Trey Veston
Member
None of this changes the fact you are giving poor advice based on false premises.
Poor advice?? To make sure your carry pistol is accurate at 25 yards is poor advice?? Now I've heard everything.
None of this changes the fact you are giving poor advice based on false premises.
Poor advice?? To make sure your carry pistol is accurate at 25 yards is poor advice?? Now I've heard everything.
I've had a couple of incidents in which either a pistol or the ammo couldn't do better than 8" at 25 yards. I don't like the idea of carrying a pistol or ammo that I could not rely on to hit a human-sized target at 25 yards away, off-hand and under stress..... So if a pistol that can do an inch at 25yds opens up to 10" under mild stress, how much would a pistol that barely does 8" at 25yds open up to under stress? The point that I'm trying to make is that the more accurate the pistol is, the more accurate it is going to be in a defensive shooting. And we can't guarantee that whatever horrible scenario we find ourselves in is going to be at the proverbial 7yds or less.
I'm going to give polymers one last try. Out of all of the ones I've shot or owned, aside from the HK P30L, the Gen 4 G17 was my favorite.
I know each barrel is different and this and that but how different can a Gen 4 G17 barrel from gun to gun really be to effect preference of grain/brand of ammo? Not much I'd guess.
So what budget ammo and grain does your Gen 4 G17 group best with? I believe Gen 4 G19 owners could chime in as well since the 1/2" length difference probably wouldn't effect much if anything.
I know these aren't "target guns". Just wondering what groups best in yours.
Thanks.
That is why I advocate verifying your pistol's and carry ammo's accuracy at 25 yards. A pistol that is more accurate at 25 yards is going to be more accurate in your hands than one that is not. It is a simple matter of physics. If a pistol is 50% more accurate shooting off the bench at 25 yards, then it is 50% more accurate once you factor in human error.
Thank you for the reasonable and detailed reply. I don't think we are too far off in our assumptions and line of thinking.
In years past, the vast majority of self defense shootings involved a person that was being victimized for the purpose of robbery, rape, or assault. Most of those are up close and personal and being able to draw and fire quickly and accurately at ranges of usually less than a few feet. This is what most CCW holders anticipate and train for. Your stance and points are perfectly in line with such a scenario. I was in two such scenarios in which I had to draw my weapon but did not have to fire, thank God.
But today, there is an increase in what is referred to as an "active shooter" scenario, in which someone goes into a public place such as a church, a bar, a mall, or school, and his intent is to kill as many people as possible. Sometimes with a rifle, sometimes with a shotgun, and sometimes with a pistol.
In nearly every one of those scenarios, the shooter was in an open area and a greater distance away from his victims. This is why I practice at greater distances. A couple of years ago, in my hometown, in the Arby's restaurant where my family and I occasionally go to eat, there was an active shooter situation. A mentally ill young man used a S&W SDVE to kill a few people. He went to his apartment managers office and shot and killed him and wounded another tenant. Then he drove to the Arby's and walked in and started shooting the manager, who tried to crawl out the drive-thru window. Then he drove to his mother's house and shot and killed her before he gave up. My brother worked the scene at the home as primary Detective.
I checked the distance from the booth where my family and I usually sit to the counter where the shooter was. 50'. If I had been there and been armed with one of my carry guns that I am absolutely confident with, then I could have saved that woman's life, and the life of the mother.
Now I know the typical gun owner says that they will run and hide in such a scenario rather than attempt to engage the shooter and end the incident. That is their choice, and based on the attitude and abilities on display in threads in which people shoot a 3" group at 7 yards and announce that the gun is "incredibly accurate", is probably best for everyone.
I know that for myself, as former military and law enforcement, that if I was in such a situation and decided to run and take cover rather than try to save innocent lives, then I would hate myself for the rest of my miserable life. Of course you don't take the shot if you don't have a clear backdrop, or if there is a chance of hitting an innocent bystander. I'm not advocating reckless firing of a weapon in public. But if some sick bastard is walking along and shooting civilians, then you do everything you can to stop it.
The chances that I will ever have to fire my weapon in either an up close and personal, or an active shooter at distance scenario is slim to none. But I like to be prepared for both, and I think others should be prepared as well.
That is why I advocate verifying your pistol's and carry ammo's accuracy at 25 yards. A pistol that is more accurate at 25 yards is going to be more accurate in your hands than one that is not. It is a simple matter of physics. If a pistol is 50% more accurate shooting off the bench at 25 yards, then it is 50% more accurate once you factor in human error.