modifiedbrowning
Member
They're going to put guns on triple secret probation.
VA Tech families make a statement
- Thread starter ZeSpectre
- Start date
- Status
Prince Yamato
Member
Your kids were shot dead by a wackjob. The campus didn't do a good job of informing them that said wackjob was on campus. We all are mourning for you. I don't mean to seem like a callous bastard, but what do these people want? Your kids are dead, no committee will bring them back. You want to form a group to punish other good people because of what happened to you. It's not enough that you people are miserable, now everyone else has to suffer DIRECTLY with you. You want to vent, go punch a wall, go scream at a preacher about why "God let this happen", but don't take it out on everyone else. And yes, more gun control WILL trample on our rights. Somehow, these people have bit the Cindy Sheehan bug that when something bad happens to an innocent person you love, that anything you say, becomes irrefutable and morally correct. Well, it doesn't.
The fact that they're clamouring for it 2 months after leads me to believe that some of them are probably upset that their brief moments of fame have faded. Again, I know it sounds cruel, but some people relish the fame that's heaped upon them after tragedies. Moment in the spotlight fades? Open another committee.
I agree with everything they say, except this:
Ya know, I'm going to get flack for this, but: I have absolutely no sympathies for the parents who signed onto this little letter. These same parents would have the same things happen to subsequent students - children of other people - with a policy like this. That is morally reprehensible.
They want something they can cling to as an explanation for the violence - one which removes any and all culpability for the acts from themselves, those they've placed trust in, and their offspring. If you remove personal liability and responsibility, the only thing left to blame are inanimate objects: guns. (No, I'm not saying the parents are responsible for the fault anymore than a plumber is responsible for a leaky toilet - unless he installed the toilet and was responsible for its proper function, and it wasn't working properly when he left.)
I do, however, feel sorry for the students.
Ya know, I'm going to get flack for this, but: I have absolutely no sympathies for the parents who signed onto this little letter. These same parents would have the same things happen to subsequent students - children of other people - with a policy like this. That is morally reprehensible.
They want something they can cling to as an explanation for the violence - one which removes any and all culpability for the acts from themselves, those they've placed trust in, and their offspring. If you remove personal liability and responsibility, the only thing left to blame are inanimate objects: guns. (No, I'm not saying the parents are responsible for the fault anymore than a plumber is responsible for a leaky toilet - unless he installed the toilet and was responsible for its proper function, and it wasn't working properly when he left.)
I do, however, feel sorry for the students.
AnnCoulterFanClub
Member
I wish people would realize that we live in a free society and that living in a free society comes with inherent risk. I would rather be free and live with the risk than have to raise my hand and ask permission to live. VA Tech was a tragedy, but there doesn't need to be any new laws, or bans, or restrictions...give me a break! Realize that people are free, or so they tell us, and things will happen, that's just part of life.
They don't have any solutions, but they're sure of this.
I ask, "How, exactly, could it be worse?"
The fact is, if one of their kids had been carrying a gun that he/she knew how to use, he/she would most likely not be dead, and others would be alive, too.
Or do they believe that THEIR kids were also likely to become mass murderers?
It appears to me that they don't want to think about the fact that there was one thing that could have saved their kids, and that's if their kids had been armed. I am well-acquainted with a parent's grief; I understand that there are things you don't want to face. But that's no reason to make sure the NEXT victims won't have a chance.
IdahoFarmer
Member
AnnCoulterFanClub... Welcome to the board!
I second that they should arm the professors, with it being left up to the individual professor if they want to arm themselves. They could put it under the "security guards enlisted in their security duties" clause.
I was in high school when the first school shootings broke out. They 'fixed' the problems by locking all doors to the building except the front doors, mounted video cameras at all entrances and posted a security guard at the main entrance. The problem for colleges is there is no way to 'lock the doors' during classes. Even so, with class changes every 1 hr, an intruder would not have to wait long. If the dude that survived Nazi concentration camps had a gun, I'm sure he would of killed that Cho without thinking twice.
I would not allow the students to be armed, there is too much emotional trauma for most college students. Their lack of emotional and mental maturity leads to the chance that students would use guns to intimidate others. Remember, colleges aren't what they were fifty years ago, now they are just a continuation of high school. (With most of the same attitudes and mentalities towards learning.)
I was in high school when the first school shootings broke out. They 'fixed' the problems by locking all doors to the building except the front doors, mounted video cameras at all entrances and posted a security guard at the main entrance. The problem for colleges is there is no way to 'lock the doors' during classes. Even so, with class changes every 1 hr, an intruder would not have to wait long. If the dude that survived Nazi concentration camps had a gun, I'm sure he would of killed that Cho without thinking twice.
I would not allow the students to be armed, there is too much emotional trauma for most college students. Their lack of emotional and mental maturity leads to the chance that students would use guns to intimidate others. Remember, colleges aren't what they were fifty years ago, now they are just a continuation of high school. (With most of the same attitudes and mentalities towards learning.)
pacodelahoya
Member
I was gonna reply to this thread, then I read all the posts and it seem Prince Yamato beat me too it.
yokel
Member
- Joined
- Apr 29, 2007
- Messages
- 1,235
Ugh, we certainly do not need the victim's relatives to serve as lackeys for the gun control and confiscation interest groups.
I do not believe that those who want to disarm the law-abiding public have the public’s best interest at heart. Injustice is never in the public’s best interest, and it is unjust to respond to gun crimes by depriving the innocent and the victims of their God-given right of self-defense and their constitutional right to carry the means of that defense on their person.
No other school policy was more responsible for the massacre than this one.
I do not believe that those who want to disarm the law-abiding public have the public’s best interest at heart. Injustice is never in the public’s best interest, and it is unjust to respond to gun crimes by depriving the innocent and the victims of their God-given right of self-defense and their constitutional right to carry the means of that defense on their person.
No other school policy was more responsible for the massacre than this one.
pacodelahoya
Member
FTA84, I used to ride the bus with my 870 wingmaster 16 ga, pockets full of ammo, put it in my locker, then go hunting after school with my buddy.
This was in the late 70'2 early 80's. I'm old but not ancient.
This was in the late 70'2 early 80's. I'm old but not ancient.
So, they want to attack my rights and use the rotting corpses of their own kids as shields?
They just lost every bit of pity from me. Hopefully none of them had any other kids, humanity would be better off without the genes from this group.
They just lost every bit of pity from me. Hopefully none of them had any other kids, humanity would be better off without the genes from this group.
TrybalRage
Member
FTA84 said:
In the not-so-distant past, high schoolers took their guns to school with them all the time. It was called hunting season. Funny, not alot of shootings happened.
RNB65
Member
Ah, yes. The "good ol' days".
I carried a rifle or shotgun behind the seat of my pickup truck every single day that I was in high school. Never thought twice about it. And I didn't hunt - just liked to have something along in case a plinking opportunity presented itself. That was 20-something years ago.
FieroCDSP
Member
They want access to Cho's medical records, as if they're looking for an indicator that he was nuts. I'd be interested in whether parents of VT students think a complete review of an applicant's medical history should be required for the proper mental history before they're allowed to go there. What? No? Because that's unfair?
Hypocrites.
Hypocrites.
To all whom it concerns:
Aslong as you are comfortable with high school students taking guns to school than it is ok with me. Though there are no lockers, they would have to have them in their bags beside the desk.
Perhaps I am not so against students having firearms as much as I am strongly for professors possessing them.
It is like the old dilly with (cruise) ships. If a (cruise) ship goes down, the crew goes onto life boats last. As students are paying for a service, the professor has the duty to be the first line of protection in a Cho-style shooting.
Aslong as you are comfortable with high school students taking guns to school than it is ok with me. Though there are no lockers, they would have to have them in their bags beside the desk.
Perhaps I am not so against students having firearms as much as I am strongly for professors possessing them.
It is like the old dilly with (cruise) ships. If a (cruise) ship goes down, the crew goes onto life boats last. As students are paying for a service, the professor has the duty to be the first line of protection in a Cho-style shooting.
pacodelahoya
Member
FTA84, perhaps you don't realize it, but guns were not allowed at VT, nor Columbine, nor the school house in Lancaster Pa ( I think that's where it was , I'm not gonna go looking for it either).
What good did it do all those dead kids to not allow guns?
What good did it do all those dead kids to not allow guns?
Prince Yamato
Member
First off, let me say I am totally for CCW on college campuses, but I also get what FTA84 is saying. There is no doubt a rationalized fear amongst many people about allowing college students to carry concealed handguns and for the reasons FTA84 stated. But one must remember that most of the stupid stuff done by college students happens freshmen year. Freshmen are 18 and almost completely excluded from CCW in most states. 21 is the age for CCW in most states and with that in mind, most students would be juniors or seniors and certainly more capable of handling the responsibilities of gun ownership. Yes, college kids (ironic because by freshman year you are considered an adult) can be pretty stupid, but I think this can be offset if penalties for gun crimes on college campuses were raised (at least temporarily)- presuming CCW is allowed. IE, no threatening with weapons, etc. Basically, you severely punish for people doing stupid stuff with firearms.
Again, I'm fully in support of CCW on college campuses, but many people have fears about it. We can cite facts about how CCW would've saved lives at VT... and we'd be correct. We also need to meet the fence sitters half-way though, and explain how campuses won't turn into a bloodbath. Look if you're not from a gun owning family, the prospect of guns "suddenly being everywhere" on campus sounds kind of scary. We have to allay some of these fears. Also keep in mind, especially those of you who brought hunting arms to school- most of you probably grew up around firearms. There are many kids in this country who haven't and in addition to things like alcohol and sex, guns present a big "wow" and "cool" factor that may be too much for some kids to handle their freshman year.
Again, I'm fully in support of CCW on college campuses, but many people have fears about it. We can cite facts about how CCW would've saved lives at VT... and we'd be correct. We also need to meet the fence sitters half-way though, and explain how campuses won't turn into a bloodbath. Look if you're not from a gun owning family, the prospect of guns "suddenly being everywhere" on campus sounds kind of scary. We have to allay some of these fears. Also keep in mind, especially those of you who brought hunting arms to school- most of you probably grew up around firearms. There are many kids in this country who haven't and in addition to things like alcohol and sex, guns present a big "wow" and "cool" factor that may be too much for some kids to handle their freshman year.
pacodelahoya
Member
That's becuse the .gov and the million mommy types have turned them into forbidden fruit. The answer of course is mandatory gun training in school.
Prince Yamato
Member
Actually, if this were talked about during Frosh O', right along with date rape, getting along with your roommate, and proper study habits, I think it would be great.
And on another note, if we can teach kids to put on a codomn in high school, surely we could teach them how to handle a firearm?
- Status
