Weak-Hand Drills For Pocket Carry

[kingpin008]

Hey folks. Following the excellent (and much appreciated) advice offered in response to the thread I posted yesterday regarding the attempted break-in at Casa de Kingpin, I've started reading up on ways to make sure we're better prepared in case it ever happens again.

One of the things I'm studying is practice drills. The sticky here is proving extremely helpful, but I didn't see anything regarding weak-hand drills for pocket carry.

I'm left handed, and (now) I carry a 642 in the left front pocket of my jeans while in the house. Obviously this presents no problems drawing with my strong hand, but with my weak hand it's proving impossible. I have somewhat short arms and a bit of a gut, and the combination of the two are keeping my from getting my right hand anywhere near my left pocket - especially without bending down, twisting my torso, or crouching.

So I wonder, oh my tactical superiors: do any such drills exist? It occurs to me that I may just have to modify my method of carry while in the house, but if I can pull off pocket carry I'd like to simply due to how convenient it is.

Thanks again!

 

[nitetrane98]

I'm going to be a smart aleck and recommend a small Harbor Freight 12 volt. Or maybe one of the original Black and Decker straight body drill/drivers. They were very weak. If you really want to go old school you can still find Yankee drills. Stanleys were very well made. OK enough of that!


I don't have a "bit of a gut" I've got a full grown one. There will simply be no tactical weak hand drawing for me. As a matter of fact, just as I sit here reaching, I'm not at all sure I could get to the thumb break. If my strong hand is OOC before I get my gun out, I'm afraid I am just SOL. I could probably handle a small of the back rig if I was so inclined, but I'm not.

 

[kingpin008]

Very funny.

As for the rest of your reply, I think you're right. I'm either gonna have to carry something else in my weak-side pocket, invest in a SmartCarry, or just hope for the best if my left side gets disabled in a fight.

 

[Speedo66]

Or change your carry location to back pocket which might be more accessible to both hands.

 

[kingpin008]

I considered that, as well as SOB carry, but personally, the 642 is a little too beefy to comfortably sit on. Not a bad idea though, and if/when I'm able to afford a new pistol it'll likely be an auto, which might make it easier to back-pocket or SOB carry.

 

[David E]

For a J-frame, an IWB in the appendix postion may be a possibility.

Either get a second gun for the other pocket, or change the location of the one. Either appendix or 4:00 behind the hip.

Sitting on a gun hurts and you'll probably activate the mag release on a semi auto.

In reality, your strong side hand/arm will be just fine. It's good to have "Plan B, C and D" , but don't forget to have "Plan A" in the process of sorting things out.

Don't place "possibility" over "probability."

 

[smince]

I posted this thread on another forum:

For a few years, I carried my spare magazine in my left front pocket. It was wasy to access with my off-hand.

However, a couple of years ago, I took an advanced defensive handgun class. We did a lot of weak hand and one hand shooting, drawing and reloading. I found that my spare mag is almost impossible to reach with my strong hand in a single-hand drill. I promptly moved my spare mag to a carrier in the AIWB position next to my pistol, so either hand can access either piece of equipment.

I know pocket carry is very popular with many, and for a BUG I think it is a good option. My question is for those who use pocket carry as their primary method of carry. Regarding some of my experiences trying to retrieve my spare mag and applying them to your handgun:

1. Are you able to access your weapon with your off-hand if you needed to?

2. How do you do it?

3. Have you even thought about it?

4. Do you even care?

Most of the replies were people who either hadn't thought about it, or really didn't care.

They had the perception that they were 'armed enough' with a J-frame in the pocket and the perception of having to access it with the offhand was non-existent. The 'even though I'm CCW, deep down I don't believe it will ever happen to me' syndrome

I personally believe that fighting with a gun should be an ambidextrous skill.

 

[Old Fuff]

I am right handed.

I sometimes carry a revolver in my left/side pocket, draw with my left hand, and transfer the gun to my right hand as both hands come together in front of my body toward the center.

Why? because my righthand pocket is filled with keys, change, etc.

So far as it goes, I can shoot with either hand, but the method works, and isn't slow. Also for some reason, people don't seem to view a hand in the left pocket as being a threat. I have no idea why.

 

[DeepSouth]

Bigger pockets might help to. When I upgraded my PC gun to the PM45 I had to start wearing Carhartt pants because they have bigger pockets, I also went up a size just to make the draw a little easier.

 

[xXxplosive]

Just got done watching the Paladin series last evening on the Western Channel...........funny how he always carried that little 2 shot derringer under his gun belt, appendix / strong side....and how much he used it as a BUG.

Thought that was interesting..............

 

[kingpin008]

I personally believe that fighting with a gun should be an ambidextrous skill.

Exactly my thoughts. I ran with a rough crowd in highschool, and I've seen enough fights to know that things hardly ever go the way either combatant thought they would.

Old Fuff - That's not a bad idea, thanks.

DeepSouth - Yeah, that's a possibility. I used to wear Dickies slacks and shorts almost exclusively and they had some pretty deep pockets. Might be time to switch back.

You know though, I can't help but think how much easier this would be if I were able to carry outside my home as well. That way, I could strap on a regular holster in the morning, then just leave it on until I climbed into bed.

Oh well. We'll get it straightened out here in good old MD one day. :banghead:

 

[smince]

I sometimes carry a revolver in my left/side pocket, draw with my left hand, and transfer the gun to my right hand as both hands come together in front of my body toward the center.

Good as far as it goes. But it doesn't answer the original post, or how to draw if one hand is busy or injured and you need to access it with the other.

 

[Deltaboy1984]

Get another BUG and go IWB on the Right side. some thing like a Kel-
Tec or other small auto.

 

[sidheshooter]

You've just discovered a disadvantage of pocket carry. Congrats!!!



I still like pocket holsters, but I'm aware of the limitations.

I think that the only way to get past the ambi-problem is to do as others suggest: a) new york reload (2nd gun... hey, you were thinking of getting one for your SO anyways) or b) appendix with a thin-of-profile kydex rig.

These guys will make one that fits the bill well, if you have the pennies laying around...

http://www.comp-tac.com/product_info.php?products_id=89

FWIW.


BTW, I sort of got my butt kicked on the off-side drills at the last class I took; I shoot a lot weak-hand, but I obviously don't practice my weak-hand-only manipulations enough. Once I got the thing running again each time, I was probably the best shot in the class weak side, but it wasn't pretty watching any of us get there.

 

[harrygunner]

As just mentioned, the answer is to move away from pocket carry. A holster you can mount on your belt will fix this.

Even with a IWB holster, I can draw my pistol standing, lying on my back, side or stomach with either hand.

After this experience, you may wind up getting a Florida or Utah permit for when you travel out of state. If you ever envision getting a permit, invest in a good holster that you can use in your home and later for general carry.

Carrying at home will help get you used to having a gun on you. Feels good.

 

[Old Fuff]

smince:

Old Fuff: I sometimes carry a revolver in my left/side pocket, draw with my left hand, and transfer the gun to my right hand as both hands come together in front of my body toward the center.

smince: Good as far as it goes. But it doesn't answer the original post, or how to draw if one hand is busy or injured and you need to access it with the other.

Old Fuff: So far as it goes, I can shoot with either hand, but the method works, and isn't slow. Also for some reason, people don't seem to view a hand in the left pocket as being a threat. I have no idea why.

This thread is supposedly focused on pocket holsters, and if the gun is in a pant's side pocket, that is the side the draw will have to be made from. However once it is drawn it can be transfered to either hand, or used with both. I have no problem shooting one-handed if that's necessary.

 

[harrygunner]

Old Fuff, I respect your postings and am surprised you're defending the indefensible.

The thread is titled "Weak-Hand Drills For Pocket Carry". The OP had an incident involving a possible break-in to his home and realized the gun in the upstairs bedroom was far away, it might as well have been on the moon.

If the OP had to block a strike, a knife or a gun shot with his strong hand, he would not have been able to reach the gun with his weak hand in a pocket. Effectively, his gun is back on the moon. He would have no ability to use his strong hand to pass to his weak hand.

If I had use of both arms, the main reason I would pass to my weak hand is that sometimes I can take better advantage of cover shooting with my weak hand. Otherwise, weak hand drills are for situations where that's what's left.

 

[smince]

Sorry Old Fluff, but this is the topic of the OP:

One of the things I'm studying is practice drills. The sticky here is proving extremely helpful, but I didn't see anything regarding weak-hand drills for pocket carry.

I'm left handed, and (now) I carry a 642 in the left front pocket of my jeans while in the house. Obviously this presents no problems drawing with my strong hand, but with my weak hand it's proving impossible. I have somewhat short arms and a bit of a gut, and the combination of the two are keeping my from getting my right hand anywhere near my left pocket - especially without bending down, twisting my torso, or crouching.

So I wonder, oh my tactical superiors: do any such drills exist? It occurs to me that I may just have to modify my method of carry while in the house, but if I can pull off pocket carry I'd like to simply due to how convenient it is.

Drawing with the weak hand was the topic, not drawing and swapping hands, or weak-hand shooting.

There lies the major problem with one gun in one pocket.

 

[Old Fuff]

Old Fuff, I respect your postings and am surprised you're defending the indefensible

.

I suppose... I'm always doing things like that.

The incident related in the first post by kingpin008 that was the basis for this thread, was that he had a close call with a potential break-in and was caught without a sidearm on his person. Consequently decides to carry "in house," and specifies the method and weapon as follows:

I'm left handed, and (now) I carry a 642 in the left front pocket of my jeans while in the house.

Notice that he didn't request any suggestions concerning alternative ways to carry, although maybe he should have.

Anyway, in response to my suggestion that he draw with the weak hand and shift to the strong one, he replied:

Old Fuff - That's not a bad idea, thanks.

He may, or may not be concerned that there is a remote possibility that he couldn't draw from a side pocket because his arm or hand on that side was blocked or disabled; but I won't go into additional issues unless he asks.

 

[smince]

Notice that he didn't request any suggestions concerning alternative ways to carry, although maybe he should have.

Actually, he sort of did:

It occurs to me that I may just have to modify my method of carry while in the house,

We must be reading two different posts, because the one I read is all about drills to access the weapon with the weak hand

In fact, it is the title of the thread...

 

[Old Fuff]

Well we have yet to hear back from kingpin008, but in the meantime I see no reason to go over the ground that you and harrygunner have covered, and done so very well.

I don't dispute that you have made some points, but unless kingpin008 becomes concerned enough to ask for additional suggestions on alternative ways to carry his weapon I see no reason to reinvent the wheel that you've already done.

It is entirely possible that he considers the likelyhood of having his strong-side arm or hand disabled is so remote that he'll stick to pocket carry, but we'll have to wait and see.

 

[kingpin008]

Honestly, I would prefer that this thread stay focused on methods and drills of weak-hand deployment from a pocket.

I understand that drills regarding this particular method of carry may be slim to none, and that my best answer in that situation may be to simply switch modes of carry. If that turns out to be the case, I have a few ideas.

Until then, if we could focus on existing drills or new ideas or advice on things to try to practice weak-hand draws from a pocket that would be great.

(that being said, I appreciate all responses so far, even if they weren't exactly what I was looking for. All advice is helpful!)

 

[David E]

One problem with pocket carry is that it's difficult for the opposite hand to draw it. (since the OP has already ruled out the rear pocket)

Therefore, putting the gun in the other pocket with the idea of transferring to the strong hand during the draw stroke does nothing to address how to draw the gun that's on the opposite side of the available hand.

If the OP is unusally flexible and can draw from the opposite pocket, then this is all moot. But since he asked, I doubt that he's unusually flexible.

OP understands weak side drawing methods and drills "may be slim to none." Further, he acknowledges that he may have to "simply swap modes of carry" for which he already has "a few ideas."

I guess I'm a little confused how any of us can help !

 

[harrygunner]

OK, Old Fuff. You read the OP correctly.

I tried like heck to get anything out of my strong side front pocket with my weak hand and could not.

The only thing I can contribute is I can from cargo pockets.

 

[kingpin008]

I guess I'm a little confused how any of us can help !

Easy. If you know of any drills addressing weak-hand drills for pocket carry, post 'em up.

I tried like heck to get anything out of my strong side front pocket with my weak hand and could not.

You and me both. Like I said, I hope that there are drills/methods out there, but if not, oh well.

I'd love to put the question to Clint Smith, Gabe Suarez, and a few others, and see what they come up with!