What did you do, or would you do with your guns in a flood?

[wally]

It might be very useful to hear what people who were flooded out with Harvey or other events did with their guns and how things turned out.

Unless you have your own boat or trailer for evacuation its unlikely you could take out more than a few. I know people who live on the rivers and flood regularly are prepared to do this and evacuate in box trucks or towing trailers behind them.

I'll share what I would do, which fortunately is totally untested theory.

First after insuring everything more valuable is safe and sound, I'd empty the safe contents onto a bed and/or other high surfaces. Then if time permitted, I'd move them into the attic and put them in plastic trash bags if possible. If time was short, I'd put the rifles in plastic trash bags and stand them upright on high surfaces leaning against whatever to try and keep them upright with the idea that as the water rose the air would rise out of the bag and the plastic would conform around the gun and keep it dry. For handguns high spaces are easier to find and I'd use gallon ziploc bags for what would fit inside.

Our club flooded, but the waters receded pretty fast, on Thursday they sent an Email asking for volunteers to help clean and oil the club guns (DCM Garands for high power match loaners, .22lr for the youth programs, etc.) as water had gotten into the safes. I would have immediately offered to help except I wasn't sure if I could get there from here, and as I was trying to figure it out, a friend about a mile away who flooded called and needed help so that took priority. I haven't heard anything more yet about how the club guns fared.

It has been amazing and uplifting to see how everyone seems to be stepping up to help those in need during this epic event.

 

[grampajack]

Protecting them from flood waters is easy. Protecting them from looters and confiscation is the tricky part. I would waterproof them in mylar bags and hide them somewhere, possibly dropping them into walls from the attic. Of course if there's a possibility your house will be destroyed by winds, in the safe is the best option, but there's a very real chance the National Guard will take them if you leave them somewhere that obvious, or that looters will get them.

 

[Meplat 308]

Throw everything in the truck and head for high ground ! I'll admit the likelihood of a flood is minimal for me as we're sitting around 1800 ft with not much higher that us. Everything drains away from us. If things got really serious then its off to our bug out (undisclosed) location.

 

[BigBore44]

I actually had to contemplate this 2 years ago. We had a massive flood. My plan should it actually get so bad we had to evacuate was to move all the guns except a few family heirlooms to the attic. But the heirlooms go with me in my Ranger 520C or my Tracker. I have waterproof Pelican cases for those guns for transport.

 

[wally]

The Ft Bend County Sheriff has warned that looters could be leaving in body bags!

possibly dropping them into walls from the attic

I don't think so, Ive yet to see a house constructed where you could drop a wire or cable down the wall without drilling holes.

 

[grampajack]

The Ft Bend County Sheriff has warned that looters could be leaving in body bags!


I don't think so, Ive yet to see a house constructed where you could drop a wire or cable down the wall without drilling holes.

Screw drilling holes, I would get up there with a power saw and open up a freaking cavity, drop them down there hung on wire, and cover them up with insulation. Your house is going to get totaled anyways, so causing a few hundred, or even a few thousand in damage, isn't a factor. Obviously you would want to be judicious about where you did it, and how much board you removed from one wall, but as long as you were careful you would maintain the structural integrity.

Another option would be peeling back the carpet, breaking through the slab, and digging a hole, then pouring a thin layer of concrete over it and putting the carpet back in place. Ain't nobody gonna find that, regardless of how much or how little of your house was left standing after the hurricane.

I actually had to contemplate this 2 years ago. We had a massive flood. My plan should it actually get so bad we had to evacuate was to move all the guns except a few family heirlooms to the attic. But the heirlooms go with me in my Ranger 520C or my Tracker. I have waterproof Pelican cases for those guns for transport.

You just want to make sure you get them out before emergency management is in place. A lot of folks tried to take their guns out during Katrina and had them confiscated at checkpoints.

 

[Coldroses]

Luckily, my family and I are blessed. We didn't get water in our home from Harvey or the tax day flood, though, it got close on the latter.

As far as protecting my firearms, my family and collection are both small enough that I feel I could load both in the SUV and flee. I feel I could do that without taking too much room for other supplies/items, and not hinder my family. If that isn't an option, the only thing to do is find the highest ground. For me that's the attic. The guns would be bagged, put in a far corner, and covered with typical attic stuff. Then pray for the best.

By the way, between housing strangers, gutting homes, and being unable to work, this forum gave semblance of normalcy. I was able to talk guns, and occupy my mind. I got solid advice on a hunting rifle in the process. Thanks to everyone for that.

 

[tarosean]

Having lived through many of these events. I was actually on the other side of the world while my family went through Harvey and couldn't get home till this past Friday.
My guns were the last thing on my mind. Too many other things are more important.
That said, the only time guns have crossed my mind was during Hurricane Ike and I contemplated poaching a deer. As we were without power, etc. for 2wks+.

 

[Coldroses]

And ain't nobody got time for chipping concrete, digging a hole (in your homes foundation no less) pooring concrete back, letting it cure, THEN getting your family to safety.

 

[Hokkmike]

This is one are where I am very much at ease living on top of a high ridge in the mountains as I do. A forest fire could be another problem.

 

[hdwhit]

wally wrote:
What did you do, or would you do with your guns in a flood?

It would depend on:

• Where I was,
  
• The cause of the flood,
  
• Whether I had any warning,
  
• Whether evacuation by vehicle was possible, and
• Expected duration of the floodwaters.

Priority has to go to those things my family would need to survive in an evacuation and rebuild after the event. This means as we think about what goes in the back of the SUV, priority goes to things like the "Go Bags", Medications, Important Papers, and the File Server Hard Drives.

The guns come way down the priority line-up because all of my guns are insured and ultimately replaceable although I might suffer the loss of some sentimental value.

If it is a case of an upstream dam breaking, there would be essentially no warning and no viable evacuation route, so assuming the house isn't washed away, climbing up on top of the garage roof and hoping for the best is about all that could be done.

If the weather service issues an advisory of rainfall leading to flooding 48 hours in advance, then the guns - along with all the other stuff I already mentioned - are going with me to a hotel in another city so I don't have to worry about any emergency preparations for the guns.

Everything else is going to be somewhere in between those two extremes.

 

[hdwhit]

grampjack wrote:
...power saw and open up a freaking cavity, drop them down there hung on wire, and cover them up with insulation. Your house is going to get totaled anyways,

So, you're going to do this as flood waters are rising around your ankles? How long do you think you're going to have from the time of the evacuation warning until there's no longer an open escape route for you to make all these "home improvements"?

But assuming you have the time, you're going to take the guns and put them in the outer walls of the house that are going to be the first things swept away by the flood waters?

And even if the walls aren't swept away, a gun hung down lengthwise inside the wall cavity on a length of wire is probably going to end up being immersed in the floodwaters anyway, unless the water is only a couple of inches deep in which case you would have been better to have left them in the safe.

[/QUOTE]
Obviously you would want to be judicious about where you did it, and how much board you removed from one wall, but as long as you were careful you would maintain the structural integrity.
[/QUOTE]

Cut out the top plate of even a single 16 inch wide bay and all that is left is a pair of eight foot (or longer) upright sticks cantilevered off a 2x4 (or 2x6) at the floor. That has nothing that could be called "structural integrity" and once it collapses, the unsupported adjacent quadrilateral framing will fall like dominoes.

 

[wally]

Lets be clear here I'm talking about rising water floods like in the Houston area where the structural integrity of the structure is not generally an issue after the waters recede. Not storm surge or wall of water floods like mountain valleys, or tsunamis, or cat 4 eye wall catastrophic winds that turn structures into slabs where your only viable option is to not be there.

Even along the rivers and where the reservoirs are overflowing here, the currents are not wash house away strong -- people and cars for sure! I have friends who live on the San Jac river, they love it. I asked why they have two very large garage doors on either side of the garage -- its so they can open them and let the river flow through! They were fine during the 1994 flood, this one is worse, I've heard they were OK and perhaps evacuated.

 

[Coldroses]

I assume, that nobody would try to protect their guns at the expense of their family. However, for me, my firearms are my only family heirlooms. That priority is at the top of "material things," but so far below my people and animals, that they don't even count. It's just stuff.

 

[ColtPythonElite]

I would caulk the door seams shut and pull off the handle and electric lock and caulk the openings. Then I would cover the caulked areas with Eternabond tape.

 

[grampajack]

So, you're going to do this as flood waters are rising around your ankles? How long do you think you're going to have from the time of the evacuation warning until there's no longer an open escape route for you to make all these "home improvements"?

But assuming you have the time, you're going to take the guns and put them in the outer walls of the house that are going to be the first things swept away by the flood waters?

And even if the walls aren't swept away, a gun hung down lengthwise inside the wall cavity on a length of wire is probably going to end up being immersed in the floodwaters anyway, unless the water is only a couple of inches deep in which case you would have been better to have left them in the safe.

Obviously you would want to be judicious about where you did it, and how much board you removed from one wall, but as long as you were careful you would maintain the structural integrity.
[/QUOTE]

Cut out the top plate of even a single 16 inch wide bay and all that is left is a pair of eight foot (or longer) upright sticks cantilevered off a 2x4 (or 2x6) at the floor. That has nothing that could be called "structural integrity" and once it collapses, the unsupported adjacent quadrilateral framing will fall like dominoes.[/QUOTE]

Why the exterior walls? Why not a interior walls that aren't load bearing? And no, this would be something to do the day before the storm hits, not as the floodwaters are rising. Those people had about three days warning.

Oh, and apparently you didn't read the part about sealing them in mylar bags.

And ain't nobody got time for chipping concrete, digging a hole (in your homes foundation no less) pooring concrete back, letting it cure, THEN getting your family to safety.

I could do it in 12 hours, and that's assuming I had to drive to home depot to get the concrete. I guess if the tool rental place was closed then you would be screwed, but I'm pretty sure they're open weekends.

 

[Wisco]

I'd lock things up as much as possible, put one or two valuable and sentimental rifles in pelican cases to leave in the house, then grab my carry piece and spare mags, all the cash on hand in my safe, my go bag, and maybe one AR and a mag or two and I'd leave. You don't want to be a vagabond with a truck, trunk or trailer full of valuables while you live in motels or with family elsewhere.

I'd rather claim the insurance on most things than spend the time and money I won't get back on saving them - the insurance company isn't going to pay me for my efforts to save stuff... Same with extra vehicles - let them swim and claim them.

 

[CapnMac]

Well, having spent some time reviewing the after math of Ike and similar situations, the best idea is to decide what one or two (you really can't rider herd on more than that while managing famly, heirlooms, etc) in hard cases. Put the rest in trashbags after greasing heavily, then seal in with duct tape, then Return Them To The Safe. I'd probably tape the door seams while I was at it, too,

Flood water will find all the weak points in the safe (the floor bolt holes for one; the cord aperture for lighting/dehumidifier otherwise), so the interior of your safe might get totaled. But, even with 12" of fine silt in the bottom, it's still a better, more secure, location for your valuables than interior partitions in your house, which might have floated off its foundations or taken other damage (garage walls often take damage when vehicles float during a flood). If you have an RSC with gypsom board inside for fire protection, it will be totally toast after flooding.

The carpet/fabric inside the safe, and the particle board shelving will be toast. Remember flood waters are often not the cleanest of water. Flood water in you garage is going to collect gasoline and oils and the like, and what's coming out of your neighbor's house will be as bad. So, even if you have separate insurance for your guns, having flood coverage for your safe is not a terrible idea.

Reloaders probably can get by, by putting primers & powder in trashbags, and hanging those as high as possible in the attic. You will not have enough time to protect cardboard boxed ammo; ammo in metal GI cans will probably be ok. Range bags, cases hard and soft, and the like ought to be ok in the attic

Another note, if you are being evacuated, you generally cannot bring arms with you into shelters, particularly Red Cross ones. You might be ok with church or civic organization shelters.

Another note--if you have this level of time to plan and act--trashbags are the best way to pack clothes and the like (double bag things like photo albums & paper records) as they will sort of float, and can be "mushed" in rescue boats and trucks. Oh, if you can, move the desktop and the laptops up in the attic, trash bag if possible.

 

[CapnMac]

What the Gunny says above is true.
Good friend of mine, who was in the San Jacinto watershed near the Woodlands during Allison ('89).
They only knew about the flooding they had when one of the kids asked if they could "go play in the water." Said water being up to the front stoop. After getting minimal things together--about 30-40 minutes--the plan to put everything in the SUV was thwarted by the water being already up to the door sills. So, everything was taken outside in the rain and put in the boat, which was cast off it's trailer and floated free. After dropping off the family at the shelter, he then spent the next 30-35 hours performing water rescues.

 

[berettaprofessor]

GunnyUSMC, mine wouldn't look like that....I keep them in BoreStores and socks, even in the safe. But then, truly, I see a lot of shooters in that pile that I wouldn't care if they got dinged up. Nice Milsurp group BTW.

 

[John Joseph]

Hmmmm. Safe is good.
Handguns and any long arm that can be broken down could go in a large suitcase, then in a large plastic garbage bag put up in the attic.
Especially if your going to be staying in a shelter

 

[GunnyUSMC]

I cleaned guns for friends for three months. Some had been under water for three or four days.
I know a lot of people that lost ammo that was stored in plastic ammo cans. They don't do good under water. Military ammo cans with good seals are the only one that survived.
I never got all my guns in the attic, and I didn't get a pic of the rest of the guns in the attic.

 

[BSA1]

Ditto on G.I. Surplus ammo cans working great for waterproof storage of handguns. They are easy move abet a bit heavy carrying up stairs. While I would prefer to move the cans to a dry spot if they have good rubber seals I would not stress about them been underwater.

I keep mostly ammo in my cans but I would dump the ammo and save the guns. Commercial ammo is waterproofed at least for a while.

 

[mjsdwash]

Obviously you would want to be judicious about where you did it, and how much board you removed from one wall, but as long as you were careful you would maintain the structural integrity.

Cut out the top plate of even a single 16 inch wide bay and all that is left is a pair of eight foot (or longer) upright sticks cantilevered off a 2x4 (or 2x6) at the floor. That has nothing that could be called "structural integrity" and once it collapses, the unsupported adjacent quadrilateral framing will fall like dominoes.[/QUOTE]

Why the exterior walls? Why not a interior walls that aren't load bearing? And no, this would be something to do the day before the storm hits, not as the floodwaters are rising. Those people had about three days warning.

Oh, and apparently you didn't read the part about sealing them in mylar bags.



I could do it in 12 hours, and that's assuming I had to drive to home depot to get the concrete. I guess if the tool rental place was closed then you would be screwed, but I'm pretty sure they're open weekends.[/QUOTE]



while I think this was a thought exercise, A 5 gallon bucket of hydro cement, a sledge chisel, a big hammer, and a friend, I think this could realistically be done in 3-4 hours, assuming a real panic mindset, with no power tools,

 

[748]

Report to the insurance that all were lost, completely washed away, not a trace left.