Balog
Member
I will admit that shorter (ie carbine length) weapons are a lot easier to fight up close with. I'd hate to use my 91/30 to clear our apartment. But not out of concern someone would ninja it out of my hand. 
What are you using for home defence? Rifle, Pistol or shotgun?
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Cap'n Jack Burntbeard
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>Balog
Just get yourself a M44 carbine to keep the 91/30 company.
Its shorter and it has that awesome muzzle flash/blast.
For me? I'd throw my light on my AK and go have a look around, last time it just turned out to be wind blowing stuff around in my yard.
Just get yourself a M44 carbine to keep the 91/30 company.
Its shorter and it has that awesome muzzle flash/blast.
For me? I'd throw my light on my AK and go have a look around, last time it just turned out to be wind blowing stuff around in my yard.
mljdeckard
Member
I would MUCH rather get creative and learn proper techniques for using a rifle, shotgun, or carbine to clear a building to keep the advantages of a much more powerful and effective weapon than drop back to a pistol. Pistols are emergency tools you use when you don't have time to get to something bigger.
As others who have been trained to do it correctly suggest, never in all of my training for clearing buildings have I ever said to myself; "This rifle is just too big and cumbersome. I wish I could drop it and use my pistol instead." The only adjustment I have ever had to make is to learn to maneuver left-handed to get around a stairwell corner the other way. You would have to do this with a pistol as well.
Use what you have to, use what you have at the moment, use what you can shoot effectively. But DON'T tell yourself that a revolver does less hearing damage than a shotgun indoors, because it doesn't, don't tell yourself that a pistol is as effective for ending a fight quickly as a rifle, because it isn't, and don't rationalize with thoughts about overpenetration, because no round is guaranteed NOT to overpenetrate even if you DO hit with all of them, which you probably won't anyway.
As others who have been trained to do it correctly suggest, never in all of my training for clearing buildings have I ever said to myself; "This rifle is just too big and cumbersome. I wish I could drop it and use my pistol instead." The only adjustment I have ever had to make is to learn to maneuver left-handed to get around a stairwell corner the other way. You would have to do this with a pistol as well.
Use what you have to, use what you have at the moment, use what you can shoot effectively. But DON'T tell yourself that a revolver does less hearing damage than a shotgun indoors, because it doesn't, don't tell yourself that a pistol is as effective for ending a fight quickly as a rifle, because it isn't, and don't rationalize with thoughts about overpenetration, because no round is guaranteed NOT to overpenetrate even if you DO hit with all of them, which you probably won't anyway.
I didn't say it was easy either. All I said was they offer more leverage than pistols, and I stand by that. I'm really not trying to argue that they shouldn't be used for clearing a home (I've already had that argument on THR), I just advise against it for those who aren't professionally trained to do so.
Personally, I wouldn't use a rifle-caliber carbine to clear a home primarily because I don't think rifle calibers are suitable for the application. Concern about someone taking control of the muzzle is somewhere around #3 in the list of reasons I advise againse use of a rifle for clearing a building.
Keep in mind any advice I give on this board is not intended for trained professionals.
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Officers'Wife
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No plan, not even backup plans, survives contact with the enemy.
chuckusaret
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I have a Mossberg 500 12 ga at bedside in a boxspring rack and a XD40 in my nightstand, my wife has a LCR-LG and a LCP in her nightstand.
Marlin 45 carbine
Member
all the above, a Makarov in holster velcroed to bedpost, SXS 12ga Mag leaned in corner by nite-lite and Marlin Camp .45acp with 10rd mag loaded w/+P 185gr Golden Sabres hanging on wall hooks nearby. of course pistols/revolvers near doors and my .32acp Beretta in pocket when outside.
Jonah71
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Until the Mossberg I ordered comes in, I'll stick to the Mod 65 Taurus .357 loaded with Remington Golden Saber HP's, with the .22 mag 2" barrel within reach as well. Blind in one eye, I may as well be deaf to boot. The 9mm is close by if I need it. But the likelyhood of needing any of them in this town is pretty slim.
There must be some reason the Army does all that planning. The point of planning is not so much to prepare the script but to analyze the possibilities. Which places are safer, which are more dangerous? Which door needs a better lock? What additional equipment could be helpful? What stuff is in the wrong place? (Is your cell phone in your bedroom a night?) What happens if a bad guy shoots through the hall door?
Even though the fight won't go according to your imagined script, you will won't have to do all your thinking while under the gun.
mljdeckard
Member
Correct. Just because chaos ensues in combat doesn't mean you shouldn't have at LEAST two plans in place. If it falls apart, it means you need to do it better the next time. This is why we train, and it's NEVER over.
billybobjoe
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Break in here and find out!!!
CosmicGrooves
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For in the house, I have several choices.
cauberallies
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I keep a pistol gripped Mossberg 590 12 gauge with a 20" barrel, flashlight, laser, reflex sight, in a rack under my desk, loaded with 8 rounds of 3" 15 pellet 00BK. Round chambered, safety on. Given the circumstances, I have found this to be the best option for me. The reflex sight has no purpose when the shotgun is in it's home defense configuration, but when I take it shooting, I stick the collapsable stock back on. I run a recording studio out of my home, and I spend most of my time down here at my desk.
woad_yurt
Member
I keep a K-frame .38 near the bed but that's because I've shot many thousands of rounds through the same. After a while, one can shoot those things effectively without thinking. It's like developing a good golf swing. After tons of practice, it becomes second nature.
Though, for a casual gun owner who shoots infrequently, I'd recommend a shotgun. I guess it's a bit easier to hit a target 15 feet away with a shotgun than it is with a handgun. That said, however, I'll stick to my .38 as I just painted in here.
Loaded with homebrew Mk262. At ranges under 40 feet the center of the light beam is where it hits. I don't put much stock in the "Don't use XXX for HD, you'll get in legal trouble!" arguments. It hasn't happened enough in American history to draw any conclusions about it, and the real point of HD guns is to put bad guys on their backs, quickly and efficiently. This is the right tool for that job, and I will worry about the cops and lawyers well after protecting my loved ones.
NMGonzo
Member
GP100 with .38 specials by bedside, right next to the Mosin M44.
Bayonet deployed.
"Ok ... question for the defendant, could you have shot the intruder?"
"Yes, your honor. But I did not want to wake up the neighbors."
Bayonet deployed.
"Ok ... question for the defendant, could you have shot the intruder?"
"Yes, your honor. But I did not want to wake up the neighbors."
TexasRifleman
Moderator Emeritus
I think you have made a fine choice there. Mine is almost the same.
FROGO207
Member
It depends on what room I am in when the firearm is needed but mostly a semiauto pistol is within easy reach all the time.
1shotonly
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A good bludgeon, such as a baseball bat is tough to beat. However concerning shot guns, I like the way this guy put it:
“If you're worried that a missed shot might penetrate through a wall and harm others, load your first shot or two with number 6 birdshot, followed by standard lead #1 buckshot (12 gauge). If your first shot misses, the birdshot is less likely to endanger innocent lives outside the room. If your first shot fails to stop the attacker, you can immediately follow-up with more potent ammunition.”
Aparently he has determined that #1 buck is the best choice for ultimate stoping power on a man, well, ok maybe on backup shots, just make sure you don’t miss on that second or third shot and take out a family member on the other side of the wall.
“If you're worried that a missed shot might penetrate through a wall and harm others, load your first shot or two with number 6 birdshot, followed by standard lead #1 buckshot (12 gauge). If your first shot misses, the birdshot is less likely to endanger innocent lives outside the room. If your first shot fails to stop the attacker, you can immediately follow-up with more potent ammunition.”
Aparently he has determined that #1 buck is the best choice for ultimate stoping power on a man, well, ok maybe on backup shots, just make sure you don’t miss on that second or third shot and take out a family member on the other side of the wall.
1shotonly
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The same publication also said:
"Questions about slugs for home defense arise fairly frequently in my mail so, briefly, here is my take on the subject. Shotgun slugs are dangerously over penetrative for most home defense scenarios. (You have no right to endanger your neighbors.) I suggest that, inside of a domicile, #4 buckshot is usually a more appropriate defensive shotgun load."
"Questions about slugs for home defense arise fairly frequently in my mail so, briefly, here is my take on the subject. Shotgun slugs are dangerously over penetrative for most home defense scenarios. (You have no right to endanger your neighbors.) I suggest that, inside of a domicile, #4 buckshot is usually a more appropriate defensive shotgun load."
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