!...... )

 

[Duncan Idaho]

"Guns can be taken away..."

Then take them back.

 

[bogie]

I'm such a whopping huge gal that taking on a 6' 280 pound man would be like a bug on a windshield.

Runt, if you EVER decide that you wanna spar with this 6'2" 280 pounder, there's a couple of conditions.

1. You get searched and relieved of hardware.

2. You get searched again, to get what was missed the first time...

3. I get to wear a cup. And padding. And have an EMT standing by...

Someone oughta talk sense to that girl.

 

[Harold Mayo]

I really need to take up journalism. If a woman with HER intelligence can get a piece like that published, I should be on my way to a Pulitzer in no time at all.

I simply MUST repeat what others have said:

If you can't keep your gun from being taken away, how on earth are you going to beat the same person in an unarmed fight?

A simple self-defense course gives you the abililty to beat up someone who is used to violence as a way of life? How stupid is that?

GUNS give a false sense of security? How about your little self-defense course giving a false sense of security?

Let's see...let's assume that I want to rape and/or rob and/or murder this lady. Will I hesitate if she pulls a gun? Hell, yes! Will I try and take it? I doubt it. If she acts like she's going to put up a little bit of a physical fight, am I going to hesitate? Only to laugh! Hell, the feistier, the better!

A man willing to do violence in that way is no stranger to it. He's had more experience and has more will to do violence than some grad student who has had a self-defense course and strong, experienced adult males are probably going to be on even terms with him in terms of an unarmed fight. A woman with a self-defense course? I feel sorry for her.

Street smarts? I don't think that she has any.

 

[redhead]

When someone tells me that some bad guy just might take my gun away from me, I tell them that if that happens, then I let them get TOO D___ CLOSE!!!

 

[CMichael]

It's hard to say anything that hasn't already been said.

I have a wee bit of training in martial arts.

There is a much different mindset from practicing "moves" in a class and the rage involved in a true fight.

Also the bad guy has an advantage. He gets up in the morning, closes his briefcase, and goes out and mugs people. Most honest citizens don't have this type of experience.

Women also have that physical body strength disadvantage.

The only real chance a woman has once violence is started is a gun or hopefully a way to deter the violence.

 

[gunsmith]

"gun may be taken away" LOL!

but those guys can never ever grab a cell phone, and how many 78yr old ladies are going to take martial arts???

 

[CasualShooter]

Kimberly Shearer Palmer is a graduate student at the University of Chicago.

Suprise??!

It's sad that so many young minds continue to be filled with so much cr_p by faculties with liberal bias at these universities. Ms Palmer, and those whom she may in turn influence by her writings, are being setup for a rather rude awakening if she/they should encounter attackers in the real world.:banghead:

Tamara -- good rebuttal. I hope you are submitting your comments for publication in other media as well as this Board. Have you considered submitting an article presenting an oposing view to USA Today? I hope so. Women with the ability to think should not let the air heads continue to dominate the mass media with such illogical tripe without challenge.

 

[MAKOwner]

That has to be the most illogical piece of crap article I've ever seen. Not because she disagrees with me, but because it's 100% completely illogical. So the gun is false security, but her inept "self defense" gyrations that she learned in 5 minutes are now apparently world beating martial art skills??? Give me a freakin break.... She's now confident to walk the streets with her newfound street smarts and defense skills? She is overjoyed in her newfound power??? Talk about a false sense of security.... Sure that is good stuff to know, and street smarts and awareness are extremely important. But take that stuff along with the gun and she is now indeed much safer. This idiot is in la-la land for crying out loud...